From Thaiboysexpress at AOL.COM Sun Mar 1 05:43:52 2009 From: Thaiboysexpress at AOL.COM (Martin Hutchby) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 05:43:52 EST Subject: Gun-slung-it Message-ID: Steve - they were OK. Al had a throat infection which held him up a bit, but to be honest without the refinements of the studio, they sounded a bit too much like a motorhead tribute band. Not helped in all honesty by good ol pub acoustics and soundman. Willing myself to come out blown away, but sadly not. Hopefully your experience will be better. I am all too familiar with the slog of small band/pub-band life which makes it all the more poignant to see him like that. Martin From jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM Sun Mar 1 05:56:03 2009 From: jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM (Jerry Kranitz) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 05:56:03 -0500 Subject: Aural Innovations Radio: New Space Rock Show: FLOORIAN Special Message-ID: http://Aural-Innovations.com FEBRUARY 29, 2009: NEW RADIO SHOW: FLOORIAN NEW CD RELEASE SPECIAL I've uploaded a new show from Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio (show #212). See the playlist below. Aural Innovations broadcasts 24 hours a day in both streaming and download editions. You can go directly to the Radio shows page at: http://aural-innovations.com/radio/radio.html Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio (show #212) FLOORIAN NEW CD RELEASE SPECIAL Floorian are based in Columbus, Ohio and their new CD, titled More Fiend, will be released on March 10th. I've been following these guys for several years and they're a band that Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio listeners are sure to enjoy. The show will be a mixture of Floorian songs, in studio chat with band members Todd Fisher and John Godshalk, and music by various other bands that Todd and John chose. Visit the Floorian web site at http://www.floorian.com Visit the Floorian Myspace site at http://www.myspace.com/floorian Floorian - "The Lower Room" (from More Fiend) Floorian - "Symptoms Alone" (from What the Buzzing - Bomp Records) The Bevis Frond - "White Sun" (from New River Head) The Brian Jonestown Massacre - "Down" (from Thank God For Mental Illness) Spacemen 3 - "When Tomorrow Hits" (from Recurring (UK version) Floorian - "Siafu" (from Columbus Alive: No Token Needed Volume 3) The Mock Turtles - "No Good Trying" (from Beyond The Wildwood - A Tribute to Syd Barrett) Plasticland - "Gloria Night" (from Wonder Wonderful Wonderland) Quad - "Projection" (from Quad) Floorian - "How Far, How Fast" (from More Fiend) King Missile - "Open" (from Mystical Shit & Fluting On The Hump) The Volta Sound - "Henri Chinaski" (from Fast Light With Radio Signal) Thin White Rope - "" (from Sack Full Of Silver) Floorian - "Overruled" (from What the Buzzing - Bomp Records) Dukes of Stratosphere - "Your Gold Dress" (from Chips From The Chocolate Fireball) White Noise - "Love Without Sound" (from An Electric Storm) Paik - "Purple" (from The Orson Fader) Floorian - "Lenka" (from What the Buzzing - Drigh Records) Espers - "Riding" (from Espers) Joy Division - "Day Of The Lords" (from Uknown Pleasures) Floorian - "Edenic" (from More Fiend) Floorian - "Auravine" (from What the Buzzing - Bomp Records) Guided By Voices - "Weed King" (from Vampire On Titus / Propeller) Tanakh - "Stereognosis" (from Villa Claustrophobia) Floorian - "Vegetable Man" (from The Vegetable Man Project Volume 3) http://Aural-Innovations.com From sloterdijk at MSN.COM Sun Mar 1 13:49:23 2009 From: sloterdijk at MSN.COM (Burro Mike) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 18:49:23 +0000 Subject: OFF: Mike Burro & Friends 2/28: recap & songlist Message-ID: Greetings friends, well, we had to carry on without a drummer or second guitarist, so it was certainly different than originally planned, but Jeff and I rose to the occasion, and played a nice set as a duo...Cheers! Mike Hamilton, Lanes, Hamilton, New Jersey 2/28/2009 lineup: Mike Burro: electric guitar/vocals Jeff Berry: bass/ backing vocals songlist: Down the Dustpipe Waiting for the Man> Ejection You shook Me Season of the Witch The Red Rooster The Wizard Hurry On Sundown Uranium Zone Next gig is March 13th. I personally hand picked the support acts, so I urge you to check them out. Ghettonsongbird is a powerful band, fronted by a dynamic female singer/guitarist. Selecta Jerry, is the co-host of a great area reggae/dub show called 'Sound of the Caribbean'. I can personally attest that his 'dub zone' sets have taken me way out.....You WILL feel Irie!! Here is info about the show and links to each artists website. Hamilton Lanes 1200 Kuser Rd Hamilton, NJ 08619 ( 609 ) 585-2400 www.myspace.com/hamiltonlanes March 13th at Hamilton Lanes 9 PM entry 18+ $7.00 cover at the door Selecta Jerry from 'Sounds of the Caribbean' www.myspace.com/selectajerry Ghettosongbird www.myspace.com/ghettosongbirdjukebox Mike Burro & Friends http://www.myspace.com/sloterdijk1 _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live?: Life without walls. http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_allup_1a_explore_032009 From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Sun Mar 1 18:43:04 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 23:43:04 +0000 Subject: Hawkwind next CD In-Reply-To: <17d80c610902091355p40848ce9xf4d21df7e158a6e8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, Feb 09, 2009 at 03:55:08PM -0600, mike coleman typed out: > I never understaood complaints about Distant Horizons (me now rambling, > nothing to do with your posts) > I think just "Wheels" makes it a certified masterpiece worthy of silver and > gold awards as well as a 180 gm vinyl press > and "Phetamine Street" > geez what a treasure chest...... I realise that this is akin to posting about _Club Ninja_ on the B?C side of the list, but yes, I'm rather fond of DH. That said, if it's going to get a makeover from the Cherry Red reissue process then I'd happily replace my original one; at best one would have to admit it's a diamond in the rough. I prefer the _Hawkwind 1997_ version of `Wheels' however, partly because it loses Dave's mawkish environmentalist platitudes (he is right! but gods he sounds like a lost hippy) and otherwise because it's one of the very few places where Captain Rizz actually contributed something. As Jon Browne (hey, remember him?) said when it came out, that "Fleeee Babylon!" howl really works well there. And I loved `Reptoid Vision' when it was new, but that was before I realised quite how long Ron would be using the same words... Ah dear, those were the days. Ron seemed unstoppable and Hawkwind was all guitars and attitude. Also, quite often, chaos and equipment breakdowns, but who cares to remember those? etc. Yours, Jon ObCD: Alan Davey - _Human on the Outside_ -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Sun Mar 1 19:23:54 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 18:23:54 -0600 Subject: Hawkwind next CD In-Reply-To: <20090301234304.GE13296@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: > > And I loved `Reptoid Vision' when it was new, but that was before I > realised quite how long Ron would be using the same words (JJ above) yes I mistakenly left that one off I think it peaks on Bajina, when we're involving little kids the remastered stuff is absolutely great, the sound improvements make a big difference IMHO never heard "Trans Dimensional Man" till now really.... From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Sun Mar 1 19:34:10 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 19:34:10 -0500 Subject: Gun-slung-it In-Reply-To: <246893C6-B75F-4CFA-A945-36AD7F6D0491@aol.com> Message-ID: Having been on Hawkwind tour I really know what you mean. Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Iain Ferguson Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 9:05 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: Gun-slung-it Wholehearted agree, I play in a pub & club band, we pedal 60's garage punk and r&b, we don't do it for the money, we do it cos we can all play bloody well and we just love playing live, and to keep this music alive, We restrict ourselves to about 24 / 30 gigs a year, playing round the south west. We played Bristol last night to about 50 people and tonight in Frome to about the same. We all played in serious bands at one time or another, and for whatever reasons we jacked it in, and now its brilliant cos you are playing exactly what you want, the pressure is off. However, if you were in a band you seriously want to do business, its a real nasty bottom of the stomach feeling when you realise that you are playing to a handful of people, especially when you have to look at the costs of transport, keeping the gear in working order, and if if your salary, it really hurts. been there a wore the t-shirt in the last ressession, I don't envy those boys at all at this time, Its hard.... Iain On 28 Feb 2009, at 22:30, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > > An addendum to my last post. > If it was me, the musician who joined a big name band, which turned > out > great for a good number of years, but turned sour after a number of > others. > I stuck with it, but it came to a point where I thought f*** this, > I'll do > what I want to do, even if it means playing in front of 20 people. > I hope those 20 people crawled out thinking "shit, they were good" > If that was the case, job done. > > Steve. > > > In a message dated 28/02/2009 20:23:04 GMT Standard Time, > Thaiboysexpress at AOL.COM writes: > > Had the none too pleasant spectacle of watching Alan Daveys > Gunslinger play > > to about 20 people in a less than salubrious pub in the midlands > last night. > We did wonder if he looks out from the stage and quietly thinks > "Ooops". From CWarburton at UBMAVIATION.COM Mon Mar 2 06:07:23 2009 From: CWarburton at UBMAVIATION.COM (Chris Warburton) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 11:07:23 -0000 Subject: lost johnny In-Reply-To: A Message-ID: Would it be too much of a clich? at this point to say "Who watches the Watchmen?" Yes folx, I AM still around... Chris Warburton Senior Database Administrator Tel: + 44 (0)1582 695463 P Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On Behalf Of Paul Mather Sent: 28 February 2009 15:28 To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: lost johnny On 28 Feb 2009, at 5:27 AM, Steve Pond wrote: > Speaking of which.. did you notice they passed a "law" this week > making it illegal for -anyone- to photograph a Policeman. I have a cousin who is a police sergeant. Does this new law mean that when I take family snaps in the future I'll have to ask him to step outside the frame so as not to put me in legal jeopardy? I always knew "the law is an ass," but do they have to make it so obvious with laws like this? Cheers, Paul. e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." --- Frank Vincent Zappa This e-mail is intended for the named recipient(s). It and any attachments may contain privileged and/or confidential information. They may not be disclosed to or used by or copied in any way by anyone other than the intended recipient. If you are not one of the intended recipients, or this email is received in error, please immediately either notify the sender or contact OAG Worldwide Limited on +44 (0) 1582 600111 quoting the name of the sender and the email address to which it has been sent and then delete it and any attachment(s). While all reasonable efforts are made to safeguard inbound and outbound e-mails, OAG Worldwide Limited and its affiliate companies cannot guarantee that attachments are virus-free or are compatible with your systems, and does not accept liability in respect of viruses or computer problems experienced. Neither OAG Worldwide Limited nor the sender accepts any responsibility for viruses and it is your responsibility to scan or otherwise check this email and any attachments. OAG Worldwide Limited may monitor or record outgoing and incoming e-mail to secure effective system operation and for other lawful purposes. By replying to this email you give your consent to such monitoring. Thank you. OAG Worldwide Limited is a company registered in England and Wales (registered number 4226716), with its registered office at Ludgate House, 245 Blackfriars Road, London, SE1 9UY, United Kingdom, and with its principle place of business at Church Street, Dunstable, Bedfordshire, LU5 4HB, UK. OAG is a subsidiary of United Business Media Limited (http://www.unitedbusinessmedia.com/) of London. From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Mon Mar 2 08:02:29 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 08:02:29 -0500 Subject: Reading 92 SBD vs Official AUD Message-ID: Ian,Your partially right about the Flicknife and weird tapes. Those were bad enough for RCA ,but at least the sound quality was good .But I am not referring to that alone as the reason for RCA letting them go . I am specifically referring to the numerous rehashes of the crummy audience tapes of Text of Festival , Text of festival and the 3 Acid daze LPs .On vinyl at the time of the RCA contract there was for example ,Welcome to the Future ,In the Beginning ,Text of Festival ,Yuri Gargarian, Live 1970-1973 ,Early Daze,The Collection, the 3 Acid Daze Lps, the 3 Anthology LP's, British Tribal Music,Utopia 84, 3 Lp Acid Daze boxset ,etc. These were all the same 3 above crummy sounding audience tapes rehashed over and over . My local record stores actually at the time ,stopped carrying Hawkwind without you specifically ordering it because so many people bought these and returned them thinking there was something wrong with them . And the above doesn't even include Space Ritual 2 ,which although it has great sound ,was also rehashed into numerous vinyl like the different "Ridicule" LP's also. It led at the time to a big drop off in their fan base . I knew a lot of fans at the time which bought these and weren't very happy . And when all these starting coming out,Hawkwind also started being harder to find in the stores because of this too . From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Mon Mar 2 08:18:55 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 08:18:55 -0500 Subject: HW: Reading 92 cd Message-ID: Well who should you blame but Dave? He signed with Voiceprint to release these . And your theory of he didn't know is flawed . Hes been around 40 years .He knows. And BEFORE the fallout with Voiceprint , for example , Live at Glastonbury 1990 was released. Ever heard that one? Or some of the other audience tapes put on cd by voiceprint BEFORE the Magma falling out? So the theory of its Voiceprints fault doesn't fly . From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Mon Mar 2 08:35:16 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 08:35:16 -0500 Subject: HW: Reading 92 cd Message-ID: Where's the consideration for the fans who spend their hard earned money on these crummy sounding things ? Nowhere is it noted that these are audience tapes. Dave just went for the money you say ? Moneys more important than fans? So you must believe that Dave Anderson is okay to release all the rehashes of those things he does too ? He does it for the money too. But what about all the fans who aren't rich who buy these . Over the years Hawkwind ,have lost a huge amount of fans sick of these crummy sounding releases over and over again. By Dave Anderson or others thats one thing,but by the band themselves? From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Mon Mar 2 08:54:45 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 08:54:45 -0500 Subject: Interview link with Knights of Space recall comments posted on bands website Message-ID: On Fri, 27 Feb 2009 23:06:40 -0600, mike coleman wrote: >On 2/27/09, Lost Johnny wrote: >> >> Whats OCD ? >> > >Hey Larry it's what I have with album covers like I was telling you....when >it got to correcting single dots with syringes and such >I'd put myself up against anyone though, just need someone else to tell me >when the ribbons mine.... >Obsessive Compulsive Disorder >watch out for Mike and I mean that. He's good people. Also good highly >dangerous people Mike ,there are people who actually restore record jackets and related things for a living. That could be you. From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Mon Mar 2 09:25:06 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 09:25:06 -0500 Subject: Gun-slung-it Message-ID: On Sun, 1 Mar 2009 19:34:10 -0500, mary wrote: >Having been on Hawkwind tour I really know what you mean. >Mary >-----Original Message----- >From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List >[mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Iain Ferguson >Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 9:05 PM >To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET >Subject: Re: Gun-slung-it > > >Wholehearted agree, > >I play in a pub & club band, we pedal 60's garage punk and r&b, we >don't do it for the money, we do it cos we can all play bloody well >and we just love playing live, and to keep this music alive, >We restrict ourselves to about 24 / 30 gigs a year, playing round the >south west. We played Bristol last night to about 50 people and >>case, job done. >> >> Steve. >> >> >> In a message dated 28/02/2009 20:23:04 GMT Standard Time, >> Thaiboysexpress at AOL.COM writes: >> >> Had the none too pleasant spectacle of watching Alan Daveys >> Gunslinger play >> >> to about 20 people in a less than salubrious pub in the midlands >> last night. >> We did wonder if he looks out from the stage and quietly thinks >> "Ooops". >> >> >> None of the bands ,Spaceritual ,Hawkwind ,Alan Davey ,are exactly drawing "great" crowds live . They all play small venues with small crowds. A big part of that is the money problems from the economy ,and especially no major record labels to fund publicity and promote and pay for tours .But also the fact that in the UK ,Nik's Spaceritual crowd won't go see Dave's Hawkwind and Dave's Hawkwind crowd won't go see Nik's Spaceritual . And Dave's Hawkwind fans won't go see Alan's Gunslinger and Alan's fans won't go Dave's Hawkwind . And that thinking hurts all three bands big time in ticket and record sales and money coming in . Come anywhere around Chicago ,and I'll go see all three . From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Mon Mar 2 09:40:49 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 09:40:49 -0500 Subject: hawkwind .com website off line? Message-ID: Is the Hawkwind.com website gone of the air for some reason ? I'm talking about the band run official one . Something about Lycos ceasing all activity comes up at the address. From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Mon Mar 2 09:52:23 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 09:52:23 -0500 Subject: Hearing Aid Test... Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Feb 2009 15:47:50 EST, StevePXR5 at AOL.COM wrote: >Passed. >Just listened to the track from "Strange Trips and Pipe Dreams". >The left, the right and the middle all function. >I had to play it loud though to drown out the tinnitus. > >Steve. > > >Maybe your hearing is okay then. " Strange Trips and Pipe Dreams" does indeed >have a lot of electronic sounds that are actually kind of like on a real hearing test. From colinjallen at YAHOO.CO.UK Mon Mar 2 09:55:51 2009 From: colinjallen at YAHOO.CO.UK (Colin Allen) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 14:55:51 +0000 Subject: hawkwind .com website off line? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Lycos have pulled out of a lot of hosting activity. --- On Mon, 2/3/09, Lost Johnny wrote: From: Lost Johnny Subject: hawkwind .com website off line? To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Date: Monday, 2 March, 2009, 2:40 PM Is the Hawkwind.com website gone of the air for some reason ? I'm talking about the band run official one . Something about Lycos ceasing all activity comes up at the address. From CWarburton at UBMAVIATION.COM Mon Mar 2 10:13:07 2009 From: CWarburton at UBMAVIATION.COM (Chris Warburton) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 15:13:07 -0000 Subject: hawkwind .com website off line? In-Reply-To: A<852220.84024.qm@web23201.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: More than just hosting - the webmail/dating/chat stuff has all gone too. I had an email from them saying that my eamil account would cease wef 15th Feb. Don't know if Tripod's going too... Looks like the US end may still be functional Chris Warburton Senior Database Administrator Tel: + 44 (0)1582 695463 P Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On Behalf Of Colin Allen Sent: 02 March 2009 14:56 To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: hawkwind .com website off line? Lycos have pulled out of a lot of hosting activity. --- On Mon, 2/3/09, Lost Johnny wrote: From: Lost Johnny Subject: hawkwind .com website off line? To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Date: Monday, 2 March, 2009, 2:40 PM Is the Hawkwind.com website gone of the air for some reason ? I'm talking about the band run official one . Something about Lycos ceasing all activity comes up at the address. This e-mail is intended for the named recipient(s). It and any attachments may contain privileged and/or confidential information. They may not be disclosed to or used by or copied in any way by anyone other than the intended recipient. If you are not one of the intended recipients, or this email is received in error, please immediately either notify the sender or contact OAG Worldwide Limited on +44 (0) 1582 600111 quoting the name of the sender and the email address to which it has been sent and then delete it and any attachment(s). While all reasonable efforts are made to safeguard inbound and outbound e-mails, OAG Worldwide Limited and its affiliate companies cannot guarantee that attachments are virus-free or are compatible with your systems, and does not accept liability in respect of viruses or computer problems experienced. Neither OAG Worldwide Limited nor the sender accepts any responsibility for viruses and it is your responsibility to scan or otherwise check this email and any attachments. OAG Worldwide Limited may monitor or record outgoing and incoming e-mail to secure effective system operation and for other lawful purposes. By replying to this email you give your consent to such monitoring. Thank you. OAG Worldwide Limited is a company registered in England and Wales (registered number 4226716), with its registered office at Ludgate House, 245 Blackfriars Road, London, SE1 9UY, United Kingdom, and with its principle place of business at Church Street, Dunstable, Bedfordshire, LU5 4HB, UK. OAG is a subsidiary of United Business Media Limited (http://www.unitedbusinessmedia.com/) of London. From e_clout at HOTMAIL.COM Mon Mar 2 10:17:15 2009 From: e_clout at HOTMAIL.COM (Edmund Clout) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 15:17:15 +0000 Subject: HW: Reading 92 cd In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Well who should you blame but Dave? He signed with Voiceprint to release > these . And your theory of he didn't know is flawed . Hes been around 40 > years .He knows. And BEFORE the fallout with Voiceprint , for example , Live > at Glastonbury 1990 was released. Ever heard that one? Or some of the other > audience tapes put on cd by voiceprint BEFORE the Magma falling out? So the > theory of its Voiceprints fault doesn't fly . I did say I was speculating. I haven't heard the glastonbury 1990 CD, but that doesn't preclude my theory yet though, its not mutually exclusive with Dave allowing poorer quality releases too. Could I also point out that we've all got the message that you're REALLY PISSED that poor quality recordings are getting official releases, and how its particularly expensive in the US and that it damages the bands reputation, detracts from the excallent reissues, its been a problem repeatedly over the years, and that you're particularly annoyed that Dave B. now seems to be authorising such releases. Would you be so kind as to restrict yourself to new opinions now and save bandwidth, as it were? Thank you very much. Mundo _________________________________________________________________ All your Twitter and other social updates in one place http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/ From steve.bishop at DB.COM Mon Mar 2 10:23:05 2009 From: steve.bishop at DB.COM (Steve Bishop) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 15:23:05 +0000 Subject: HW: Reading 92 cd In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Would you be so kind as to restrict yourself to new opinions now and > save bandwidth, as it were? Thank you very much. Hear, hear !! BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List wrote on 02/03/2009 15:17:15: > > > > Well who should you blame but Dave? He signed with Voiceprint to release > > these . And your theory of he didn't know is flawed . Hes been around 40 > > years .He knows. And BEFORE the fallout with Voiceprint , for example , Live > > at Glastonbury 1990 was released. Ever heard that one? Or some of the other > > audience tapes put on cd by voiceprint BEFORE the Magma falling out? So the > > theory of its Voiceprints fault doesn't fly . > > > I did say I was speculating. I haven't heard the glastonbury 1990 > CD, but that doesn't preclude my theory yet though, its not mutually > exclusive with Dave allowing poorer quality releases too. > > > > Could I also point out that we've all got the message that you're > REALLY PISSED that poor quality recordings are getting official > releases, and how its particularly expensive in the US and that it > damages the bands reputation, detracts from the excallent reissues, > its been a problem repeatedly over the years, and that you're > particularly annoyed that Dave B. now seems to be authorising such releases. > > > > Would you be so kind as to restrict yourself to new opinions now and > save bandwidth, as it were? Thank you very much. > > > > Mundo > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > All your Twitter and other social updates in one place > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/ --- This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and delete this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. Please refer to http://www.db.com/en/content/eu_disclosures.htm for additional EU corporate and regulatory disclosures. From ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK Mon Mar 2 10:25:41 2009 From: ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Ian Abrahams) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 15:25:41 +0000 Subject: HW: Reading 92 cd Message-ID: What would be really nice is if all posters would also put their names to their postings... ________________________________ From: Steve Bishop To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Monday, March 2, 2009 3:23:05 PM Subject: Re: HW: Reading 92 cd > Would you be so kind as to restrict yourself to new opinions now and > save bandwidth, as it were? Thank you very much. Hear, hear !! From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Mon Mar 2 10:49:35 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 15:49:35 GMT Subject: hawkwind .com website off line? In-Reply-To: Lost Johnny's message of Mon, 2 Mar 2009 09:40:49 -0500 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From akomins at UCHICAGO.EDU Mon Mar 2 10:57:53 2009 From: akomins at UCHICAGO.EDU (Arin Komins) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 09:57:53 -0600 Subject: hawkwind .com website off line? In-Reply-To: <200903021549.n22FnZa8005441@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: On Mon, 2 Mar 2009, M Holmes wrote: :Oh aardvarks! : :Did anyone copy off the tour dates/venues/tickets info? I still have :some to buy... Mike, I think the tour dates are still listed up on the myspace page (http://www.myspace.com/hawkwindofficial). I checked the wayback machine, but the last update they have for hawkwind.com is feb '08. Arin -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Arin Komins akomins at uchicago.edu Assistant Director - Solutions Architecture University of Chicago/NSIT/RP&A tel: (773)834-4087 1155 E. 60th St. #428, Chicago, IL 60637 fax: (773)702-6090 ------------------------------------------------------------------ From stevefreight at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 2 11:53:24 2009 From: stevefreight at GMAIL.COM (Steve Freight) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 16:53:24 +0000 Subject: hawkwind .com website off line? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The website did have a note over the weekend saying it would probably disappear as the company who was hosting had gone bust (or something) for a while and to use Myspace which they will keep up to date. Steve On 3/2/09, Lost Johnny wrote: > > Is the Hawkwind.com website gone of the air for some reason ? I'm talking > about the band run official one . Something about Lycos ceasing all > activity > comes up at the address. > -- View Steve's Photos of Hawkwind Porcupine Tree and Isle of Wight http://www.flickr.com/photos/venthawktree From ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK Mon Mar 2 12:39:17 2009 From: ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Ian Abrahams) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 17:39:17 +0000 Subject: hawkwind .com website off line? Message-ID: Hi all before any rumours or such like star Myspace blog posting: Hi all before any rumours or such like start to circulate the reason why the main Hawkwind web site is down is due to the previous provider - Lycos ceasing trading, presumably another casualty of the credit crunch. I am in the process of changing to a new provider and this should have been sorted by now as i started the switch over some weeks ago, however it would seem that due to general incompetence somewhere along the way they have not been able to move domains in time! for now the myspace page will be the place where any announcements are made and i would hope to have the site back up and running within the next 48hours or so. sorry for any inconvenience caused but no one is more frustrated than me at this situation. regards and please spread the word of this is? to anyone who may be interested. regards Dave (who runs the website and myspace etc....) ________________________________ From: Steve Freight To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Monday, March 2, 2009 4:53:24 PM Subject: Re: hawkwind .com website off line? The website did have a note over the weekend saying it would probably disappear as the company who was? hosting had gone bust (or something) for a while and to use Myspace which they will keep up to date. Steve On 3/2/09, Lost Johnny wrote: > > Is the Hawkwind.com website gone of the air for some reason ? I'm talking > about the band run official one . Something about Lycos ceasing all > activity > comes up at the address. > -- View Steve's Photos of Hawkwind Porcupine Tree and Isle of Wight http://www.flickr.com/photos/venthawktree From shll at HAGEDORN.DK Tue Mar 3 02:30:08 2009 From: shll at HAGEDORN.DK (SHLL (Scott Heller)) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 08:30:08 +0100 Subject: Hawklords gig Postponed til June 7th Message-ID: Press Release HAWKLORDS Roundhouse Show on March 8th POSTPONED UNTIL JUNE While cutting fire logs with a chain saw on Sunday, March 1st, Hawklords' Nik Turner - who is nearly 70 years of age and one of the founder members of Hawkwind - fell and injured his back, making it impossible for him to stand. Nik along with Martin Griffin, Ron Tree, Alan Davey, Steve Swindells, Jerry Richards, Adrian Shaw, Terry Ollis and Harvey Bainbridge, were supposed to be headlining the Roundhouse this coming Sunday March 8th as the 'Hawklords' in memory of the great graphic artist 'Barney Bubbles' who died 25 years ago. The Hawklords planned to perform an updated version of Hawkwind's classic 'Space Ritual' - originally designed and influenced by Barney, along with the late Robert Calvert, a one time member of both Hawkwind and the Hawklords. Because of Nik's injury the event has been moved to Sunday 7th June, and will be an all-standing show. Tickets bought for 8th March will be valid for the rescheduled date. Those customers who can't make the new date and require a refund should go to their point of purchase. SUNDAY IMPLOSION will now take place from 3pm to 11pm on JUNE 7TH, 2009 at THE ROUNDHOUSE Tickets: ?30 in advance (subject to booking fee) from: Box Office 0844 482 8008 http://www.roundhouse.org.uk, 0871 2200 260 http://www.seetickets.com, 020 7734 8932 / http://www.stargreen.com Spacehopper......Nik Moore on 020 8676 9540 / 07809 642044 http://www.myspace.com/hawklordsinmyspace http://www.hawklords.com Moore Publicity, 187 Mackenzie Road, Beckenham BR3 4SE www.moorepublicity.co.uk From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Tue Mar 3 11:18:34 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 08:18:34 -0800 Subject: Heavy metal band name flow chart Message-ID: http://flowingdata.com/2009/01/23/heavy-metal-band-names-flow-chart/ From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 3 11:32:30 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 10:32:30 -0600 Subject: HW, review made simple Message-ID: Wembley 73 CD=awesome lots of material not previously on Yuri Gagrin, improved sound worth money for booklet alone guaranteed to rattle your neigbors walls now why does the stupid version with the soviet cosmonaut exist??? the end ps-if you make excuses that this is another clone you are mentally retarded From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 3 12:06:41 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 11:06:41 -0600 Subject: Fwd: HW, review made simple In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903030832v791e11f2x79788c623cb32945@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: and I think I can answer my own question If you go over things with a fine-tooth comb, and end up preferring just the original YG tracks but improved, like somebody did on Steve Y's site then the Plastichead version's your baby I suppose but the added material is way cool...... Wembley 73 CD=awesome lots of material not previously on Yuri Gagrin, improved sound worth money for booklet alone guaranteed to rattle your neigbors walls now why does the stupid version with the soviet cosmonaut exist??? the end ps-if you make excuses that this is another clone you are mentally retarded From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 3 16:30:44 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 15:30:44 -0600 Subject: HW, review made simple In-Reply-To: <364481.14386.qm@web23008.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear Christian , please keep private laundry off the forum no big deal, but please do the money went in a flash on survival, no mom and dada, and no jobbie job job, instead a career battling humans in favor of other life forms the Plastichead CD was fine but this one's way better no back-to-back as I care less about having more OCD problems, but the end of down through the night would have had me sold alone and then there's the booming bass spurts that kick up an awful racket..... I realise I'm a couple years late, so if this has come up before SCUSE ME as can be found on Starfarer site, the CD insert makes use of the original SR tour program, as well as the Wembley program too..... a must for myself On 3/3/09, Amphetamine Embalmer wrote: > > > > Looks like that Wembley 73 CD goes on my wantlist then. :-) That Yuri > with the cosmonaut doesent seem improved in any way though. > > (I sent you one with a load of money remember?) > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* mike coleman > *To:* BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > *Sent:* Tuesday, 3 March, 2009 18:06:41 > *Subject:* Fwd: HW, review made simple > > and I think I can answer my own question > If you go over things with a fine-tooth comb, and end up preferring just > the > original YG tracks but improved, like somebody did on Steve Y's site then > the Plastichead version's your baby I suppose > but the added material is way cool...... > > > > Wembley 73 CD=awesome > lots of material not previously on Yuri Gagrin, improved sound > worth money for booklet alone > guaranteed to rattle your neigbors walls > now why does the stupid version with the soviet cosmonaut exist??? > the end > ps-if you make excuses that this is another clone you are mentally retarded > > > > > From superskrull666 at YAHOO.CO.UK Tue Mar 3 14:14:07 2009 From: superskrull666 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Amphetamine Embalmer) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 19:14:07 +0000 Subject: Fwd: HW, review made simple In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903030906u27438050y4b64afb841f553f5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Looks like that Wembley 73 CD goes on my wantlist then. :-) That Yuri with the cosmonaut doesent seem improved in any way though. (I sent you one with a load of money remember?) ________________________________ From: mike coleman To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Tuesday, 3 March, 2009 18:06:41 Subject: Fwd: HW, review made simple and I think I can answer my own question If you go over things with a fine-tooth comb, and end up preferring just the original YG tracks but improved, like somebody did on Steve Y's site then the Plastichead version's your baby I suppose but the added material is way cool...... Wembley 73 CD=awesome lots of material not previously on Yuri Gagrin, improved sound worth money for booklet alone guaranteed to rattle your neigbors walls now why does the stupid version with the soviet cosmonaut exist??? the end ps-if you make excuses that this is another clone you are mentally retarded From superskrull666 at YAHOO.CO.UK Tue Mar 3 14:17:35 2009 From: superskrull666 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Amphetamine Embalmer) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 19:17:35 +0000 Subject: Fwd: HW, review made simple In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903030906u27438050y4b64afb841f553f5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Mike, it Looks like i need that Wembley 73 thingy. Not enjoying the Yuri remaster? Understand. I even got the remastered/slipcased "Text" remaster which is only for the alien artwork. Otherwise it sucks totally. I assume you have been spending that cash on Atomhenge remasters. and I think I can answer my own question If you go over things with a fine-tooth comb, and end up preferring just the original YG tracks but improved, like somebody did on Steve Y's site then the Plastichead version's your baby I suppose but the added material is way cool...... Wembley 73 CD=awesome lots of material not previously on Yuri Gagrin, improved sound worth money for booklet alone guaranteed to rattle your neigbors walls now why does the stupid version with the soviet cosmonaut exist??? the end ps-if you make excuses that this is another clone you are mentally retarded From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 4 00:39:36 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 23:39:36 -0600 Subject: Fwd: HW, review made simple In-Reply-To: <117712.53393.qm@web23003.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 3/3/09, Amphetamine Embalmer wrote: > > Looks like that Wembley 73 CD goes on my wantlist then. :-) That Yuri with > the cosmonaut doesent seem improved in any way though. > > (I sent you one with a load of money remember?) Up awaiting the spontaneous human combustion radio programing.....and 1 genuine german Yes I am anxious to get that Norwegian bill out of my wallet Posting one last time to cop to the fact I'm insane and do not wish to cause people to be interested in something they won't like I don't think this one is any better than that one except for more material ,and people that have half-arse 70's live tapes my have better, don't know it's still Yuri, just more stuff, (from) likely enhanced audience source, but to me being close up on the handclaps and madness is a plus, NO DETRACTION From sloterdijk at MSN.COM Wed Mar 4 08:30:36 2009 From: sloterdijk at MSN.COM (Burro Mike) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 13:30:36 +0000 Subject: event details for 3/13 show w/ Selecta Jerry + Ghettosongbird Message-ID: March 13th at Hamilton Lanes Mike Burro & Friends Selecta Jerry from 'Sounds of the Caribbean' Ghettosongbird see event details at: http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/2114668/ Hamilton Lanes 1200 Kuser Rd Hamilton, NJ 08619 ( 609 ) 585-2400 www.myspace.com/hamiltonlanes March 13th at Hamilton Lanes 9 PM entry 18+ $7.00 cover at the door Selecta Jerry from 'Sounds of the Caribbean' www.myspace.com/selectajerry Ghettosongbird www.myspace.com/ghettosongbirdjukebox Mike Burro & Friends http://www.myspace.com/sloterdijk1 _________________________________________________________________ Express your personality in color! Preview and select themes for Hotmail?. http://www.windowslive-hotmail.com/LearnMore/personalize.aspx?ocid=TXT_MSGTX_WL_HM_express_032009#colortheme From superskrull666 at YAHOO.CO.UK Wed Mar 4 01:52:27 2009 From: superskrull666 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Amphetamine Embalmer) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 06:52:27 +0000 Subject: Fwd: HW, review made simple In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903032139n556bcddch858513395d19e63b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: be happy to know that bill is one third of a Here & Now LP from eBay. :-) hope the other 20 dollars went into your piggy bank......... C ________________________________ From: mike coleman To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Wednesday, 4 March, 2009 6:39:36 Subject: Re: Fwd: HW, review made simple On 3/3/09, Amphetamine Embalmer wrote: > > Looks like that Wembley 73 CD goes on my wantlist then. :-) That Yuri with > the cosmonaut doesent seem improved in any way though. > > (I sent you one with a load of money remember?) Up awaiting the spontaneous human combustion radio programing.....and 1 genuine german Yes I am anxious to get that Norwegian bill out of my wallet Posting one last time to cop to the fact I'm insane and do not wish to cause people to be interested in something they won't like I don't think this one is any better than that one except for more material ,and people that have half-arse 70's live tapes my have better, don't know it's still Yuri, just more stuff, (from) likely enhanced audience source, but to me being close up on the handclaps and madness is a plus, NO DETRACTION From jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM Thu Mar 5 05:13:31 2009 From: jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM (Jerry Kranitz) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 05:13:31 -0500 Subject: Aural Innovations Radio: New Space Does Not Care Show Message-ID: http://Aural-Innovations.com MARCH 5, 2009: NEW RADIO SHOW: SPACE DOES NOT CARE #12 I've uploaded a new show from Space Does Not Care (show #12). See the playlist below. Aural Innovations broadcasts 24 hours a day in both streaming and download editions. You can go directly to the Radio shows page at: http://aural-innovations.com/radio/radio.html Space Does Not Care (show #12) Chuck Rosenberg did a radio show dubbed "Space Does Not Care" from 1999-2003 at KUCR out of Riverside, CA, which streamed on-line for most of that time. The format of the new online version of Space Does Not Care is secured by Chuck under the umbrella of Psych/Space/Kraut/Electro/Indie/Folk/Noise-rock. ST 37 - "Acetone" (from I Love to Talk... - Emperor Jones Records) ST 37 - "Look at Yr Chair" (from Future Memories - 4/4) BRUCE HAACK - "Song of the Death Machine/Angel Child" (from Electric Lucifer - Omni) CENSUS OF HALLUCINATIONS - "Integration II" (from 9 Lives - Stone Premonitions) FAR FLUNG - "Like It Has Never Been" (from A Wound In Eternity - Meteor City) AGITATION FREE - "You Play For Us Today" (from Malesch - Revisited) COSMIC JOKERS - "Kinder des Alls" (from Galactic Supermarket - Spalax) GURU GURU - "Space Ship " (from Best Of - Cleopatra) ELECTRIC ORANGE - "Sweet Absurd" (from Cyberdelic - Delerium) MAGIC ARROWS - "1000 Dances" (from Sweet Heavenly Angel of Death - Wobblyhead) SPACEHEAD - "Space Junk " (from In Space We Trust '95-'98 - Dead Ernest) PUFF TUBE - "Quark, Strangeness & Charm" (from Assassins of Silence/100-Watt Violence - Ceres) HAWKLORDS - "Valium 10" (from Weird Tapes Vol. 2 - Voiceprint) PRESSUREHED - "Conscious Control" (from Sudden Vertigo - Cleopatra) SKY CRIES MARY - "Shipwrecked" (from This Timeless Turning - World Domination) AMORPHOUS ANDROGYNOUS - "The Witchfinder" (from Alice in Ultraland - Harvest) WINDY & CARL - "Preparation" (from Portal - Ba Da Bing!) FUXA - "Bowie Beat" (from Modified Mechanics of This Device - Mind Expansion) STEPHEN BRODSKY - "The Voice Electric" (from V/A You've Got Your Orders Vol. 2 - Chrome Peeler) PRIMORDIAL UNDERMIND - "Ten Toes, One Soul" (from Thin Shells of Revolution - Emperor Jones) GHOST - "Rakshu" (from ST'd - Drag City) http://Aural-Innovations.com From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 5 08:52:17 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 07:52:17 -0600 Subject: Fwd: HW, review made simple In-Reply-To: <606003.69354.qm@web23006.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 3/4/09, Amphetamine Embalmer wrote: > > be happy to know that bill is one third of a Here & Now LP from eBay. :-) > > hope the other 20 dollars went into your piggy bank......... > C > Christian, money for trading items is personal info......not of interest to others I finally, I mean _FINALLY_ got rid of that accursed kroner or whatever you call it yesterday by sending it to my sister for a McDonald's happy-meal, since your money is as good as useless here........ I have just been informed by the now conforming? Larry Urick that the Masters of Rock 2002 CD compilation includes unreleased versions of Love In Space, and Lighthouse so if you are on this forum, knew that, didn't report it, and he is correct, you are directed to wear women's panties for 1 week to avert a nasty hex From stevefreight at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 5 09:55:08 2009 From: stevefreight at GMAIL.COM (Steve Freight) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 14:55:08 +0000 Subject: Fwd: HW, review made simple In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903050552i74691774l31904bd38defdb89@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hey Mike, I'd like to wear them for longer! I nevr bought the CD but you shoudl be able to download the tracks (I did) but suggest you save your money as not really graet versions. Steve On 3/5/09, mike coleman wrote: Masters of Rock 2002 CD compilation includes unreleased versions of Love In Space, and Lighthouse so if you are on this forum, knew that, didn't report it, and he is correct, you are directed to wear women's panties for 1 week to avert a nasty hex -- View Steve's Photos of Hawkwind Porcupine Tree and Isle of Wight http://www.flickr.com/photos/venthawktree From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 5 10:06:00 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 09:06:00 -0600 Subject: Fwd: HW, review made simple In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 3/5/09, Steve Freight wrote: > > Hey Mike, > > I'd like to wear them for longer! > > I nevr bought the CD but you shoudl be able to download the tracks (I did) > but suggest you save your money as not really graet versions. > > Steve I never tried them myself but hmmmmm........don't get me started thinking about the more demented HW members or my friend Keely.....hahaha Thanks and regarding TOF being released in full CD format, I say "well they damn well better", it's not like I haven't already bought it more than once already!!! From visionaryhead at DORAMAIL.COM Thu Mar 5 18:55:33 2009 From: visionaryhead at DORAMAIL.COM (Visionary Head) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 07:55:33 +0800 Subject: *****SPAM***** Origin of "Where Are They Now"? Definitive answer needed! Message-ID: Spam detection software, running on the system "www.ispnetinc.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see The administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Somehow I'd missed this page on Adrians site - http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/hawkwind/disc_weird105.html and, quite coincidentally, I'd just been playing "Where Are They Now" [...] Content analysis details: (5.6 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 1.7 SARE_FREE_WEBM_Dora Sender used free email account - may be spammer 1.3 PLING_QUERY Subject has exclamation mark and question mark 2.5 DNS_FROM_RFC_DSN RBL: Envelope sender in dsn.rfc-ignorant.org 0.1 RDNS_NONE Delivered to trusted network by a host with no rDNS 0.0 DRUGS_ANXIETY Refers to an anxiety control drug -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: "Visionary Head" Subject: Origin of "Where Are They Now"? Definitive answer needed! Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 07:55:33 +0800 Size: 2494 URL: From visionaryhead at DORAMAIL.COM Thu Mar 5 19:02:15 2009 From: visionaryhead at DORAMAIL.COM (Visionary Head) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 08:02:15 +0800 Subject: *****SPAM***** Origin of "Where Are They Now"? Definitive answer needed Message-ID: Spam detection software, running on the system "www.ispnetinc.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see The administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Somehow I'd missed this page on Adrians site - http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/hawkwind/disc_weird105.html and, quite coincidentally, I'd just been playing "Where Are They Now" [...] Content analysis details: (9.3 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 2.5 DNS_FROM_RFC_DSN RBL: Envelope sender in dsn.rfc-ignorant.org 1.7 SARE_FREE_WEBM_Dora Sender used free email account - may be spammer 1.9 FRT_VALIUM2 BODY: ReplaceTags: Valium (2) 3.0 FRT_VALIUM1 BODY: ReplaceTags: Valium 0.0 FUZZY_VLIUM BODY: Attempt to obfuscate words in spam 0.1 RDNS_NONE Delivered to trusted network by a host with no rDNS -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: "Visionary Head" Subject: Origin of "Where Are They Now"? Definitive answer needed Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 08:02:15 +0800 Size: 2558 URL: From visionaryhead at DORAMAIL.COM Thu Mar 5 19:04:06 2009 From: visionaryhead at DORAMAIL.COM (Visionary Head) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 08:04:06 +0800 Subject: ok, I admit defeat Message-ID: sorry about that. I give up... -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://mail.doramail.com Powered by Outblaze From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Fri Mar 6 06:35:23 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 11:35:23 GMT Subject: *****SPAM***** Origin of "Where Are They Now"? Definitive answer needed! In-Reply-To: Visionary Head's message of Fri, 6 Mar 2009 07:55:33 +0800 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Fri Mar 6 11:41:33 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 16:41:33 +0000 Subject: Hawkwind next CD In-Reply-To: <126A561607A76D4B90A6B67641C593E922B4916E24@exdkmbx005.corp.novocorp.net> Message-ID: On Sat, Feb 07, 2009 at 12:49:47PM +0100, SHLL (Scott Heller) typed out: > I was wondering what people think, if Hawkwind will ever make another > really great record? Do you think Dave has it in him and the right > peolple surrounding him? While, I can enjoy the stuff on the last > studio record, it is far from being in their top 20 records. I just > wonder if they will ever make another really good one. It certainly > does not help when the band probably only gets together for these > small tours and lives all over england and one in France. I would love > them to as I really like dave's voice and he is a great guitar player. I think that they possibly could have made a great record in 2001. With Simon on board, the last gasps of the Death Generator concept maybe and some general conceptual glue from a briefly friendly Moorcock (or Robert Morley--there's another name that just dropped off the list, hey) I reckon something pretty good could have resulted. Now, I'm not so sure. I mean, I quite like _Take Me To Your Leader_, I think it is a much better record than one could have expected even if not as great as we possibly hoped. Whether they could even equal that at the moment, I don't know; Dibs may be enough of a writer to push out some stuff that could finish up like _Electric Tepee_ at least, but whether you think that's a great record or not, well... That all said. I maintain, I maintained in 2001 and I still maintain it, *that*, if Dave could just stand to have the whole band, or even an expanded band, down for a weekend of *jamming*, and then edited down the resulting recordings with someone else to give him feedback, until they had an hour-long record of distilled Hawkness, that would quite likely be the favourite Hawkwind record of most of us for ten of fifteen years, maybe more. I don't suppose they ever will but it would be so quick to do that I really wish they would. > Just curious...and it seems I was not the only one disappointed with Knights of Space. Terrible sound mix. On that subject, without having chanced it myself, I've been wondering if some of the incredible disparity of opinions we've been seeing could be down to people listening to what I guess is a 5.1 recording on non-5.1 equipment? However top-of-the-range one's stereo is, if the sound's not in that channel... but you're probably all wise to this and I should go suck eggs. Yours, Jon (apparently channelling Mike C., so who's Mike being?) -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 6 18:09:07 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 17:09:07 -0600 Subject: *****SPAM***** Origin of "Where Are They Now"? Definitive answer needed! In-Reply-To: <200903061135.n26BZNHW028345@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: the below theead referencing Weird 105 "Where Are They Now" On 3/6/09, M Holmes wrote: It sounds more like a studio track. Good show, I say good show my boy, it is!!!!!!! Whatever, I wish they'd lengthen the track. It's one of their best. > FoFP The whole thing is around 8 minutes long, and MAY have had Martin Griffin drumming, otherwise 100 percent CAPTAIN From sloterdijk at MSN.COM Sat Mar 7 09:00:16 2009 From: sloterdijk at MSN.COM (Burro Mike) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 14:00:16 +0000 Subject: OFF: Philadelphia & South New Jersey Area Reggae/Dub Happenings 3/7/09 In-Reply-To: <628905.92997.qm@web51706.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Greetings, here you'l find a list of great area reggae/dub happenings, courtesy of Selecta Jerry..If you haven't heard his show, 'Sounds of the Caribbean', you should really take a listen. He uploads the previous weeks' show to his myspace site, and his 'dub zone' section is awesome. He'll be creating that zone live, next Friday as part of our evening there. Check it out...Peace, Mike Burro > Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 16:42:25 -0800 > From: jerrydread at yahoo.com > Subject: Philadelphia & Southern New Jersey Area Happenings 3/7/09 > To: RAWnorthEastUSA at yahoogroups.com > > > Sunday March 8th > > Marinate Sundays at The Barbary with Federation Sound and Solomonic Sound Playing the best in > Roots & Culture and Dancehall Reggae 9pm till 2am 951 Frankford & Delaware Avenue > Philadelphia PA > http://www.worshiprecs.com/events.asp > > ===================== > > Wednesday March 11th > > Reggae Night at The Spence Cafe hosted by Rootsy and the Riddim Section Every Wednesday Night > 10pm to 2am 29 East Gay Street West Chester PA > http://www.spencecaferestaurant.com > http://www.myspace.com/rootsyriddimsection > > Reggae Wednedays with Stereo King Sound and Solomonic Sound plus special guests at The Arts Garage > 1533 Ridge Avenue Philadelphia PA 10pm to 3am > 267-226-3351 > http://www.myspace.com/sargemyname > http://www.myspace.com/stereokingmusic > > ====================== > > Thursday March 12th > > Thursday Night Reggae Eruption at Vesuvio 8th and Fitzwater Street Philadelphia PA > Every Thursday night Ital Sound and special guests spin the finest in conscious reggae > http://www.myspace.com/italsoundphilly > > ==================== > > Friday March 13th > > Selecta Jerry featuring "The Dub Zone Live" opening for Ghettosongbird and Mike Burro & Friends > at Hamilton Lanes 1200 Kuser Rd Hamilton NJ 609-585-2400 9pm 18+ > http://www.myspace.com/selectajerry > http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/2114668 > http://www.soundsofthecaribbean.com > http://www.myspace.com/ghettosongbirdjukebox > http://www.myspace.com/sloterdijk1 > http://www.myspace.com/hamiltonlanes > > Reggae night with DJ Frio spinning the best in conscious Reggae and dancehall every Friday Night > at The Dubliner 325 East Jimmie Leeds Road Galloway NJ 10pm to 1am 609-652-2210 > http://www.dublinerpubandgrill.com > > Flirt a reggae dancehall, soca, and hip hop experience every Friday at the VII Luxe Lounge > 724 Arch Street Philadelphia PA 215-413-0130 10pm to 2am > http://www.sevenluxelounge.com > > =============================== > > Saturday March 14th > > The Wailers at Trumps Taj Mahal 1000 Boardwalk at Virginia Ave Atlantic City NJ 8pm > > NYC vs Philly Reggae & Soul Battle featuring Jah Point (shockwave soundsystem), Marvelous Hagler(crazy baldheads > soundsystem), Damon (nyc & philly), Version Girl(philly reggae girls), Adam(ital soundsystem), > and Lord Action and Aggro (philly) at Dr. Watsons Pub 3rd floor 216 South 11th Street Philadelphia PA Free > http://www.myspace.com/italsoundphilly > http://www.myspace.com/phillyreggaegirls > http://www.myspace.com/screamingtarget > > ================================ > > Thursday March 19th > > The Slackers with Ruder Than You, Last Martyrs and Lost Cause at The Note 142 East Market > Street West Chester PA Doors at 7pm > http://www.ruderthanyou.net > http://thenotewc.com > > ========================= > > Friday March 20th > > Mavado with Flippa Mafia and music by Vybz Xpress, Peter Blacks, and Fire Supreme at > Lancaster Hall 5151 Warren Street 215-476-2660 > > ============================ > > Saturday March 21st > > PhillySka.com Presents Reggae Night featuring Philly Reggae Girls, Lord Action (Ten Commandments) > and DJ Go Feet at Dr. Watsons Pub 3rd floor 216 South 11th Street Philadelphia PA 10pm Free > http://www.Phillyska.com > http://www.myspace.com/phillyreggaegirls > http://www.myspace.com/screamingtarget > > Larry White and the Majestics at McGuinns Place 1781 Brunswick Ave Trenton NJ > 609-392-0599 > http://www.myspace.com/larrywhitereggae > http://www.mcguinns.com > > ===================== > > Friday March 27th > > PhillySka.com presents Hub City Stompers with King Django, Wareika Hill and the Forthright > at the 941 Theatre 941 North Front Street 730pm all ages > http://www.myspace.com/hubcitystompers > http://www.myspace.com/kingdjango > http://www.myspace.com/wareikahill > http://www.myspace.com/theforthrights > > Verdict at Kat Man Du 29 50 Riverview Executive Park > Waterfront Park > Trenton NJ 609/393-7300 > http://verdictisin.com > http://www.katmandutrenton.com > > ================== > > > Check with the venues / clubs for last minute info / > updates / cancellations > Calendar produced by Jerrydread / E-mail - > Jerrydread at yahoo.com > Calendar available FREE weekly by direct e-mail, > rec.music.reggae > Internet newsgroup, and http://www.NiceUp.com. > Use By Permission Only. > > To have your event or performance listed on the > calendar, You can Email Jerry at Jerrydread at yahoo.com > or visit > http://www.myspace.com/selectajerry > > > Remember To Support the Culture that Supports you! > > > > > http://www.myspace.com/selectajerry > > http://selectajerry.podbean.com > > http://www.soundsofthecaribbean.com > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail? is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_70faster_032009 From cea at CARLAZ.COM Sat Mar 7 07:08:53 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 07:08:53 -0500 Subject: Hawkwind next CD In-Reply-To: <20090306164133.GC4096@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: On 06 Mar 2009, at 11:41, Jonathan Jarrett wrote: > I think that they possibly could have made a great record in > 2001. With Simon on board, the last gasps of the Death Generator > concept > maybe and some general conceptual glue from a briefly friendly > Moorcock > (or Robert Morley--there's another name that just dropped off the > list, > hey) I reckon something pretty good could have resulted. I think there are lots of times that HW _could_ have made a great album -- but only a few when they actually did so. OK, that's admittedly more times than most of us, but it also seems like there have been a fair number of missed opportunities and chances that slipped away largely due to massive organizational chaos and lack of accord. Oh well! Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Sat Mar 7 13:21:22 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 13:21:22 -0500 Subject: Hawkwind next CD In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Carl, I like your ideas, and I think you are right concerning HW and being in the right place in time and space. Your friend, Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Carl Edlund Anderson Sent: Saturday, March 07, 2009 7:09 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: Hawkwind next CD On 06 Mar 2009, at 11:41, Jonathan Jarrett wrote: > I think that they possibly could have made a great record in > 2001. With Simon on board, the last gasps of the Death Generator > concept > maybe and some general conceptual glue from a briefly friendly > Moorcock > (or Robert Morley--there's another name that just dropped off the > list, > hey) I reckon something pretty good could have resulted. I think there are lots of times that HW _could_ have made a great album -- but only a few when they actually did so. OK, that's admittedly more times than most of us, but it also seems like there have been a fair number of missed opportunities and chances that slipped away largely due to massive organizational chaos and lack of accord. Oh well! Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Sun Mar 8 08:21:11 2009 From: StevePXR5 at AOL.COM (StevePXR5 at AOL.COM) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 08:21:11 EDT Subject: Fwd: [Hawkwind] In search of Marty in Australia Message-ID: Forwarded on behalf of Rob Dreamworker... In a message dated 08/03/2009 12:18:39 GMT Standard Time, rob.dreamworker at gmail.com writes: I know that this is a long shot, but I'm trying to contact this guy who used to be active in the HW Astral Plane (or should that be HW Australian Plane?). Is he on this list or does anyone know how to get hold of him. Many thanks. Rob. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: multipart/alternative Size: 420 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sloterdijk at MSN.COM Mon Mar 9 12:02:46 2009 From: sloterdijk at MSN.COM (Burro Mike) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 16:02:46 +0000 Subject: gig reminder Mike Burro, Selecta Jerry & Ghettosongbird this Friday 3/13 Message-ID: March 13th at Hamilton Lanes Mike Burro & Friends Selecta Jerry from 'Sounds of the Caribbean' doing his 'Dub Zone' set live.. Ghettosongbird see event details at: http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/2114668/ Hamilton Lanes 1200 Kuser Rd Hamilton, NJ 08619 ( 609 ) 585-2400 www.myspace.com/hamiltonlanes March 13th at Hamilton Lanes 9 PM entry 18+ $7.00 cover at the door Selecta Jerry from 'Sounds of the Caribbean' www.myspace.com/selectajerry Ghettosongbird www.myspace.com/ghettosongbirdjukebox Mike Burro & Friends http://www.myspace.com/sloterdijk1 _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live? Contacts: Organize your contact list. http://windowslive.com/connect/post/marcusatmicrosoft.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!503D1D86EBB2B53C!2285.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_UGC_Contacts_032009 From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Tue Mar 10 05:24:37 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 09:24:37 +0000 Subject: Off: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 02:54:27AM -0500, Lost Johnny typed out: > The interview is at www.metalliville.com Not any more it's not. Interesting. Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From colinjallen at YAHOO.CO.UK Tue Mar 10 06:01:32 2009 From: colinjallen at YAHOO.CO.UK (Colin Allen) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 10:01:32 +0000 Subject: Off: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <20090310092437.GG4096@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: It is still there; just scroll down on the front page. --- On Tue, 10/3/09, Jonathan Jarrett wrote: From: Jonathan Jarrett Subject: Re: Off: Alan Davey interview To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Date: Tuesday, 10 March, 2009, 9:24 AM On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 02:54:27AM -0500, Lost Johnny typed out: > The interview is at www.metalliville.com Not any more it's not. Interesting. Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From shll at HAGEDORN.DK Wed Mar 11 10:06:27 2009 From: shll at HAGEDORN.DK (SHLL (Scott Heller)) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:06:27 +0100 Subject: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled Message-ID: Well, it seems that Hawkwind's ever changing demands killed their concert in Oslo. My band, the Oresund Space Collective were suppose to play at this show but expenses were running wild and Hawkwind was being very unreasonable to the promoter (and doing very stealthy and unreasonable things like changing the agreed fee from Euros to pounds, etc..) and he had to can the show. What started out as a really great thing ended in a bummer for everyone involved and mainly due to the band themselves being excessively greedy, needy. Pity. I was really looking forward to this and so was the promoter and all my Norwegian friends.... Any word on the follow up to X in Search of Space? Do you think the band will debut any of these songs in the April UK tour with Girlschool? all the best scott www.oresundspacecollective.com (Our 5th totally improvised space rock CD out now!) From gingoblin at EASYNET.CO.UK Wed Mar 11 11:50:14 2009 From: gingoblin at EASYNET.CO.UK (gingoblin at EASYNET.CO.UK) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:50:14 +0000 Subject: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled In-Reply-To: <126A561607A76D4B90A6B67641C593E922C9E0C6D3@exdkmbx005.corp .novocorp.net> Message-ID: I was just wondering yesterday why Oslo wasn't on the website... now I know! Pity I've paid for the damn flights. And just today sent some Hawk discs over to Oslo friends who were gonna be seeing 'em for the first time, and in fact had never even heard them before... fuck, this is annoying. Now I better hope my Hamburg friend who I was telling MUST see Hawkwind at least once in their lifetime hasn't booked flights also, or I'll be in trouble! Ah well, it'll have to be just Edinburgh then. At least it's not six quid a pint here. Yet... At 15:06 11/03/2009 +0100, you wrote: >Well, it seems that Hawkwind's ever changing demands killed their concert >in Oslo. My band, the Oresund Space Collective were suppose to play at >this show but expenses were running wild and Hawkwind was being very >unreasonable to the promoter (and doing very stealthy and unreasonable >things like changing the agreed fee from Euros to pounds, etc..) and he >had to can the show. What started out as a really great thing ended in a >bummer for everyone involved and mainly due to the band themselves being >excessively greedy, needy. Pity. I was really looking forward to this and >so was the promoter and all my Norwegian friends.... > >Any word on the follow up to X in Search of Space? Do you think the band >will debut any of these songs in the April UK tour with Girlschool? > >all the best > >scott > >www.oresundspacecollective.com (Our 5th totally improvised space rock CD >out now!) From colinjallen at YAHOO.CO.UK Wed Mar 11 11:53:03 2009 From: colinjallen at YAHOO.CO.UK (Colin Allen) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:53:03 +0000 Subject: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled In-Reply-To: <126A561607A76D4B90A6B67641C593E922C9E0C6D3@exdkmbx005.corp.novocorp.net> Message-ID: Sad, sad , sad, but not really a surprise. --- On Wed, 11/3/09, SHLL (Scott Heller) wrote: From: SHLL (Scott Heller) Subject: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Date: Wednesday, 11 March, 2009, 2:06 PM Well, it seems that Hawkwind's ever changing demands killed their concert in Oslo. My band, the Oresund Space Collective were suppose to play at this show but expenses were running wild and Hawkwind was being very unreasonable to the promoter (and doing very stealthy and unreasonable things like changing the agreed fee from Euros to pounds, etc..) and he had to can the show. What started out as a really great thing ended in a bummer for everyone involved and mainly due to the band themselves being excessively greedy, needy. Pity. I was really looking forward to this and so was the promoter and all my Norwegian friends.... Any word on the follow up to X in Search of Space? Do you think the band will debut any of these songs in the April UK tour with Girlschool? all the best scott www.oresundspacecollective.com (Our 5th totally improvised space rock CD out now!) From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Wed Mar 11 13:44:15 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 13:44:15 -0400 Subject: Off: Alan Davey interview Message-ID: On Tue, 10 Mar 2009 09:24:37 +0000, Jonathan Jarrett wrote: >On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 02:54:27AM -0500, Lost Johnny typed out: >> The interview is at www.metalliville.com > > Not any more it's not. Interesting. Yours, > Jon > >-- >"When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" > (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) > Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk > > >Jonathon its still there. But its down farther in the news. Its getting to be old news now I guess. From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Wed Mar 11 13:56:42 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 13:56:42 -0400 Subject: Hawkwind next CD Message-ID: On Sat, 7 Mar 2009 07:08:53 -0500, Carl Edlund Anderson wrote: >On 06 Mar 2009, at 11:41, Jonathan Jarrett wrote: >> I think that they possibly could have made a great record in >> 2001. With Simon on board, the last gasps of the Death Generator >> concept >> maybe and some general conceptual glue from a briefly friendly >> Moorcock >> (or Robert Morley--there's another name that just dropped off the >> list, >> hey) I reckon something pretty good could have resulted. > >I think there are lots of times that HW _could_ have made a great >album -- but only a few when they actually did so. OK, that's >admittedly more times than most of us, but it also seems like there >have been a fair number of missed opportunities and chances that >slipped away largely due to massive organizational chaos and lack of >accord. Oh well! > >Cheers, >Carl > >-- >Carl Edlund Anderson >http://www.carlaz.com/ From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Wed Mar 11 14:40:27 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 14:40:27 -0400 Subject: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled Message-ID: On Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:06:27 +0100, SHLL (Scott Heller) wrote: >Well, it seems that Hawkwind's ever changing demands killed their concert in Oslo. My band, the Oresund Space Collective were suppose to play at this show but expenses were running wild and Hawkwind was being very unreasonable to the promoter (and doing very stealthy and unreasonable things like changing the agreed fee from Euros to pounds, etc..) and he had to can the show. What started out as a really great thing ended in a bummer for everyone involved and mainly due to the band themselves being excessively greedy, needy. Pity. I was really looking forward to this and so was the promoter and all my Norwegian friends.... > >Any word on the follow up to X in Search of Space? Do you think the band will debut any of these songs in the April UK tour with Girlschool? > >all the best > >scott > >www.oresundspacecollective.com (Our 5th totally improvised space rock CD out now!) Dave Brock fighting over money , what a surprise . Sorry about the festival loss Scott . Just think of some one who paid for airline tickets and hotel rooms . Anyway , your in Oresund Space Collective ? I didn't know that . Now that is a jamming band , like the old Hawkwind days . I have 3 cds by OSC , one of which is the " Black Tomato". I'll have to check out your website . I got the 3 cds from a USA website called www.allthatisheavy.com which you would probably like . It has your cds on it and also tons of cds and vinyl , including 45's of bands from Sweden,Finland,Germany ,Norway,etc.........Larry From busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET Wed Mar 11 15:04:44 2009 From: busterpepper at MIDWAYNET.NET (Lost Johnny) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:04:44 -0400 Subject: Spaceseed cd with Bridget Wishart and Harvey Message-ID: Spaceseed has a brand new cd "Twilight" just out with Bridget Wishart and Harvey Bainbridge on it. From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 11 15:47:58 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 12:47:58 -0700 Subject: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled Message-ID: "Paid for the flights" that's a pain I can understand... Having had to cancel my flight last week for Space Ritual 2009, the change fee is going to run me a couple hundred dollars to start with. Add to that the fact that flights in June or whenever they re-scheduled for are currently running $800 a pop or thereabouts.... Bleah! Steve -----Original Message----- From: gingoblin at EASYNET.CO.UK Date: Wednesday, Mar 11, 2009 11:52 am Subject: Re: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET I was just wondering yesterday why Oslo wasn't on the website... now I know! Pity I've paid for the damn flights. And just today sent some Hawk discs over to Oslo friends who were gonna be seeing 'em for the first time, and in fact had never even heard them before... fuck, this is annoying. Now I better hope my Hamburg friend who I was telling MUST see Hawkwind at least once in their lifetime hasn't booked flights also, or I'll be in trouble! Ah well, it'll have to be just Edinburgh then. At least it's not six quid a pint here. Yet... At 15:06 11/03/2009 +0100, you wrote: Well, it seems that Hawkwind's ever changing demands killed their concert in Oslo. My band, the Oresund Space Collective were suppose to play at this show but expenses were running wild and Hawkwind was being very unreasonable to the promoter (and doing very stealthy and unreasonable things like changing the agreed fee from Euros to pounds, etc..) and he had to can the show. What started out as a really great thing ended in a bummer for everyone involved and mainly due to the band themselves being excessively greedy, needy. Pity. I was really looking forward to this and so was the promoter and all my Norwegian friends.... >Any word on the follow up to X in Search of Space? Do you think the band will debut any of these songs in the April UK tour with Girlschool? >all the best >scott >www.oresundspacecollective.com (Our 5th totally improvised space rock CD out now!) From superskrull666 at YAHOO.CO.UK Wed Mar 11 15:26:12 2009 From: superskrull666 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Amphetamine Embalmer) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 19:26:12 +0000 Subject: Spaceseed cd with Bridget Wishart and Harvey In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Too bad about the Oslo HW show! I ev I just ordered this from CD Baby. Too bad about the Oslo HW show! I even had a ticket to go.... looks like I get a refund..... Christian in Norway ________________________________ From: Lost Johnny To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Wednesday, 11 March, 2009 20:04:44 Subject: Spaceseed cd with Bridget Wishart and Harvey Spaceseed has a brand new cd "Twilight" just out with Bridget Wishart and Harvey Bainbridge on it. From shll at HAGEDORN.DK Thu Mar 12 05:50:45 2009 From: shll at HAGEDORN.DK (SHLL (Scott Heller)) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:50:45 +0100 Subject: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled Message-ID: Hej Steve Well, I ended up going to England last weekend anyway as I had non-refundable flight tickets for the Hawklord things and I can't go in June, so I got fucked totally.... This Oslo thing is a real bummer as well, not just for me and the band who were going to play but the Scandinavian fans. Oh well.... at least we have the music... scott -----Original Message----- From: Steve Swann [mailto:swann1066 at GMAIL.COM] Sent: 11. marts 2009 20:48 Subject: Re: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled "Paid for the flights" that's a pain I can understand... Having had to cancel my flight last week for Space Ritual 2009, the change fee is going to run me a couple hundred dollars to start with. Add to that the fact that flights in June or whenever they re-scheduled for are currently running $800 a pop or thereabouts.... Bleah! Steve -----Original Message----- From: gingoblin at EASYNET.CO.UK Date: Wednesday, Mar 11, 2009 11:52 am Subject: Re: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET I was just wondering yesterday why Oslo wasn't on the website... now I know! Pity I've paid for the damn flights. And just today sent some Hawk discs over to Oslo friends who were gonna be seeing 'em for the first time, and in fact had never even heard them before... fuck, this is annoying. Now I better hope my Hamburg friend who I was telling MUST see Hawkwind at least once in their lifetime hasn't booked flights also, or I'll be in trouble! Ah well, it'll have to be just Edinburgh then. At least it's not six quid a pint here. Yet... At 15:06 11/03/2009 +0100, you wrote: Well, it seems that Hawkwind's ever changing demands killed their concert in Oslo. My band, the Oresund Space Collective were suppose to play at this show but expenses were running wild and Hawkwind was being very unreasonable to the promoter (and doing very stealthy and unreasonable things like changing the agreed fee from Euros to pounds, etc..) and he had to can the show. What started out as a really great thing ended in a bummer for everyone involved and mainly due to the band themselves being excessively greedy, needy. Pity. I was really looking forward to this and so was the promoter and all my Norwegian friends.... >Any word on the follow up to X in Search of Space? Do you think the >band will debut any of these songs in the April UK tour with Girlschool? >all the best >scott >www.oresundspacecollective.com (Our 5th totally improvised space rock >CD out now!) From sloterdijk at MSN.COM Thu Mar 12 08:58:03 2009 From: sloterdijk at MSN.COM (Burro Mike) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 12:58:03 +0000 Subject: final gig reminder: Mike Burro, Selecta Jerry, Ghettosongbird 3/13 Message-ID: Greetings friends, This show is going to be great! I hope some of you will be able to make it. Peace, Mike March 13th at Hamilton Lanes Mike Burro & Friends Selecta Jerry from 'Sounds of the Caribbean' doing his 'Dub Zone' set live.. Ghettosongbird see event details at: http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/2114668/ Hamilton Lanes 1200 Kuser Rd Hamilton, NJ 08619 ( 609 ) 585-2400 www.myspace.com/hamiltonlanes March 13th at Hamilton Lanes 9 PM entry 18+ $7.00 cover at the door Selecta Jerry from 'Sounds of the Caribbean' www.myspace.com/selectajerry Ghettosongbird www.myspace.com/ghettosongbirdjukebox Mike Burro & Friends http://www.myspace.com/sloterdijk1 _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live? Contacts: Organize your contact list. http://windowslive.com/connect/post/marcusatmicrosoft.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!503D1D86EBB2B53C!2285.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_UGC_Contacts_032009 From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 12 09:18:39 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 06:18:39 -0700 Subject: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled Message-ID: Yeah this sucks. When I said "what else am I going to do with my hard earned money if not spend it on Hawkshows" I had in mind that the whole SR 2009 trip would cost me under $1000. Now it's aiming to cost that much just for the change in airline tickets..... :-P I had originally planned to hit both SR 2009 and HW40, but now with the enormous added cost I might end up having to forego SR 2009 and use the ticket change to attend just HW 40. Steve -----Original Message----- From: "SHLL (Scott Heller)" Date: Thursday, Mar 12, 2009 5:53 am Subject: Re: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Hej Steve Well, I ended up going to England last weekend anyway as I had non-refundable flight tickets for the Hawklord things and I can't go in June, so I got fucked totally.... This Oslo thing is a real bummer as well, not just for me and the band who were going to play but the Scandinavian fans. Oh well.... at least we have the music... scott -----Original Message----- From: Steve Swann [mailto:swann1066 at GMAIL.COM] Sent: 11. marts 2009 20:48 Subject: Re: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled "Paid for the flights" that's a pain I can understand... Having had to cancel my flight last week for Space Ritual 2009, the change fee is going to run me a couple hundred dollars to start with. Add to that the fact that flights in June or whenever they re-scheduled for are currently running $800 a pop or thereabouts.... Bleah! Steve -----Original Message----- From: gingoblin at EASYNET.CO.UK Date: Wednesday, Mar 11, 2009 11:52 am Subject: Re: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET I was just wondering yesterday why Oslo wasn't on the website... now I know! Pity I've paid for the damn flights. And just today sent some Hawk discs over to Oslo friends who were gonna be seeing 'em for the first time, and in fact had never even heard them before... fuck, this is annoying. Now I better hope my Hamburg friend who I was telling MUST see Hawkwind at least once in their lifetime hasn't booked flights also, or I'll be in trouble! Ah well, it'll have to be just Edinburgh then. At least it's not six quid a pint here. Yet... At 15:06 11/03/2009 +0100, you wrote: Well, it seems that Hawkwind's ever changing demands killed their concert in Oslo. My band, the Oresund Space Collective were suppose to play at this show but expenses were running wild and Hawkwind was being very unreasonable to the promoter (and doing very stealthy and unreasonable things like changing the agreed fee from Euros to pounds, etc..) and he had to can the show. What started out as a really great thing ended in a bummer for everyone involved and mainly due to the band themselves being excessively greedy, needy. Pity. I was really looking forward to this and so was the promoter and all my Norwegian friends.... >Any word on the follow up to X in Search of Space? Do you think the >band will debut any of these songs in t From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Fri Mar 13 06:10:36 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 10:10:36 +0000 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <17d80c610902141139n53b4e0b9q1da76b77cfb5814f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 01:39:39PM -0600, mike coleman typed out: > Yes he was simply too tall!!!! > I'm kidding I'm kidding > If he fingered free-fall that alone makes him awesome bass player > maybe he should pick it back up and throw it into his act before we all get > stretched into a black hole!!! > On 2/14/09, Horse wrote: > > Wasn't Harvey Hawkwind's bass-player when Alan joined.... > > on bass! There is a paradox here, isn't there, that some of Harvey's bass parts are really nice but I think we'd mostly have to agree that with the possible exception of John Harrison (and I would say John Harrison's timing, at least in 1970, was better) Harvey's the worst bassist Hawkwind have ever had. And if you listen to the 25YO version of `Free Fall' it sounds to me like that is a man playing at the very limit of his ability. But I guess quite a lot of us hear music in our heads we'll never be able to make; he certainly comes closer to realising it than I ever will. Yours, Jon P. S. Harvey is on the other hand in my opinion the best *synth* player Hawkwind ever had and I would respectfully ask a rejoining Simon, were such ever to occur, to stick to violin so that there would be space for Harvey too... -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 13 06:34:46 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 04:34:46 -0600 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <20090313101036.GJ4096@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: Jon Jarret writes: > P. S. Harvey is on the other hand in my opinion the best *synth* player > Hawkwind ever had and I would respectfully ask a rejoining Simon, were > such ever to occur, to stick to violin so that there would be space for > Harvey too... > -- Now in a "perfect world", for me, if Simon were to plug back into whatever he was using on Warrior, I would say do anything, I mean ANYTHING to keep Harvey from messing anything up........ and before I continue, I rather see you as a personal friend Jon, and none of this stuff is very serious to me, and while I almost could have been a musician, I do not have an "ear" for much besides guitar, although Simon King gave me an "ear" for his drumming, (and) I never found any fault with Harvey's bass-playing Now that you've emitted this, I'll have to pay attention........ I find it strange that Simon House would (for me) trump Dik Mik and Del, though my connections higher up refer me to the fact Del was overseeing a bunch of the instruments.......... on a side note, any bass-playing forum members please look away, a friend told me the other day that someone he likes, Blackie Lawless, refers to the bass as "the instrument of ignorance", in regards to his switching to the guitar, and then there was Dave Mustaine saying "Bass, that's just one step up from the kazoo".....hehehe One thing I am sure of, is that Judge Trev certainly chose the wrong instrument...that guy should NEVER have picked up a guitar......talk about painful.......and you should see how fast people make excuses to leave every time his "noise" is on my stereo.....I won't even mention when he opens his mouth to "sing"??? Mike From steve.bishop at DB.COM Fri Mar 13 06:52:32 2009 From: steve.bishop at DB.COM (Steve Bishop) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 10:52:32 +0000 Subject: Orgasmatron ? In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903130334q71c4e718nb10e01a13d548889@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Guess all you Kollektors have seen this ? http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ULTRA-RARE-HAWKWIND-CD-ORGASMATRON_W0QQitemZ190290836360QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CDsDVDs_CDs_CDs_GL?hash=item190290836360&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A16%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 --- This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and delete this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. Please refer to http://www.db.com/en/content/eu_disclosures.htm for additional EU corporate and regulatory disclosures. From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 13 07:05:29 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 05:05:29 -0600 Subject: Orgasmatron ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 3/13/09, Steve Bishop wrote: > > Guess all you Kollektors have seen this ? (regarding eBay bootleg > Orgasmatron CD) Yes.....bought it when it came out it is an actual cd bootleg, with what I always thought was s stupid title for what should be Motorhead, and has a hodegpodge of tracks, including (from memory) SOME of the 71 kinetic playground tracks, but I would PLEAD that nobody pay this wank his 100 pound asking price for "buy it now" rather, find him, hunt him down, and beat the living snot out of him From cea at CARLAZ.COM Fri Mar 13 09:10:30 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 08:10:30 -0500 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <20090313101036.GJ4096@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: On 13 Mar 2009, at 05:10 , Jonathan Jarrett wrote: > But I guess quite a lot of us hear music in our heads we'll > never be able to make; he certainly comes closer to realising it > than I > ever will. Well, you could buy a dodgy old bass or get some software synths and DAW software and mess around for a couple of years and then you'd probably be quite close to making as much music that you heard in your head as ol? Harvey can/has. After all, the magic of technology make that a lot cheaper and easier than it used to be! :) > P. S. Harvey is on the other hand in my opinion the best *synth* > player > Hawkwind ever had and I would respectfully ask a rejoining Simon, were > such ever to occur, to stick to violin so that there would be space > for > Harvey too... If he's responsible for the synth solo in the _Palace Springs_ "Golden Void", then I'm going to agree. IMO, the Brock/Davey/ Chadwick/House/Bainbridge lineup was the finest "post-Classical" Hawkwind lineup there has been. Much though I like Huw and Tim Blake (and even Ron Tree had his moments), that's the one for me. :) Even if the albums _do_ have programmed drums .... Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU Fri Mar 13 10:40:08 2009 From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU (Paul Mather) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 10:40:08 -0400 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903130334q71c4e718nb10e01a13d548889@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 13 Mar 2009, at 6:34 AM, mike coleman wrote: > on a side note, any bass-playing forum members please look away, a > friend > told me the other day that someone he likes, Blackie Lawless, refers > to the > bass as "the instrument of ignorance", in regards to his switching > to the > guitar, and then there was Dave Mustaine saying "Bass, that's just > one step > up from the kazoo".....hehehe Both of those people have obviously never heard Allen Woody play. Cheers, Paul. e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." --- Frank Vincent Zappa From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Fri Mar 13 10:52:09 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 07:52:09 -0700 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview Message-ID: I might not be much better than a kazoo player but I'd say Lawless and Mustaine are full of it. ________________________________ From: Paul Mather To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 9:40:08 AM Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview On 13 Mar 2009, at 6:34 AM, mike coleman wrote: > on a side note, any bass-playing forum members please look away, a friend > told me the other day that someone he likes, Blackie Lawless, refers to the > bass as "the instrument of ignorance", in regards to his switching to the > guitar, and then there was Dave Mustaine saying "Bass, that's just one step > up from the kazoo".....hehehe Both of those people have obviously never heard Allen Woody play. Cheers, Paul. e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." ? ? ? ? --- Frank Vincent Zappa From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 13 10:53:25 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 08:53:25 -0600 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <885B5241-2D2C-4750-8005-DC90A6336CBF@gromit.dlib.vt.edu> Message-ID: On 3/13/09, Paul Mather wrote: > > > Both of those people have obviously never heard Allen Woody play. (in > reference to the Bass being a simpleton instrument) Well first of all, let's just consider the source(s) Blackie Lawless?? I'm surprised I had the guts to even print that name!!!! I can (sort of) appreciate them, in a Chris Holmes pouring vodka all over himself kinda way, but.....notttttt exactly my cup of tea as for Mustaine, well, he's just got balls where his mouth is...... I only really care for the "Killing" album, but I confess I like the guy I hope there are no typos in this, I'll be embarrassed if there are and Steve PXR5 sees them From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 13 11:12:38 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 09:12:38 -0600 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <643566.13072.qm@web36906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 3/13/09, gary shindler wrote: > > I might not be much better than a kazoo player but I'd say Lawless and > Mustaine are full of it. well Blackie's whole problem seems to be that he's just too tall I did enjoy watching the 6 porno flicks running at the show and getting to see his infamous crotch sparkler come around again in the 90's..... I do understand where they are coming from, being a former sort-of guitarist myself for some of us the bass just sucks, no fun, too resticting, the end funny enough, I finally at age 43 (last year) decided I'd just play the bass in order to meet freaky people and have fun, so I "tried out" for my friend Keely's newest project, and I think I passed as he immediately demanded I buy my own bass fuck that, not that fast I'm not In ways I am better and certainly more psychedelic than he is on guitar, but he is more seasoned and accomplished overall, as well as having material ready to go this converation is not my intention to poke at the bass but I'm a guitar man, I wanted to sound like Brock, but ended up Hillage-Trower, sob From paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU Fri Mar 13 11:27:25 2009 From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU (Paul Mather) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:27:25 -0400 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903130753v563418b5gcb371aa65798940e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 13 Mar 2009, at 10:53 AM, mike coleman wrote: > as for Mustaine, well, he's just got balls where his mouth is...... > I only really care for the "Killing" album, but I confess I like the > guy I can appreciate Mustaine, too (as a guitarist), but let's remember the guy has an ego the Solar System can barely contain, so of course he's going to rubbish bass players, just like he seems to rubbish anyone and everything that isn't, um... Dave Mustaine. (Can I recall Mustaine ever actually complimenting anyone? Hmm... don't think so. Oh, wait, I think he had something nice to say about Black Sabbath on the insert of the Nativity in Black tribute CD, but I suppose he was contractually obligated to be nice as a precondition to being included on the album[*].:) Cheers, Paul. [*] And, to be honest, I think their cover of "Paranoid" on that album is, ahem... pants. e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." --- Frank Vincent Zappa From e_clout at HOTMAIL.COM Fri Mar 13 11:38:57 2009 From: e_clout at HOTMAIL.COM (Edmund Clout) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 15:38:57 +0000 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <4BAB0E9B-446E-42DB-9165-1DB92293C346@gromit.dlib.vt.edu> Message-ID: With regard to bassists being no more musicians than drumers I've only one contribution to make: Squarepusher http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squarepusher D&B/Jazz genre but can play a six string fretless Bass with more virtuosity than most guitarists manage. So there. ;-) Mundo. P.S. I don't care about top posting if it's general reply. MwaHaHaHaHa > Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:27:25 -0400 > From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU > Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > On 13 Mar 2009, at 10:53 AM, mike coleman wrote: > > > as for Mustaine, well, he's just got balls where his mouth is...... > > I only really care for the "Killing" album, but I confess I like the > > guy > > > I can appreciate Mustaine, too (as a guitarist), but let's remember > the guy has an ego the Solar System can barely contain, so of course > he's going to rubbish bass players, just like he seems to rubbish > anyone and everything that isn't, um... Dave Mustaine. (Can I recall > Mustaine ever actually complimenting anyone? Hmm... don't think so. > Oh, wait, I think he had something nice to say about Black Sabbath on > the insert of the Nativity in Black tribute CD, but I suppose he was > contractually obligated to be nice as a precondition to being included > on the album[*].:) > > Cheers, > > Paul. > > [*] And, to be honest, I think their cover of "Paranoid" on that album > is, ahem... pants. > > e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu > > "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production > deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." > --- Frank Vincent Zappa _________________________________________________________________ View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more! http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/ From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Fri Mar 13 11:43:57 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 08:43:57 -0700 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview Message-ID: ________________________ Or Tony Levin on the Chapman Stick. ________________________________ From: Edmund Clout To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 10:38:57 AM Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview With regard to bassists being no more musicians than drumers I've only one contribution to make: Squarepusher http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squarepusher D&B/Jazz genre but can play a six string fretless Bass with more virtuosity than most guitarists manage. So there. ;-) Mundo. P.S. I don't care about top posting if it's general reply. MwaHaHaHaHa > Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:27:25 -0400 > From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU > Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > On 13 Mar 2009, at 10:53 AM, mike coleman wrote: > > > as for Mustaine, well, he's just got balls where his mouth is...... > > I only really care for the "Killing" album, but I confess I like the > > guy > > > I can appreciate Mustaine, too (as a guitarist), but let's remember > the guy has an ego the Solar System can barely contain, so of course > he's going to rubbish bass players, just like he seems to rubbish > anyone and everything that isn't, um... Dave Mustaine. (Can I recall > Mustaine ever actually complimenting anyone? Hmm... don't think so. > Oh, wait, I think he had something nice to say about Black Sabbath on > the insert of the Nativity in Black tribute CD, but I suppose he was > contractually obligated to be nice as a precondition to being included > on the album[*].:) > > Cheers, > > Paul. > > [*] And, to be honest, I think their cover of "Paranoid" on that album > is, ahem... pants. > > e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu > > "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production > deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." > --- Frank Vincent Zappa _________________________________________________________________ View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more! http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/ From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 13 11:44:08 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 09:44:08 -0600 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <4BAB0E9B-446E-42DB-9165-1DB92293C346@gromit.dlib.vt.edu> Message-ID: On 3/13/09, Paul Mather wrote: > > On 13 Mar 2009, at 10:53 AM, mike coleman wrote: > > I can appreciate Mustaine, too (as a guitarist), but let's remember the guy > has an ego the Solar System can barely contain, so of course he's going to > rubbish bass players, just like he seems to rubbish anyone and everything > that isn't, um... Dave Mustaine. (Can I recall Mustaine ever actually > complimenting anyone? Hmm... don't think so. Oh, wait, I think he had > something nice to say about Black Sabbath on the insert of the Nativity in > Black tribute CD, but I suppose he was contractually obligated to be nice as > a precondition to being included on the album[*].:) > > If you guys don't mind, and in case you never noticed, I tend to often be > more interested in you people here than even say, a Hawkwind > interview.......I don't need every little HW-feed, as I crowned Dave and the > rest of them years ago,and my money proved it....OK, so I may be capable of > changing the entire course of the future in ways that may cause a lot of > suicides in the weaker minded, but I know myself, and there are so many > things you smart folks could teach me.....and do!!! I can't help liking a guy that the rest of Metaliica were, well, in fact a bit afraid of He's a star.....abrasive or what-not, he demanded his attention and got it I do think Kirk trumped him in the replacement phase though.....I wish Kirk had had more say.....If I still cared about a band that I helped make too popular, Kirk is my man...... From StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Fri Mar 13 11:47:53 2009 From: StevePXR5 at AOL.COM (StevePXR5 at AOL.COM) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:47:53 EDT Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview Message-ID: It passed the PXR5 spellchecker :-) There's a crackin' typo on Alan Davey's MySpace page: _www.myspace.com/alandaveymusic_ (http://www.myspace.com/alandaveymusic) On the left hand side under General Info... He's missed the "B" out of Bass Monster. I fell about laughing. Looking forward to seeing him on the 27th to rib him about it. I've mailed him about it but he's not read it yet. Steve. In a message dated 13/03/2009 14:54:12 GMT Standard Time, insect.brain at GMAIL.COM writes: I hope there are no typos in this, I'll be embarrassed if there are and Steve PXR5 sees them From CWarburton at UBMAVIATION.COM Fri Mar 13 11:49:10 2009 From: CWarburton at UBMAVIATION.COM (Chris Warburton) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 15:49:10 -0000 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: A Message-ID: And a hearty "Hear, hear" to that - his duet with Evan Parker at the QEH was a joy! Chris W -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On Behalf Of Edmund Clout Sent: 13 March 2009 15:39 To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview With regard to bassists being no more musicians than drumers I've only one contribution to make: Squarepusher http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squarepusher D&B/Jazz genre but can play a six string fretless Bass with more virtuosity than most guitarists manage. So there. ;-) Mundo. P.S. I don't care about top posting if it's general reply. MwaHaHaHaHa > Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:27:25 -0400 > From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU > Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > On 13 Mar 2009, at 10:53 AM, mike coleman wrote: > > > as for Mustaine, well, he's just got balls where his mouth is...... > > I only really care for the "Killing" album, but I confess I like the > > guy > > > I can appreciate Mustaine, too (as a guitarist), but let's remember > the guy has an ego the Solar System can barely contain, so of course > he's going to rubbish bass players, just like he seems to rubbish > anyone and everything that isn't, um... Dave Mustaine. (Can I recall > Mustaine ever actually complimenting anyone? Hmm... don't think so. > Oh, wait, I think he had something nice to say about Black Sabbath on > the insert of the Nativity in Black tribute CD, but I suppose he was > contractually obligated to be nice as a precondition to being included > on the album[*].:) > > Cheers, > > Paul. > > [*] And, to be honest, I think their cover of "Paranoid" on that album > is, ahem... pants. > > e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu > > "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring > production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." > --- Frank Vincent Zappa _________________________________________________________________ View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place - Learn more! http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/ This e-mail is intended for the named recipient(s). It and any attachments may contain privileged and/or confidential information. They may not be disclosed to or used by or copied in any way by anyone other than the intended recipient. If you are not one of the intended recipients, or this email is received in error, please immediately either notify the sender or contact UBM Aviation on +44 (0) 1582 600111 quoting the name of the sender and the email address to which it has been sent and then delete it and any attachment(s). While all reasonable efforts are made to safeguard inbound and outbound e-mails, UBM Aviation and its affiliate companies cannot guarantee that attachments are virus-free or are compatible with your systems, and does not accept liability in respect of viruses or computer problems experienced. Neither UB Aviation nor the sender accepts any responsibility for viruses and it is your responsibility to scan or otherwise check this email and any attachments. UBM Aviation may monitor or record outgoing and incoming e-mail to secure effective system operation and for other lawful purposes. By replying to this email you give your consent to such monitoring. Thank you. UBM Aviation is a division of United Business Media Group Limited which is registered in England, No.1693134. Registered office: Ludgate House, 245 Blackfriars Road, London, SE1 9UY, UK and place of business at The OAG Building, Church Street, Dunstable, Beds LU5 4HB, UK From tjackson at SYR.EDU Fri Mar 13 11:53:58 2009 From: tjackson at SYR.EDU (Theodore O Jackson) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:53:58 -0400 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <656360.19562.qm@web36904.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Tim Bogert with just 4 strings back in the 70s. Nobody's touched him yet for chops, sound and feel for the instrument.... -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On Behalf Of gary shindler Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 11:44 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview ________________________ Or Tony Levin on the Chapman Stick. ________________________________ From: Edmund Clout To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 10:38:57 AM Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview With regard to bassists being no more musicians than drumers I've only one contribution to make: Squarepusher http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squarepusher D&B/Jazz genre but can play a six string fretless Bass with more virtuosity than most guitarists manage. So there. ;-) Mundo. P.S. I don't care about top posting if it's general reply. MwaHaHaHaHa > Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:27:25 -0400 > From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU > Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > On 13 Mar 2009, at 10:53 AM, mike coleman wrote: > > > as for Mustaine, well, he's just got balls where his mouth is...... > > I only really care for the "Killing" album, but I confess I like the > > guy > > > I can appreciate Mustaine, too (as a guitarist), but let's remember > the guy has an ego the Solar System can barely contain, so of course > he's going to rubbish bass players, just like he seems to rubbish > anyone and everything that isn't, um... Dave Mustaine. (Can I recall > Mustaine ever actually complimenting anyone? Hmm... don't think so. > Oh, wait, I think he had something nice to say about Black Sabbath on > the insert of the Nativity in Black tribute CD, but I suppose he was > contractually obligated to be nice as a precondition to being included > on the album[*].:) > > Cheers, > > Paul. > > [*] And, to be honest, I think their cover of "Paranoid" on that album > is, ahem... pants. > > e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu > > "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production > deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." > --- Frank Vincent Zappa _________________________________________________________________ View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more! http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/ From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 13 11:54:27 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 09:54:27 -0600 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <656360.19562.qm@web36904.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: for me, 3 chords or notes can demolish a spastic fingermonger Complex signatures actually get on my nerves more than not just do your bum bum bum nicely along so the guitar can scream out (and other instruments) complexities may showcase skill, but I doesn't meanI I'll be hoping around my place in excitement less can very much be BETTER just one more 'pinion On 3/13/09, gary shindler wrote: > > ________________________ > Or Tony Levin on the Chapman Stick. > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Edmund Clout > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 10:38:57 AM > Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview > > With regard to bassists being no more musicians than drumers I've only one > contribution to make: Squarepusher > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squarepusher > > > > D&B/Jazz genre but can play a six string fretless Bass with more virtuosity > than most guitarists manage. > > So there. ;-) > > > Mundo. > > > > P.S. I don't care about top posting if it's general reply. MwaHaHaHaHa > > > > Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:27:25 -0400 > > From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU > > Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview > > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > > > On 13 Mar 2009, at 10:53 AM, mike coleman wrote: > > > > > as for Mustaine, well, he's just got balls where his mouth is...... > > > I only really care for the "Killing" album, but I confess I like the > > > guy > > > > > > I can appreciate Mustaine, too (as a guitarist), but let's remember > > the guy has an ego the Solar System can barely contain, so of course > > he's going to rubbish bass players, just like he seems to rubbish > > anyone and everything that isn't, um... Dave Mustaine. (Can I recall > > Mustaine ever actually complimenting anyone? Hmm... don't think so. > > Oh, wait, I think he had something nice to say about Black Sabbath on > > the insert of the Nativity in Black tribute CD, but I suppose he was > > contractually obligated to be nice as a precondition to being included > > on the album[*].:) > > > > Cheers, > > > > Paul. > > > > [*] And, to be honest, I think their cover of "Paranoid" on that album > > is, ahem... pants. > > > > e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu > > > > "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production > > deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." > > --- Frank Vincent Zappa > > _________________________________________________________________ > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more! > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/ > > > > From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 13 16:49:10 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 14:49:10 -0600 Subject: Orgasmatron ? In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903130405v1e802b8dve9bea46b353d8c94@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: A little more on this yeah I'm pisssed mine was stolen and sold, but: had this guy auctioned it with a reasoable starting bid and then the maniacs themselves bid it into the heavens, fine but I recall the sound was poor and to try to turn a fast load off it seems.....tacky do I need it again? nahhh On 3/13/09, mike coleman wrote: > > > On 3/13/09, Steve Bishop wrote: >> >> Guess all you Kollektors have seen this ? (regarding eBay bootleg >> Orgasmatron CD) > > > Yes.....bought it when it came out > it is an actual cd bootleg, with what I always thought was s stupid title > for what should be Motorhead, and has a hodegpodge of tracks, including > (from memory) SOME of the 71 kinetic playground tracks, but I would PLEAD > that nobody pay this wank his 100 pound asking price for "buy it now" > rather, find him, hunt him down, and beat the living snot out of him > > > From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 13 21:37:04 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 19:37:04 -0600 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <0F1A30D891A94945ACE56D9815D54E821AE10BF8@suex07-mbx-09.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: and I could make an argument for the bass on Lemmy and Alan alone...... and I couldmake an argument for the title of the Orgasmatron CD if it haSonic aTTACK On 3/13/09, Theodore O Jackson wrote: > > Tim Bogert with just 4 strings back in the 70s. > Nobody's touched him yet for chops, sound and > feel for the instrument.... > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] > On Behalf Of gary shindler > Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 11:44 AM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview > > ________________________ > Or Tony Levin on the Chapman Stick. > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Edmund Clout > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 10:38:57 AM > Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview > > With regard to bassists being no more musicians than drumers I've only one > contribution to make: Squarepusher > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squarepusher > > > > D&B/Jazz genre but can play a six string fretless Bass with more virtuosity > than most guitarists manage. > > So there. ;-) > > > Mundo. > > > > P.S. I don't care about top posting if it's general reply. MwaHaHaHaHa > > > > Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:27:25 -0400 > > From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU > > Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview > > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > > > On 13 Mar 2009, at 10:53 AM, mike coleman wrote: > > > > > as for Mustaine, well, he's just got balls where his mouth is...... > > > I only really care for the "Killing" album, but I confess I like the > > > guy > > > > > > I can appreciate Mustaine, too (as a guitarist), but let's remember > > the guy has an ego the Solar System can barely contain, so of course > > he's going to rubbish bass players, just like he seems to rubbish > > anyone and everything that isn't, um... Dave Mustaine. (Can I recall > > Mustaine ever actually complimenting anyone? Hmm... don't think so. > > Oh, wait, I think he had something nice to say about Black Sabbath on > > the insert of the Nativity in Black tribute CD, but I suppose he was > > contractually obligated to be nice as a precondition to being included > > on the album[*].:) > > > > Cheers, > > > > Paul. > > > > [*] And, to be honest, I think their cover of "Paranoid" on that album > > is, ahem... pants. > > > > e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu > > > > "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production > > deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." > > --- Frank Vincent Zappa > > _________________________________________________________________ > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more! > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/ > > > > From Stewartbas at AOL.COM Thu Mar 12 13:35:10 2009 From: Stewartbas at AOL.COM (Stewartbas at AOL.COM) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 13:35:10 EDT Subject: Hawkwind Oslo cancelled Message-ID: In a message dated 3/12/2009 9:19:29 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, swann1066 at GMAIL.COM writes: Once again, we soldiered on as a duo..The support of 'Selecta Jerry' and Ghettosongbird was phenomenal. I consider this one of the most enjoyable gigs I've done in recent times, or should I say that "besides hoping to entertain others, I was thoroughly entertained by the talent level of the other acts"..Peace, Mike songlist: Smokestack Lightning Waiting for the Man> Ejection Down the Dustpipe Hurry On Sundown Season of The Witch Hymie the Winey> Uranium Zone lineup: Jeff Berry: bass/backing vocals Mike Burro: electric guitar/vocals http://www.myspace.com/sloterdijk1 > Ejection You shook Me Season of the Witch The Red Rooster The Wizard Hurry On Sundown Uranium Zone Here are links to Selecta Jerry & Ghettosongbird's sites, Check them out, and take a listen. Jerry broadcasts live every Saturday afternoon, and you can hear his entire show from each previous week streaming as a podcast on his myspace site. Ghettosongbird will be doing some more shows in the coming days, so if you are in the greater New York area you may want to catch them. See all their dates on their myuspace site. I hope to work with all these artists again, so keep an eye out...Peace! Selecta Jerry from 'Sounds of the Caribbean' www.myspace.com/selectajerry Ghettosongbird www.myspace.com/ghettosongbirdjukebox _________________________________________________________________ Express your personality in color! Preview and select themes for Hotmail?. http://www.windowslive-hotmail.com/LearnMore/personalize.aspx?ocid=TXT_MSGTX_WL_HM_express_032009#colortheme From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 15:10:05 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 13:10:05 -0600 Subject: HW Kollektor Report/ B Stewart? Message-ID: Hawkwind Live CD on the Lollipop label does not sound identical to SR 2, to me (little sound variations to my ear, whatever this is) it features "Organe Accumulator", "Seconds of Forever" (In The Ten Seconds Of Forever), "Welcome To The Futore", as has a little scary surprise bit of a version of Sonic Attack snuck in before the Silver Machine encore.....I believe this item to be german in origin, and if anybody knows the year of release I wish to know... a must for Insect Brains everywhere and Willie, your Little Debbie cakes are fresh in from Russia....... From stevefreight at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 15:20:56 2009 From: stevefreight at GMAIL.COM (Steve Freight) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 19:20:56 +0000 Subject: HW Kollektor Report/ B Stewart? In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903141210sa3e1f0cj797df7173ec67b12@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Mike - have I missed a link to this one somewhere? SR2 doen't have silver machine as you will know so what is this - A hybrid of 2 releases? Steve On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 7:10 PM, mike coleman wrote: > Hawkwind Live CD on the Lollipop label does not sound identical to SR 2, to > me (little sound variations to my ear, whatever this is) > it features "Organe Accumulator", "Seconds of Forever" (In The Ten Seconds > Of Forever), "Welcome To The Futore", as has a little scary surprise bit of > a version of Sonic Attack snuck in before the Silver Machine encore.....I > believe this item to be german in origin, and if anybody knows the year of > release I wish to know... > a must for Insect Brains everywhere > and Willie, your Little Debbie cakes are fresh in from Russia....... > -- View Steve's Photos of Hawkwind Porcupine Tree and Isle of Wight http://www.flickr.com/photos/venthawktree From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Sat Mar 14 15:51:31 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:51:31 -0400 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <885B5241-2D2C-4750-8005-DC90A6336CBF@gromit.dlib.vt.edu> Message-ID: Hi Paul, I always thought the bass would be very difficult to play, well. So many bands use it as a minimalist sort of affect, rather than allowing bass players to show their style. He was certainly influenced by Lemmy, but Alan has developed a signature sound of his own. Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Paul Mather Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 10:40 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview On 13 Mar 2009, at 6:34 AM, mike coleman wrote: > on a side note, any bass-playing forum members please look away, a > friend > told me the other day that someone he likes, Blackie Lawless, refers > to the > bass as "the instrument of ignorance", in regards to his switching > to the > guitar, and then there was Dave Mustaine saying "Bass, that's just > one step > up from the kazoo".....hehehe Both of those people have obviously never heard Allen Woody play. Cheers, Paul. e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." --- Frank Vincent Zappa From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Sat Mar 14 16:01:34 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 16:01:34 -0400 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Carl, As you know, I was so fortunate to have caught shows during that era. We didn't really know what to expect here in the states after 11 years, and we didn't have the net taking the element of surprise out of things. I love it when Dave, Harvey and Alan are all doing synthes. in spaces simultaneously. I missed the '70's but can't complain at all. (smile, Maybe a little bit)?Just happy, the memories surrounding the Hawkwind shows I experienced are sweet. Mary Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Carl Edlund Anderson Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 9:11 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: HW: Alan Davey interview On 13 Mar 2009, at 05:10 , Jonathan Jarrett wrote: > But I guess quite a lot of us hear music in our heads we'll > never be able to make; he certainly comes closer to realising it > than I > ever will. Well, you could buy a dodgy old bass or get some software synths and DAW software and mess around for a couple of years and then you'd probably be quite close to making as much music that you heard in your head as ol? Harvey can/has. After all, the magic of technology make that a lot cheaper and easier than it used to be! :) > P. S. Harvey is on the other hand in my opinion the best *synth* > player > Hawkwind ever had and I would respectfully ask a rejoining Simon, were > such ever to occur, to stick to violin so that there would be space > for > Harvey too... If he's responsible for the synth solo in the _Palace Springs_ "Golden Void", then I'm going to agree. IMO, the Brock/Davey/ Chadwick/House/Bainbridge lineup was the finest "post-Classical" Hawkwind lineup there has been. Much though I like Huw and Tim Blake (and even Ron Tree had his moments), that's the one for me. :) Even if the albums _do_ have programmed drums .... Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 17:17:30 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:17:30 -0600 Subject: HW Kollektor Report/ B Stewart? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 3/14/09, Steve Freight wrote: > > Mike - have I missed a link to this one somewhere? Hi Steve, I don't know, but this item was disscused previously when Johan outbid Wilfried Schuesler, whom I was expecting to win it.....and now we all have our copies here is a link to the one I bought so you can see it: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180332755806&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dp0.m38.l1313%26_nkw%3D180332755806%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&_rdc=1 > SR2 doen't have silver machine as you will know so what is this - A hybrid > of 2 releases? > > You'd be exactly right...if this item were to appear on the Starfarer site, > and I do not know if it does, I feel certain it would be reported as one > more Space Ritual 2 outchurning (which it is), with the encore Silver > Machine added from Yuri Gagarin(and I am going on assumption that is what we > have here) I'm not sure what the Sonic Attack this one has before SM, I am getting old.......the other CD like this I bought on LASERLIGHT label, curiously has a later version of Urban Guerilla hybridized into it...I know that item does apper on Starfarer site.... From owen.01 at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 19:31:11 2009 From: owen.01 at GMAIL.COM (Owen O'Neill) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 19:31:11 -0400 Subject: OFF: Cartoon (an EXTRAVAGANZA full of HW references!) Message-ID: OK I just spent the whole week making this scene: an automind-controlled F104 takes out Earth's sky defense system "Rocket Jesi" in Para-World 6. 26 seconds 6.5MB mp4 H.264, no sound. More to come, sometime! http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=292215db1fd432e8d2db6fb9a8902bda And THX(!) for all the great feedback on the last edit I linked to back in November. The "dogfight" scene at the end was mostly stock footage that's going to be scrapped except for about 15 seconds of it. There's this whole aerial scene, the mutiny on the zeppelin, and the intro scene still left to finish: intro will make the whole thing a little less awkward as far as having a plot goes. It's a paranoid radio announcement accompanied by confusing flickering images-- I'm looking for about 1000 pictures of large equipment installations, space scenes, star charts, diagrams of nuclear/propulsion systems, rockets, random interesting things to be flashed on a screen real fast. Best of the best, veracities, etc., Owen -- .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, From owen.01 at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 19:39:58 2009 From: owen.01 at GMAIL.COM (Owen O'Neill) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 19:39:58 -0400 Subject: OFF: Cartoon (an EXTRAVAGANZA full of HW references!) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: PS. If either of these files are skipping or just stopping for seconds at a time it could be that the data rate is too high for your computer-- It plays fine on my underpowered Mac Mini from 2005, but if your machine's older this might happen-- and I can just encode it again to be smaller. On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 7:31 PM, Owen O'Neill wrote: > OK I just spent the whole week making this scene: an automind-controlled > F104 takes out Earth's sky defense system "Rocket Jesi" in Para-World 6. > > 26 seconds 6.5MB mp4 H.264, no sound. More to come, sometime! > > http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=292215db1fd432e8d2db6fb9a8902bda > > > And THX(!) for all the great feedback on the last edit I linked to back in > November. The "dogfight" scene at the end was mostly stock footage that's > going to be scrapped except for about 15 seconds of it. There's this whole > aerial scene, the mutiny on the zeppelin, and the intro scene still left to > finish: intro will make the whole thing a little less awkward as far as > having a plot goes. It's a paranoid radio announcement accompanied by > confusing flickering images-- I'm looking for about 1000 pictures of > large equipment installations, space scenes, star charts, diagrams of > nuclear/propulsion systems, rockets, random interesting things to be flashed > on a screen real fast. > > Best of the best, veracities, etc., > > Owen > > -- > .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, > -- .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 19:43:13 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 17:43:13 -0600 Subject: OFF: Cartoon (an EXTRAVAGANZA full of HW references!) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Owen I was going to mail you soon and see if you're OK I see you are FABULOUS!!!! On 3/14/09, Owen O'Neill wrote: > > OK I just spent the whole week making this scene: an automind-controlled > F104 takes out Earth's sky defense system "Rocket Jesi" in Para-World 6. > > 26 seconds 6.5MB mp4 H.264, no sound. More to come, sometime! > > http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=292215db1fd432e8d2db6fb9a8902bda > > > And THX(!) for all the great feedback on the last edit I linked to back in > November. The "dogfight" scene at the end was mostly stock footage that's > going to be scrapped except for about 15 seconds of it. There's this whole > aerial scene, the mutiny on the zeppelin, and the intro scene still left to > finish: intro will make the whole thing a little less awkward as far as > having a plot goes. It's a paranoid radio announcement accompanied by > confusing flickering images-- I'm looking for about 1000 pictures of large > equipment installations, space scenes, star charts, diagrams of > nuclear/propulsion systems, rockets, random interesting things to be > flashed > on a screen real fast. > > Best of the best, veracities, etc., > > Owen > > -- > .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, > From owen.01 at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 19:58:48 2009 From: owen.01 at GMAIL.COM (Owen O'Neill) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 19:58:48 -0400 Subject: OFF: Cartoon (an EXTRAVAGANZA full of HW references!) In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903141643h2ebeab2diaddef47ef475523c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Mike! Yeah except for a little bit last weekend I've been off alcohol now for almost 4 weeks, and recovering fast enough. I got back on amphetamines (for the time being) which has helped ALOT. It was being off them that made me want to ramp up my drinking to feel better and "kill time" but we see where that leads. I haven't called Mary yet-- I got completely preoccupied with the animation project day-in day-out, nights, once I felt better enough and got away from a 2-week substance abuse kindergarten program (satisfy family, probation officer). What are you doing with yourself these days? On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 7:43 PM, mike coleman wrote: > Owen I was going to mail you soon and see if you're OK > I see you are > FABULOUS!!!! > > > On 3/14/09, Owen O'Neill wrote: > > > > OK I just spent the whole week making this scene: an automind-controlled > > F104 takes out Earth's sky defense system "Rocket Jesi" in Para-World 6. > > > > 26 seconds 6.5MB mp4 H.264, no sound. More to come, sometime! > > > > http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=292215db1fd432e8d2db6fb9a8902bda > > > > > > And THX(!) for all the great feedback on the last edit I linked to back > in > > November. The "dogfight" scene at the end was mostly stock footage that's > > going to be scrapped except for about 15 seconds of it. There's this > whole > > aerial scene, the mutiny on the zeppelin, and the intro scene still left > to > > finish: intro will make the whole thing a little less awkward as far as > > having a plot goes. It's a paranoid radio announcement accompanied by > > confusing flickering images-- I'm looking for about 1000 pictures of > large > > equipment installations, space scenes, star charts, diagrams of > > nuclear/propulsion systems, rockets, random interesting things to be > > flashed > > on a screen real fast. > > > > Best of the best, veracities, etc., > > > > Owen > > > > -- > > .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, > > > -- .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 20:08:30 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 18:08:30 -0600 Subject: OFF: Cartoon (an EXTRAVAGANZA full of HW references!) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hangin' tight with my man Schuesler and blasting people off my Hawkcandy and with that Hawkcandy Dave brought forth, "yes we are, we're gonna change the world" On 3/14/09, Owen O'Neill wrote: > > Hi Mike! Yeah except for a little bit last weekend I've been off alcohol > now > for almost 4 weeks, and recovering fast enough. I got back on amphetamines > (for the time being) which has helped ALOT. It was being off them that made > me want to ramp up my drinking to feel better and "kill time" but we see > where that leads. I haven't called Mary yet-- I got completely preoccupied > with the animation project day-in day-out, nights, once I felt better > enough > and got away from a 2-week substance abuse kindergarten program (satisfy > family, probation officer). What are you doing with yourself these days? > > On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 7:43 PM, mike coleman >wrote: > > > Owen I was going to mail you soon and see if you're OK > > I see you are > > FABULOUS!!!! > > > > > > On 3/14/09, Owen O'Neill wrote: > > > > > > OK I just spent the whole week making this scene: an > automind-controlled > > > F104 takes out Earth's sky defense system "Rocket Jesi" in Para-World > 6. > > > > > > 26 seconds 6.5MB mp4 H.264, no sound. More to come, sometime! > > > > > > http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=292215db1fd432e8d2db6fb9a8902bda > > > > > > > > > And THX(!) for all the great feedback on the last edit I linked to back > > in > > > November. The "dogfight" scene at the end was mostly stock footage > that's > > > going to be scrapped except for about 15 seconds of it. There's this > > whole > > > aerial scene, the mutiny on the zeppelin, and the intro scene still > left > > to > > > finish: intro will make the whole thing a little less awkward as far as > > > having a plot goes. It's a paranoid radio announcement accompanied by > > > confusing flickering images-- I'm looking for about 1000 pictures of > > large > > > equipment installations, space scenes, star charts, diagrams of > > > nuclear/propulsion systems, rockets, random interesting things to be > > > flashed > > > on a screen real fast. > > > > > > Best of the best, veracities, etc., > > > > > > Owen > > > > > > -- > > > .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, > > > > > > > > > -- > .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, > From jmajk at INDY.RR.COM Sat Mar 14 21:06:06 2009 From: jmajk at INDY.RR.COM (John Majka) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 21:06:06 -0400 Subject: some HW shirts on Ebay Message-ID: I've put four different Hawkwind shirts up on Ebay, for those who are interested. I've had them for ages and have finally decided to sell them as they are size XL, whereas I am definitely an S! John Majka From owen.01 at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 21:18:00 2009 From: owen.01 at GMAIL.COM (Owen O'Neill) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 21:18:00 -0400 Subject: HW Kollektor Report/ B Stewart? In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903141417s1a11bdc5y1b649394099a6e82@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: How many different releases are there of SR2? Once I had something called "Space Ritual Vol. 2". I got it in 1997 from Tower Records, the only HW album they had, but I haven't seen it anywhere since. I don't know if it's the same album of that title that's on amazon, bc that's not the same cover art, which IIRC had something to do with a square and a group of parallel lines sticking out of it, possibly Barney Bubbles. It had the same order of tracks as part 2 of the double album, with no Silver Machine. It may have just been a remaster and not from different performances? You can identify it easily in one place at least by hearing the end of "welcome to the Future", where there's some loud stomping as opposed to the double album. On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 5:17 PM, mike coleman wrote: > On 3/14/09, Steve Freight wrote: > > > > Mike - have I missed a link to this one somewhere? > > > Hi Steve, I don't know, but this item was disscused previously when Johan > outbid Wilfried Schuesler, whom I was expecting to win it.....and now we > all > have our copies > here is a link to the one I bought so you can see it: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180332755806&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dp0.m38.l1313%26_nkw%3D180332755806%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&_rdc=1 > > > > SR2 doen't have silver machine as you will know so what is this - A > hybrid > > of 2 releases? > > > > You'd be exactly right...if this item were to appear on the Starfarer > site, > > and I do not know if it does, I feel certain it would be reported as one > > more Space Ritual 2 outchurning (which it is), with the encore Silver > > Machine added from Yuri Gagarin(and I am going on assumption that is what > we > > have here) > > > I'm not sure what the Sonic Attack this one has before SM, I am getting > old.......the other CD like this I bought on LASERLIGHT label, curiously > has > a later version of Urban Guerilla hybridized into it...I know that item > does > apper on Starfarer site.... > -- .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, From smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 21:48:31 2009 From: smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM (Jonathan Smith) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 09:48:31 +0800 Subject: Orgasmatron ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It was a poor bootleg. 2009/3/13 Steve Bishop > Guess all you Kollektors have seen this ? > > > http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ULTRA-RARE-HAWKWIND-CD-ORGASMATRON_W0QQitemZ190290836360QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CDsDVDs_CDs_CDs_GL?hash=item190290836360&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A16%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 > > --- > > This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you > are > not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please > notify the sender immediately and delete this e-mail. Any unauthorized > copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is > strictly > forbidden. > > Please refer to http://www.db.com/en/content/eu_disclosures.htm for > additional > EU corporate and regulatory disclosures. From owen.01 at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 21:55:59 2009 From: owen.01 at GMAIL.COM (Owen O'Neill) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 21:55:59 -0400 Subject: some HW shirts on Ebay In-Reply-To: <000601c9a50a$38498c90$6501a8c0@MAJKA> Message-ID: Dear Sir, Would you furnish a link for those? On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 9:06 PM, John Majka wrote: > I've put four different Hawkwind shirts up on Ebay, for those who are > interested. I've had them for ages and have finally decided to sell them as > they are size XL, whereas I am definitely an S! > John Majka > -- .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, From jmajk at INDY.RR.COM Sat Mar 14 23:15:01 2009 From: jmajk at INDY.RR.COM (John Majka) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 23:15:01 -0400 Subject: some HW shirts on Ebay Message-ID: You can see those here... http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZwavegeneratorQQhtZ-1 John Majka >Dear Sir, Would you furnish a link for those? On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 9:06 PM, John Majka wrote: > I've put four different Hawkwind shirts up on Ebay, for those who are > interested. I've had them for ages and have finally decided to sell them > as > they are size XL, whereas I am definitely an S! > John Majka > -- .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, From owen.01 at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 23:50:51 2009 From: owen.01 at GMAIL.COM (Owen O'Neill) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 23:50:51 -0400 Subject: some HW shirts on Ebay In-Reply-To: <000c01c9a51c$3a854690$6501a8c0@MAJKA> Message-ID: Oh, the Laughter of Carthage. I read the first 2 in that series probably 2 or 3 years before he finished the third. I NEVER usually read novels that thick. On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 11:15 PM, John Majka wrote: > You can see those here... > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZwavegeneratorQQhtZ-1 > John Majka > > > > Dear Sir, >> > > Would you furnish a link for those? > > On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 9:06 PM, John Majka wrote: > > I've put four different Hawkwind shirts up on Ebay, for those who are >> interested. I've had them for ages and have finally decided to sell them >> as >> they are size XL, whereas I am definitely an S! >> John Majka >> >> > > > -- > .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, > -- .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, From owen.01 at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 14 23:53:43 2009 From: owen.01 at GMAIL.COM (Owen O'Neill) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 23:53:43 -0400 Subject: some HW shirts on Ebay In-Reply-To: Message-ID: No, wait that was the second book. Read it already. Good book. On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 11:50 PM, Owen O'Neill wrote: > Oh, the Laughter of Carthage. I read the first 2 in that series probably 2 > or 3 years before he finished the third. I NEVER usually read novels that > thick. > > > On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 11:15 PM, John Majka wrote: > >> You can see those here... >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZwavegeneratorQQhtZ-1 >> John Majka >> >> >> >> Dear Sir, >>> >> >> Would you furnish a link for those? >> >> On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 9:06 PM, John Majka wrote: >> >> I've put four different Hawkwind shirts up on Ebay, for those who are >>> interested. I've had them for ages and have finally decided to sell them >>> as >>> they are size XL, whereas I am definitely an S! >>> John Majka >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, >> > > > > -- > .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, > -- .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Sun Mar 15 06:12:50 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 04:12:50 -0600 Subject: HW Kollektor Report/ B Stewart? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: oh it gets nasty if we start adding in things like "Ridicule", which contaon only half of it I have always considered volume 2 an entirely diefferent bird than the actual SR, even though there may be some cross-over, the mastering or whatever makes all the tracks sound different to me I think I have like 3 versions of it with the original SR 2 artwork (yellow on black), and then it goes out from there My mind isn't grabbing what you describe below, that sounds more like the original Yuri Gagarin art or something I'm getting confused very quickly, but it did occur to me that the screaming Sonic Attack on this German version which precedes Silver Machine is likely just a patch-in of the version from Yuri as well On 3/14/09, Owen O'Neill wrote: > > How many different releases are there of SR2? Once I had something called > "Space Ritual Vol. 2". I got it in 1997 from Tower Records, the only HW > album they had, but I haven't seen it anywhere since. I don't know if it's > the same album of that title that's on amazon, bc that's not the same cover > art, which IIRC had something to do with a square and a group of parallel > lines sticking out of it, possibly Barney Bubbles. It had the same order of > tracks as part 2 of the double album, with no Silver Machine. It may have > just been a remaster and not from different performances? You can identify > it easily in one place at least by hearing the end of "welcome to the > Future", where there's some loud stomping as opposed to the double album. > > > > > On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 5:17 PM, mike coleman >wrote: > > > On 3/14/09, Steve Freight wrote: > > > > > > Mike - have I missed a link to this one somewhere? > > > > > > Hi Steve, I don't know, but this item was disscused previously when Johan > > outbid Wilfried Schuesler, whom I was expecting to win it.....and now we > > all > > have our copies > > here is a link to the one I bought so you can see it: > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180332755806&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dp0.m38.l1313%26_nkw%3D180332755806%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&_rdc=1 > > > > > > > SR2 doen't have silver machine as you will know so what is this - A > > hybrid > > > of 2 releases? > > > > > > You'd be exactly right...if this item were to appear on the Starfarer > > site, > > > and I do not know if it does, I feel certain it would be reported as > one > > > more Space Ritual 2 outchurning (which it is), with the encore Silver > > > Machine added from Yuri Gagarin(and I am going on assumption that is > what > > we > > > have here) > > > > > > I'm not sure what the Sonic Attack this one has before SM, I am getting > > old.......the other CD like this I bought on LASERLIGHT label, curiously > > has > > a later version of Urban Guerilla hybridized into it...I know that item > > does > > apper on Starfarer site.... > > > > > > -- > .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, > From cea at CARLAZ.COM Sat Mar 14 08:43:10 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 07:43:10 -0500 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <885B5241-2D2C-4750-8005-DC90A6336CBF@gromit.dlib.vt.edu> Message-ID: On 13 Mar 2009, at 09:40, Paul Mather wrote: >> Blackie Lawless, refers to the >> bass as "the instrument of ignorance", in regards to his switching >> to the >> guitar, and then there was Dave Mustaine saying "Bass, that's just >> one step >> up from the kazoo"..... > > Both of those people have obviously never heard Allen Woody play. Amen. Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Sun Mar 15 13:32:29 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 11:32:29 -0600 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I was kinda hoping the thread had died, but want to add that I realise different strokes for different folks for instance, I can't in my wildest dreams imagine wanting to be a drummer (what THE HELL was my dad thinking when I was 4?), nor a bass player, well, ok, I can IMAGINE it in light of just going along for a ride, but cannot imagine experssing myself musically with those tools but I realise those rhythms and sounds are primary to others just being honest and apology if needed for quoting the 80's metalheads my only reason was humor nothing serious On 3/14/09, Carl Edlund Anderson wrote: > > On 13 Mar 2009, at 09:40, Paul Mather wrote: > >> Blackie Lawless, refers to the >>> bass as "the instrument of ignorance", in regards to his switching to the >>> guitar, and then there was Dave Mustaine saying "Bass, that's just one >>> step >>> up from the kazoo"..... >>> >> >> Both of those people have obviously never heard Allen Woody play. >> > > Amen. > > Cheers, > Carl > > -- > Carl Edlund Anderson > http://www.carlaz.com/ > From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Sun Mar 15 13:39:08 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 11:39:08 -0600 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903151032u1e301840ye0da29d095299609@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: expressing The keyapd is nasty and it bounces as I bang loudly hepecking like the moron I am, on a pillow because I buy Hawkwind items rather than furniture On 3/15/09, mike coleman wrote: > > I was kinda hoping the thread had died, but want to add that I realise > different strokes for different folks > for instance, I can't in my wildest dreams imagine wanting to be a drummer > (what THE HELL was my dad thinking when I was 4?), nor a bass player, well, > ok, I can IMAGINE it in light of just going along for a ride, but cannot > imagine experssing myself musically with those tools > but I realise those rhythms and sounds are primary to others > just being honest and apology if needed for quoting the 80's metalheads > my only reason was humor > nothing serious > > > On 3/14/09, Carl Edlund Anderson wrote: >> >> On 13 Mar 2009, at 09:40, Paul Mather wrote: >> >>> Blackie Lawless, refers to the >>>> bass as "the instrument of ignorance", in regards to his switching to >>>> the >>>> guitar, and then there was Dave Mustaine saying "Bass, that's just one >>>> step >>>> up from the kazoo"..... >>>> >>> >>> Both of those people have obviously never heard Allen Woody play. >>> >> >> Amen. >> >> Cheers, >> Carl >> >> -- >> Carl Edlund Anderson >> http://www.carlaz.com/ >> > > From StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Sun Mar 15 14:16:38 2009 From: StevePXR5 at AOL.COM (StevePXR5 at AOL.COM) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 14:16:38 EDT Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview Message-ID: I can understand wanting to be a drummer, but I've no idea what your dad was thinking when you were four. I had a go at drumming (on my brothers kit and at a wedding in France, at which I was the best man) and was hopeless... the hands and feet co-ordination was crap! I fared better on guitar but didn't keep it up (oo err missus) and I wish I had. I've still got the acoustic and go up occasionally, get the slide on my finger and have a blast. I have lots of ideas for creating music but can't do it. Frustrating, and I admire the people (some of them anyway) that it comes naturally to. Then there are people who can play, but can't produce an original idea between them. That's why there are so many damned tribute bands. Now I'm getting started on a rant. Steve In a message dated 15/03/2009 17:33:26 GMT Standard Time, insect.brain at GMAIL.COM writes: I can't in my wildest dreams imagine wanting to be a drummer (what THE HELL was my dad thinking when I was 4?), From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Sun Mar 15 14:59:18 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 12:59:18 -0600 Subject: HW: Alan Davey interview In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Folks, Fans, People, whatever you think yourselves, please pardon this top post. Steve I just agree and agree and relate with you on all these accounts I am an honest man, but I am never here to truly insult anyone I absolutely hate the tribute stuff, I simply do not understand it, however I fully realise this is just me and my Hawkwind buddy here locally (for lack of another term) can't get enough of that stuff As I have said before, there are people who can play "Stairway To Heaven" backwards and forwards and sideways too, but there is nothing under the surface (original) as for the drum kit when I was four, oh my god I'll NEVER forget those shredded cymbals I think drummers are cool as hell, and I just can't stop loving Simon King, but the natural want of being a rhythm section just isn't there I'm very aware that all my mails have had typos.......yeeesh On 3/15/09, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > > > I can understand wanting to be a drummer, but I've no idea what your > dad was > thinking when you were four. > I had a go at drumming (on my brothers kit and at a wedding in France, at > which I was the best man) and was hopeless... the hands and feet > co-ordination > was crap! > I fared better on guitar but didn't keep it up (oo err missus) and I wish I > had. I've still got the acoustic and go up occasionally, get the slide on > my > finger and have a blast. > I have lots of ideas for creating music but can't do it. Frustrating, and I > admire the people (some of them anyway) that it comes naturally to. > Then there are people who can play, but can't produce an original idea > between them. That's why there are so many damned tribute bands. > Now I'm getting started on a rant. > > Steve > > In a message dated 15/03/2009 17:33:26 GMT Standard Time, > insect.brain at GMAIL.COM writes: > > I can't in my wildest dreams imagine wanting to be a drummer > (what THE HELL was my dad thinking when I was 4?), > > > > From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Sun Mar 15 15:46:04 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:46:04 +0000 Subject: OFF: Roadburn '09 & Farflung/White Hills tour In-Reply-To: <742897.30687.qm@web33205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 11:32:01AM -0800, Keith Henderson typed out: > So, who was lucky enough to get tickets to this year's Roadburn > festival in Tilburg NL? Lots of great bands like always, including > Amon Duul 2, Orange Goblin, Bari Watts, but especially Farflung and > White Hills. For those that missed out on this long-sold-out show, > note that Farflung and White Hills will continue touring together over > much of central Europe (though not in Britain), White Hills continuing > on alone after the first phase by doing even more shows in southern > Europe (Portugal, Spain, Italy). Argh! No, I didn't get tickets. No-one to go with this year and besides it sold out so quickly that I couldn't. Even Farflung isn't enough to change my mind about that but it's just vastly annoying that again I miss them. I am fated never to see this band live. I do wonder why no British leg of the tour. Is our live scene really that bad? Well, yes, I suppose I knew that it is. Maybe it's time for another trip to Vienna... > Farflung's new stuff is just too good for words. If you are too > impatient to wait for new HW stuff, go see Farflung and absolutely > pick up a copy of A Wound in Eternity. On Meteor City label in > Arizona. allthatisheavy.com Note that there are two versions, one ltd > ed. digipack CD with two bonus tracks. Also a double vinyl I think. Dagnabbit Keith. I didn't know about the limited edition either. Now I may have to go sulk. Yours, Jon ObLP: ST37 - _Secret Society_ -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Sun Mar 15 16:12:06 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 14:12:06 -0600 Subject: OFF: Roadburn '09 & Farflung/White Hills tour In-Reply-To: <20090315194604.GN4096@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: On 3/15/09, Jonathan Jarrett wrote: > > Dagnabbit Keith. I didn't know about the limited edition either. > Now I may have to go sulk. Yours, > Jon I just gave my copy to Trev without even looking in the booklet. I am sure Larry Urick is pleased where it went, but in typical Trev fashion, he's already lost it How's them bonus cuts??? where's a cheapo?>?? From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Mon Mar 16 06:04:15 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 10:04:15 +0000 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show In-Reply-To: <126A561607A76D4B90A6B67641C593E922B4F2796E@exdkmbx005.corp.novocorp.net> Message-ID: On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 09:08:23AM +0100, SHLL (Scott Heller) typed out: > I have been tossing some mails back and forth with a few about the > Portchester Hall gigs in August and I now, really curious what > ex-hawkwind members could actually show up and play. I wonder if they > have announced this without actually signing anyone on board. If we > make a list of the ex-members, besides Huw Lloyd Langton (who I am not > really sure can play electric space rock anymore as he was a disaster > the last two times I saw him), who else is there: > > These people will not play with Dave and Co (at least I don't think): > > Nik, dave anderson, simon house, alan davey, lemmy, jerry richards, > ron tree, terry ollis, Thomas Crimble, michael moorcock (probably too > ill), adrian shaw, Mick Slattery, Steve Swindells, Harvey Bainbridge, > Bridget Wishart, Danny Thompson.. This looks like a game for the cynics to play! I think there are two different sets here, those who won't play with Dave & Co. and those with whom Dave won't play, for example Nik in the former camp and Ron in the latter. If Dave was prepared to relax a bit about the exiles (and you know, pay in advance) I think this number could be reduced. > Maybe: > > Crum, dik mik, del dettmar, Stacia, martin Griffiths, alan powell, > Paul Rudolph (haven't heard of him in years...), Ginger Baker, Andy > Anderson, Arthur Brown, Steve Hale, John Harrison > > I probably have missed a few but it seems to me that Dave only has a > few pretty obscure Hawkwind members to choose from... > > What do people think or predict?? Well, let's have a go: Dave himself is obviously in Mick Slattery possibly not out of solidarity with the Ritual but who knows? John Harrison lost in showbiz and probably not `match-fit' Nik, yes, well I don't think so, nor do I think it would be a good gig if it could be arranged Terry Ollis, as Mr Slattery really Dik Mik, don't see why not to be honest though I may not know enough Huw, almost without doubt Thomas Crimble, as Mick Slattery but personally I hope he stays clear Dave Anderson, I can't imagine he's welcome in the fold Del, has worked more with Nik than anyone in recent years but might be willing if paid for transport Lemmy, despite what Scott says I think would be in if paid Twink, ha ha please no Simon King, no personal grief as far as I know but wasn't in shape to play for Hawkestra and I don't suppose he'd do it for this less, even if he still can (but if he could it would be ace) Simon House, I guess might but he doesn't seem to be well enough to play with anyone live at the moment Alan Powell has been a Nikwind drummer in the USA and played Hawkestra II so I guess is Nik's before Dave's but I don't see why he shouldn't Moorcock would at least do telephone vocals again I'm sure Paul Rudolph seems no longer to be on the map for anyone Adrian Shaw wouldn't, and that's that Harvey I guess also wouldn't, which is sad, at least not without a lot of back wages Martin Griffin keeps turning up at Hawkfest and therefore I guess is in Steve Swindells is clearly Nik's friend but does anyone know that he wouldn't play with the genuine Hawks if asked? Don't see why not myself Tim Blake obviously yes Ginger Baker well never mind Keith Hale is out there and I can't see why he wouldn't if asked Dead Fred won't play live for anyone these days Andy Anderson isn't playing any more, is he? Rik Martinez, unknown Clive Deamer probably has better things to do but would if offered money I'm sure Alan Davey, oh come on, if Lemmy was on and Dave apologised he'd be back for it Danny Thompson, Scott seems to know of bad blood that I don't, I would have thought he'd be in Richard Chadwick, yes Bridget, I would have thought might do it for the one gig given as she seems to be making music again Steve Bemand, don't know anything here Ron Tree is I guess not welcome but Dave should get over it and let him front, it would be brilliant one more time Jerry Richards probably won't come back Crum might well Captain Rizz could probably not be kept away Dibs is in Steve Taylor and Steve Hayes presumably never again Keith Kniveton, well I have no idea what happened there Jeremy Huggett, as far as is known available, right? Arthur Brown, no Keith Barton, I don't know here either Matthew Wright, obviously would Niall Hone, is in So that gives us, well the regular line-up plus Huw, Martin Griffin, Keith Hale, Bridget, Crum, Rizz and Matthew Wright as likelies, which starts to look like a dual-drummer _Choose Your Masques_ sort of line-up with guest vocalists and lots of keyboard. Not exactly a 40th anniversary gig in and of itself but probably worth seeing. Then if we add possibles, guest appearances from Lemmy, if Lemmy Alan, Steve Swindells, Del, Dik Mik... I mean I think the problem here is that because Hawkwind's greatest through-put has been in drummers and keyboardists it would be very easy to completely crowd out a stage, and indeed a setlist, with keyboard and percussion. To make it a viable *performance* I think Dave either needs to stick to that core above or whatever is really viable, or else apologise enough or pay enough to get Ron, Jerry and Alan back on for the gig, in an ideal world Simon House and Keith Kniveton too, and basically play like it was 2001 again. I know I keep harking back to that year but it was a brilliant line-up. What I *don't* think he should do is try to get as many ex-members on stage at once as all they could really do is a chorus sing-along of `Silver Machine'. Nik's Hawkestra II was as close as anyone should ever get to that and I was amazed that worked as well as it did. Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK Mon Mar 16 06:10:18 2009 From: Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK (Steve Pond) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 10:10:18 +0000 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show In-Reply-To: <20090316100415.GP4096@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 10:04:15 +0000, you sent through the ether: >Dead Fred won't play live for anyone these days Dead Fred will play live for anyone you can't stop him, it's a compulsion.. And as Krankschaft we will be doing gigs this year. -S. From steve.bishop at DB.COM Mon Mar 16 06:11:44 2009 From: steve.bishop at DB.COM (Steve Bishop) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 10:11:44 +0000 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show In-Reply-To: <20090316100415.GP4096@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: Sorry if this has been gone over before but I wasn't aware there was any major prob between Ron or Arthur and Dave ? I thought Ron had been 'moved on' but that he understood the reasons why and I'm not sure I ever read what happened with Arthur ........... haven't got that far in Ian Abrahams book yet !! BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List wrote on 16/03/2009 10:04:15: > On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 09:08:23AM +0100, SHLL (Scott Heller) typed out: > > I have been tossing some mails back and forth with a few about the > > Portchester Hall gigs in August and I now, really curious what > > ex-hawkwind members could actually show up and play. I wonder if they > > have announced this without actually signing anyone on board. If we > > make a list of the ex-members, besides Huw Lloyd Langton (who I am not > > really sure can play electric space rock anymore as he was a disaster > > the last two times I saw him), who else is there: > > > > These people will not play with Dave and Co (at least I don't think): > > > > Nik, dave anderson, simon house, alan davey, lemmy, jerry richards, > > ron tree, terry ollis, Thomas Crimble, michael moorcock (probably too > > ill), adrian shaw, Mick Slattery, Steve Swindells, Harvey Bainbridge, > > Bridget Wishart, Danny Thompson.. > > This looks like a game for the cynics to play! I think there are > two different sets here, those who won't play with Dave & Co. and those > with whom Dave won't play, for example Nik in the former camp and Ron in > the latter. If Dave was prepared to relax a bit about the exiles (and > you know, pay in advance) I think this number could be reduced. > > > Maybe: > > > > Crum, dik mik, del dettmar, Stacia, martin Griffiths, alan powell, > > Paul Rudolph (haven't heard of him in years...), Ginger Baker, Andy > > Anderson, Arthur Brown, Steve Hale, John Harrison > > > > I probably have missed a few but it seems to me that Dave only has a > > few pretty obscure Hawkwind members to choose from... > > > > What do people think or predict?? > > Well, let's have a go: > > Dave himself is obviously in > Mick Slattery possibly not out of solidarity with the Ritual but who > knows? > John Harrison lost in showbiz and probably not `match-fit' > Nik, yes, well I don't think so, nor do I think it would be a good gig > if it could be arranged > Terry Ollis, as Mr Slattery really > Dik Mik, don't see why not to be honest though I may not know enough > Huw, almost without doubt > Thomas Crimble, as Mick Slattery but personally I hope he stays clear > Dave Anderson, I can't imagine he's welcome in the fold > Del, has worked more with Nik than anyone in recent years but might be > willing if paid for transport > Lemmy, despite what Scott says I think would be in if paid > Twink, ha ha please no > Simon King, no personal grief as far as I know but wasn't in shape to > play for Hawkestra and I don't suppose he'd do it for this less, > even if he still can (but if he could it would be ace) > Simon House, I guess might but he doesn't seem to be well enough to play > with anyone live at the moment > Alan Powell has been a Nikwind drummer in the USA and played Hawkestra > II so I guess is Nik's before Dave's but I don't see why he > shouldn't > Moorcock would at least do telephone vocals again I'm sure > Paul Rudolph seems no longer to be on the map for anyone > Adrian Shaw wouldn't, and that's that > Harvey I guess also wouldn't, which is sad, at least not without a lot > of back wages > Martin Griffin keeps turning up at Hawkfest and therefore I guess is in > Steve Swindells is clearly Nik's friend but does anyone know that he > wouldn't play with the genuine Hawks if asked? Don't see why not > myself > Tim Blake obviously yes > Ginger Baker well never mind > Keith Hale is out there and I can't see why he wouldn't if asked > Dead Fred won't play live for anyone these days > Andy Anderson isn't playing any more, is he? > Rik Martinez, unknown > Clive Deamer probably has better things to do but would if offered money > I'm sure > Alan Davey, oh come on, if Lemmy was on and Dave apologised he'd be back > for it > Danny Thompson, Scott seems to know of bad blood that I don't, I would > have thought he'd be in > Richard Chadwick, yes > Bridget, I would have thought might do it for the one gig given as she > seems to be making music again > Steve Bemand, don't know anything here > Ron Tree is I guess not welcome but Dave should get over it and let him > front, it would be brilliant one more time > Jerry Richards probably won't come back > Crum might well > Captain Rizz could probably not be kept away > Dibs is in > Steve Taylor and Steve Hayes presumably never again > Keith Kniveton, well I have no idea what happened there > Jeremy Huggett, as far as is known available, right? > Arthur Brown, no > Keith Barton, I don't know here either > Matthew Wright, obviously would > Niall Hone, is in > > So that gives us, well the regular line-up plus Huw, Martin Griffin, > Keith Hale, Bridget, Crum, Rizz and Matthew Wright as likelies, which > starts to look like a dual-drummer _Choose Your Masques_ sort of > line-up with guest vocalists and lots of keyboard. Not exactly a 40th > anniversary gig in and of itself but probably worth seeing. Then if we > add possibles, guest appearances from Lemmy, if Lemmy Alan, Steve > Swindells, Del, Dik Mik... > > I mean I think the problem here is that because Hawkwind's > greatest through-put has been in drummers and keyboardists it would be > very easy to completely crowd out a stage, and indeed a setlist, with > keyboard and percussion. To make it a viable *performance* I think Dave > either needs to stick to that core above or whatever is really viable, > or else apologise enough or pay enough to get Ron, Jerry and Alan back > on for the gig, in an ideal world Simon House and Keith Kniveton too, > and basically play like it was 2001 again. I know I keep harking back to > that year but it was a brilliant line-up. What I *don't* think he should > do is try to get as many ex-members on stage at once as all they could > really do is a chorus sing-along of `Silver Machine'. Nik's Hawkestra II > was as close as anyone should ever get to that and I was amazed that > worked as well as it did. Yours, > Jon > > -- > "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" > (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) > Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk --- This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and delete this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. Please refer to http://www.db.com/en/content/eu_disclosures.htm for additional EU corporate and regulatory disclosures. From ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK Mon Mar 16 06:28:02 2009 From: ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Ian Abrahams) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 10:28:02 +0000 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show Message-ID: I'm not sure anybody knows what happened (if anything) with Arthur! I certainly never found out anything, nor did his own biographer as I understand it! Kris always talked warmly of Ron when he came up in discussion re the book so I don't think conclusions should be jumped to there either, Ron, by all accounts, had his own problems which are well known and in the public domain. Ian ________________________________ From: Steve Bishop To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 10:11:44 AM Subject: Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show Sorry if this has been gone over before but I wasn't aware there was any major prob between Ron or Arthur and Dave ? I thought Ron had been 'moved on' but that he understood the reasons why and I'm not sure I ever read what happened with Arthur ........... haven't got that far in Ian Abrahams book yet !! BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List wrote on 16/03/2009 10:04:15: > On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 09:08:23AM +0100, SHLL (Scott Heller) typed out: > > I have been tossing some mails back and forth with a few about the > > Portchester Hall gigs in August and I now, really curious what > > ex-hawkwind members could actually show up and play. I wonder if they > > have announced this without actually signing anyone on board. If we > > make a list of the ex-members, besides Huw Lloyd Langton (who I am not > > really sure can play electric space rock anymore as he was a disaster > > the last two times I saw him), who else is there: > > > > These people will not play with Dave and Co (at least I don't think): > > > > Nik, dave anderson, simon house, alan davey, lemmy, jerry richards, > > ron tree, terry ollis, Thomas Crimble, michael moorcock (probably too > > ill), adrian shaw, Mick Slattery, Steve Swindells, Harvey Bainbridge, > > Bridget Wishart, Danny Thompson.. > >? ? This looks like a game for the cynics to play! I think there are > two different sets here, those who won't play with Dave & Co. and those > with whom Dave won't play, for example Nik in the former camp and Ron in > the latter. If Dave was prepared to relax a bit about the exiles (and > you know, pay in advance) I think this number could be reduced. > > > Maybe: > > > > Crum, dik mik, del dettmar, Stacia, martin Griffiths, alan powell, > > Paul Rudolph (haven't heard of him in years...), Ginger Baker, Andy > > Anderson, Arthur Brown, Steve Hale, John Harrison > > > > I probably have missed a few but it seems to me that Dave only has a > > few pretty obscure Hawkwind members to choose from... > > > > What do people think or predict?? > >? ? Well, let's have a go: > > Dave himself is obviously in > Mick Slattery possibly not out of solidarity with the Ritual but who >? ? knows? > John Harrison lost in showbiz and probably not `match-fit' > Nik, yes, well I don't think so, nor do I think it would be a good gig >? ? if it could be arranged > Terry Ollis, as Mr Slattery really > Dik Mik, don't see why not to be honest though I may not know enough > Huw, almost without doubt > Thomas Crimble, as Mick Slattery but personally I hope he stays clear > Dave Anderson, I can't imagine he's welcome in the fold > Del, has worked more with Nik than anyone in recent years but might be >? ? willing if paid for transport > Lemmy, despite what Scott says I think would be in if paid > Twink, ha ha please no > Simon King, no personal grief as far as I know but wasn't in shape to >? ? play for Hawkestra and I don't suppose he'd do it for this less, >? ? even if he still can (but if he could it would be ace) > Simon House, I guess might but he doesn't seem to be well enough to play >? ? with anyone live at the moment > Alan Powell has been a Nikwind drummer in the USA and played Hawkestra >? ? II so I guess is Nik's before Dave's but I don't see why he >? ? shouldn't > Moorcock would at least do telephone vocals again I'm sure > Paul Rudolph seems no longer to be on the map for anyone > Adrian Shaw wouldn't, and that's that > Harvey I guess also wouldn't, which is sad, at least not without a lot >? ? of back wages > Martin Griffin keeps turning up at Hawkfest and therefore I guess is in > Steve Swindells is clearly Nik's friend but does anyone know that he >? ? ? ? wouldn't play with the genuine Hawks if asked? Don't see why not >? ? myself > Tim Blake obviously yes > Ginger Baker well never mind > Keith Hale is out there and I can't see why he wouldn't if asked > Dead Fred won't play live for anyone these days > Andy Anderson isn't playing any more, is he? > Rik Martinez, unknown > Clive Deamer probably has better things to do but would if offered money >? ? I'm sure > Alan Davey, oh come on, if Lemmy was on and Dave apologised he'd be back >? ? for it > Danny Thompson, Scott seems to know of bad blood that I don't, I would >? ? have thought he'd be in > Richard Chadwick, yes > Bridget, I would have thought might do it for the one gig given as she >? ? seems to be making music again > Steve Bemand, don't know anything here > Ron Tree is I guess not welcome but Dave should get over it and let him >? ? front, it would be brilliant one more time > Jerry Richards probably won't come back > Crum might well > Captain Rizz could probably not be kept away > Dibs is in > Steve Taylor and Steve Hayes presumably never again > Keith Kniveton, well I have no idea what happened there > Jeremy Huggett, as far as is known available, right? > Arthur Brown, no > Keith Barton, I don't know here either > Matthew Wright, obviously would > Niall Hone, is in > > So that gives us, well the regular line-up plus Huw, Martin Griffin, > Keith Hale, Bridget, Crum, Rizz and Matthew Wright as likelies, which > starts to look like a dual-drummer _Choose Your Masques_ sort of > line-up with guest vocalists and lots of keyboard. Not exactly a 40th > anniversary gig in and of itself but probably worth seeing. Then if we > add possibles, guest appearances from Lemmy, if Lemmy Alan, Steve > Swindells, Del, Dik Mik... > >? ? I mean I think the problem here is that because Hawkwind's > greatest through-put has been in drummers and keyboardists it would be > very easy to completely crowd out a stage, and indeed a setlist, with > keyboard and percussion. To make it a viable *performance* I think Dave > either needs to stick to that core above or whatever is really viable, > or else apologise enough or pay enough to get Ron, Jerry and Alan back > on for the gig, in an ideal world Simon House and Keith Kniveton too, > and basically play like it was 2001 again. I know I keep harking back to > that year but it was a brilliant line-up. What I *don't* think he should > do is try to get as many ex-members on stage at once as all they could > really do is a chorus sing-along of `Silver Machine'. Nik's Hawkestra II > was as close as anyone should ever get to that and I was amazed that > worked as well as it did. Yours, >? ? ? ? ? ? ? Jon > > -- > "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" >? ? ? ? (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) >? Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk --- This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and delete this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. Please refer to http://www.db.com/en/content/eu_disclosures.htm for additional EU corporate and regulatory disclosures. From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 16 07:43:33 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 04:43:33 -0700 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show Message-ID: Ron is one of the folks from this strange and ever-evolving cast of characters that I would most like to see back on spaceship Hawkwind... Let me guess - Ron's problems were drug related?? Crikey I'm starting to write like coleman.... Steve -----Original Message----- From: Steve Bishop Date: Monday, Mar 16, 2009 6:14 am Subject: Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sorry if this has been gone over before but I wasn't aware there was any major prob between Ron or Arthur and Dave ? I thought Ron had been 'moved on' but that he understood the reasons why and I'm not sure I ever read what happened with Arthur ........... haven't got that far in Ian Abrahams book yet !! BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List wrote on 16/03/2009 10:04:15: > On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 09:08:23AM +0100, SHLL (Scott Heller) typed out: > > I have been tossing some mails back and forth with a few about the > > Portchester Hall gigs in August and I now, really curious what > > ex-hawkwind members could actually show up and play. I wonder if they > > have announced this without actually signing anyone on board. If we > > make a list of the ex-members, besides Huw Lloyd Langton (who I am not > > really sure can play electric space rock anymore as he was a disaster > > the last two times I saw him), who else is there: > > > > These people will not play with Dave and Co (at least I don't think): > > > > Nik, dave anderson, simon house, alan davey, lemmy, jerry richards, > > ron tree, terry ollis, Thomas Crimble, michael moorcock (probably too > > ill), adrian shaw, Mick Slattery, Steve Swindells, Harvey Bainbridge, > > Bridget Wishart, Danny Thompson.. > > This looks like a game for the cynics to play! I think there are > two different sets here, those who won't play with Dave & Co. and those > with whom Dave won't play, for example Nik in the former camp and Ron in > the latter. If Dave was prepared to relax a bit about the exiles (and > you know, pay in advance) I think this number could be reduced. > > > Maybe: > > > > Crum, dik mik, del dettmar, Stacia, martin Griffiths, alan powell, > > Paul Rudolph (haven't heard of him in years...), Ginger Baker, Andy > > Anderson, Arthur Brown, Steve Hale, John Harrison > > > > I probably have missed a few but it seems to me that Dave only has a > > few pretty obscure Hawkwind members to choose from... > > > > What do people think or predict?? > > Well, let's have a go: > > Dave himself is obviously in > Mick Slattery possibly not out of solidarity with the Ritual but who > knows? > John Harrison lost in showbiz and probably not `match-fit' > Nik, yes, well I don't think so, nor do I think it would be a good gig > if it could be arranged > Terry Ollis, as Mr Slattery reall From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 16 07:55:12 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 04:55:12 -0700 Subject: HW: Best bit torrents? Message-ID: So, what are the HW shows that are most worth torrenting, in terms of performance and sound quality? No official releases please. Steve From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 16 10:58:11 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:58:11 -0600 Subject: HW SR poster Message-ID: I'm filling in for Coleman today, because he forgets to clean his underwear and then he goes ape-s#t He said somebody might want to put on some cheap 3-D glasses and simulate the Hawkwind experience on LSD circa 1972 or so http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280321962899&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm38%26_nkw%3D280321962899%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&_rdc=1 From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Mon Mar 16 12:44:34 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:44:34 -0400 Subject: HW SR poster In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903160758o7986f08bx721ebbf0842a4ca4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Is he going to provide the LSD? Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of trev Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 10:58 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: HW SR poster I'm filling in for Coleman today, because he forgets to clean his underwear and then he goes ape-s#t He said somebody might want to put on some cheap 3-D glasses and simulate the Hawkwind experience on LSD circa 1972 or so http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280321962899&ru=http%3A%2 F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm38%26_nkw%3D28032196289 9%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&_rdc=1 From owen.01 at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 16 15:11:27 2009 From: owen.01 at GMAIL.COM (Owen O'Neill) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 15:11:27 -0400 Subject: HW SR poster In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903160758o7986f08bx721ebbf0842a4ca4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: 3D glasses (I keep them next to my computer) don't do much except make the lights look brighter. Maybe the channels are washed out in the photo On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 10:58 AM, trev wrote: > I'm filling in for Coleman today, because he forgets to clean his underwear > and then he goes ape-s#t > He said somebody might want to put on some cheap 3-D glasses and simulate > the Hawkwind experience on LSD circa 1972 or so > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280321962899&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm38%26_nkw%3D280321962899%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&_rdc=1 > -- .:.;:'?;???:;:,:;';,,';':;.:,:;:;',,':;.';:?;;';-,,`?, From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 16 15:26:21 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (imposter trev) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 13:26:21 -0600 Subject: HW SR poster In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 3/16/09, mary wrote: > > Is he going to provide the LSD? > Mary No he absolutely will not. Coleman no longer believes in drug use of any kind, if it can be avoided, and fully recommends Hawkwind music as the complete and total replacement. Drugs are just one more commercialised selfish pursuit at this time, and even marijuana smoking is to be avoided if you are capable. And besides, when it started going on business cards that was apparently a problem....Of course Mike always kept it to himself mostly so he cared less. Mike would give you a hit if he could however, since he has written you off as a hopeless cause in that area and knows the grid will not tear your soul apart. Mike will also no longer be impersonating anyone, you have to have clean underwear for that, maybe just Trev From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 16 16:17:17 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 14:17:17 -0600 Subject: HW SR poster In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903161226r6ad2fdd9k2421c2e7de892d7b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: what I _MIGHT_be persuaded to deal, as I always preferred dealing Hawkwind goods as opposed to the more mundane illicit drugs, is some copies of this poster It looks like reproducing it is going to run me a bit over 30 bucks, and when I do this, I might be willing to have more made, unless Keith Kniveton says it's a no go On 3/16/09, imposter trev wrote: > > > On 3/16/09, mary wrote: >> >> Is he going to provide the LSD? >> Mary > > > No he absolutely will not. Coleman no longer believes in drug use of any > kind, if it can be avoided, and fully recommends Hawkwind music as the > complete and total replacement. Drugs are just one more commercialised > selfish pursuit at this time, and even marijuana smoking is to be avoided if > you are capable. And besides, when it started going on business cards that > was apparently a problem....Of course Mike always kept it to himself mostly > so he cared less. Mike would give you a hit if he could however, since he > has written you off as a hopeless cause in that area and knows the grid will > not tear your soul apart. > Mike will also no longer be impersonating anyone, you have to have clean > underwear for that, maybe just Trev > > > From jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM Tue Mar 17 04:35:48 2009 From: jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM (Jerry Kranitz) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 04:35:48 -0400 Subject: Aural Innovations Radio: New Space Rock Show Message-ID: http://Aural-Innovations.com MARCH 17, 2009: NEW RADIO SHOW: AURAL INNOVATIONS SPACE ROCK RADIO (#213) I've uploaded a new show from Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio (show #213). See the playlist below. Aural Innovations broadcasts 24 hours a day in both streaming and download editions. You can go directly to the Radio shows page at: http://aural-innovations.com/radio/radio.html Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio (show #213) Vert:x - "Orthostat" (from Ggantija) Space Mirrors - "Dreamland II: Area 51" (from Majestic - 12: A Hidden Presence) Psi Corp - "Tekeli-li" (excerpt) (from forthcoming Tekeli-li) Level Pi - "Elfenstaub" (from Electronic Sheep) Gravanzia - "Discordheed" (from Doom to the Doom Men) Astro Al - "Vampire Hookers From Outer Space" (from Psychedelic Drive-in Music) Joxfield ProjeX - "Oriental Flip Flop" (from Phantastique Side A & Side B) Skinbat Scramble - "The New Black/Peppermint Schnapps" (from Remains) Shiva's Quintessence - "Dolphin Dreaming" (from Cosmic Surfer) Phil Jones - "All Creatures Have Their Birth In This" (from Kaleidoscopic Journey of Shiva) Quintessence - "Dive Deep" (from Dive Deep) Psychedelic Warlords - "Cosmic Desert" (from Psychedelic Warlords) Sky Picnic - "Tea Break" (from Synesthesia) Michael Moorcock & The Deep Fix - "Entropy Tango" (from The Entropy Tango & Gloriana Demo Sessions) Ginger - "I Can See Them All" (from Live in Zurich) Mass Echo - "Overseer" (from Oblivion) Kyron x Griddle - "In The City's Keep" (from City Made of Teeth) Telestrion - "The One To Go" (from Telestrion) Fractal - "Bellerophon" (from Sequitur) Bad Liquor Pond - "Sun Fingers" (from Radiant Transmission) High Watt Electrocutions - "Psychedelic Meltdown (10:00 PM)" (from Night Songs) Raskolnikov's Dream - "Hive" (from Uriel) Electric Orange - "Hydrat" (from Live @ Burg Herzberg 2007) http://Aural-Innovations.com From shll at HAGEDORN.DK Tue Mar 17 06:19:53 2009 From: shll at HAGEDORN.DK (SHLL (Scott Heller)) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 11:19:53 +0100 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show Message-ID: Hello Interesting input Jon. Pity I won't meet you at Roadburn this year... Anyway, I am very much looking forward to the HW 40th Anniversary show. I have no pre-expectations but I don't expect a lot of folks from any of the classic line up's of Hawkwind. I think the best Dave could try to pull together would be the live 79 like line up and get Tim, Huw, Dave,...but harvey is not playing bass anymore and probably will not join anyway. This line up you wrote below: The regular line-up plus :Huw, Martin Griffin, Keith Hale, Bridget, Crum, Rizz and Matthew Wright as likelies, which starts to look like a dual-drummer _Choose Your Masques_ sort of line-up with guest vocalists and lots of keyboard. Not exactly a 40th anniversary gig in and of itself but probably worth seeing. Then if we add possibles, guest appearances from Lemmy, if Lemmy Alan, Steve Swindells, Del, Dik Mik... Not sure how exciting this would be... I actually think the best bet would be for the current line up to just play a great concert with like one song from every studio record and then invite distinct guests in for one or two songs and leave it at that. I think trying to get people in who have not played much leaves to a major drop in quality like what we saw at the Hawkestra, even though it was fun.. Just my thoughts... scott -----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Jarrett [mailto:jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK] Sent: 16. marts 2009 11:04 Subject: Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 09:08:23AM +0100, SHLL (Scott Heller) typed out: > I have been tossing some mails back and forth with a few about the > Portchester Hall gigs in August and I now, really curious what > ex-hawkwind members could actually show up and play. I wonder if they > have announced this without actually signing anyone on board. If we > make a list of the ex-members, besides Huw Lloyd Langton (who I am not > really sure can play electric space rock anymore as he was a disaster > the last two times I saw him), who else is there: > > These people will not play with Dave and Co (at least I don't think): > > Nik, dave anderson, simon house, alan davey, lemmy, jerry richards, > ron tree, terry ollis, Thomas Crimble, michael moorcock (probably too > ill), adrian shaw, Mick Slattery, Steve Swindells, Harvey Bainbridge, > Bridget Wishart, Danny Thompson.. This looks like a game for the cynics to play! I think there are two different sets here, those who won't play with Dave & Co. and those with whom Dave won't play, for example Nik in the former camp and Ron in the latter. If Dave was prepared to relax a bit about the exiles (and you know, pay in advance) I think this number could be reduced. > Maybe: > > Crum, dik mik, del dettmar, Stacia, martin Griffiths, alan powell, > Paul Rudolph (haven't heard of him in years...), Ginger Baker, Andy > Anderson, Arthur Brown, Steve Hale, John Harrison > > I probably have missed a few but it seems to me that Dave only has a > few pretty obscure Hawkwind members to choose from... > > What do people think or predict?? Well, let's have a go: Dave himself is obviously in Mick Slattery possibly not out of solidarity with the Ritual but who knows? John Harrison lost in showbiz and probably not `match-fit' Nik, yes, well I don't think so, nor do I think it would be a good gig if it could be arranged Terry Ollis, as Mr Slattery really Dik Mik, don't see why not to be honest though I may not know enough Huw, almost without doubt Thomas Crimble, as Mick Slattery but personally I hope he stays clear Dave Anderson, I can't imagine he's welcome in the fold Del, has worked more with Nik than anyone in recent years but might be willing if paid for transport Lemmy, despite what Scott says I think would be in if paid Twink, ha ha please no Simon King, no personal grief as far as I know but wasn't in shape to play for Hawkestra and I don't suppose he'd do it for this less, even if he still can (but if he could it would be ace) Simon House, I guess might but he doesn't seem to be well enough to play with anyone live at the moment Alan Powell has been a Nikwind drummer in the USA and played Hawkestra II so I guess is Nik's before Dave's but I don't see why he shouldn't Moorcock would at least do telephone vocals again I'm sure Paul Rudolph seems no longer to be on the map for anyone Adrian Shaw wouldn't, and that's that Harvey I guess also wouldn't, which is sad, at least not without a lot of back wages Martin Griffin keeps turning up at Hawkfest and therefore I guess is in Steve Swindells is clearly Nik's friend but does anyone know that he wouldn't play with the genuine Hawks if asked? Don't see why not myself Tim Blake obviously yes Ginger Baker well never mind Keith Hale is out there and I can't see why he wouldn't if asked Dead Fred won't play live for anyone these days Andy Anderson isn't playing any more, is he? Rik Martinez, unknown Clive Deamer probably has better things to do but would if offered money I'm sure Alan Davey, oh come on, if Lemmy was on and Dave apologised he'd be back for it Danny Thompson, Scott seems to know of bad blood that I don't, I would have thought he'd be in Richard Chadwick, yes Bridget, I would have thought might do it for the one gig given as she seems to be making music again Steve Bemand, don't know anything here Ron Tree is I guess not welcome but Dave should get over it and let him front, it would be brilliant one more time Jerry Richards probably won't come back Crum might well Captain Rizz could probably not be kept away Dibs is in Steve Taylor and Steve Hayes presumably never again Keith Kniveton, well I have no idea what happened there Jeremy Huggett, as far as is known available, right? Arthur Brown, no Keith Barton, I don't know here either Matthew Wright, obviously would Niall Hone, is in So that gives us, well the regular line-up plus Huw, Martin Griffin, Keith Hale, Bridget, Crum, Rizz and Matthew Wright as likelies, which starts to look like a dual-drummer _Choose Your Masques_ sort of line-up with guest vocalists and lots of keyboard. Not exactly a 40th anniversary gig in and of itself but probably worth seeing. Then if we add possibles, guest appearances from Lemmy, if Lemmy Alan, Steve Swindells, Del, Dik Mik... I mean I think the problem here is that because Hawkwind's greatest through-put has been in drummers and keyboardists it would be very easy to completely crowd out a stage, and indeed a setlist, with keyboard and percussion. To make it a viable *performance* I think Dave either needs to stick to that core above or whatever is really viable, or else apologise enough or pay enough to get Ron, Jerry and Alan back on for the gig, in an ideal world Simon House and Keith Kniveton too, and basically play like it was 2001 again. I know I keep harking back to that year but it was a brilliant line-up. What I *don't* think he should do is try to get as many ex-members on stage at once as all they could really do is a chorus sing-along of `Silver Machine'. Nik's Hawkestra II was as close as anyone should ever get to that and I was amazed that worked as well as it did. Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 17 09:24:56 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 06:24:56 -0700 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show Message-ID: Oh man, if Dave got together a lineup with Tim and Huw I'd be camped outside the venue already. I've been listening to Live Chronicles a lot lately and I gotta say, I think their "Lloyd-Langton Speed Metal Era" (as one of you wiseacres dubbed it), is probably my favorite post-Space Ritual Hawkwind era.... Steve -----Original Message----- From: "SHLL (Scott Heller)" Date: Tuesday, Mar 17, 2009 6:22 am Subject: Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Hello Interesting input Jon. Pity I won't meet you at Roadburn this year... Anyway, I am very much looking forward to the HW 40th Anniversary show. I have no pre-expectations but I don't expect a lot of folks from any of the classic line up's of Hawkwind. I think the best Dave could try to pull together would be the live 79 like line up and get Tim, Huw, Dave,...but harvey is not playing bass anymore and probably will not join anyway. This line up you wrote below: The regular line-up plus :Huw, Martin Griffin, Keith Hale, Bridget, Crum, Rizz and Matthew Wright as likelies, which starts to look like a dual-drummer _Choose Your Masques_ sort of line-up with guest vocalists and lots of keyboard. Not exactly a 40th anniversary gig in and of itself but probably worth seeing. Then if we add possibles, guest appearances from Lemmy, if Lemmy Alan, Steve Swindells, Del, Dik Mik... Not sure how exciting this would be... I actually think the best bet would be for the current line up to just play a great concert with like one song from every studio record and then invite distinct guests in for one or two songs and leave it at that. I think trying to get people in who have not played much leaves to a major drop in quality like what we saw at the Hawkestra, even though it was fun.. Just my thoughts... scott -----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Jarrett [mailto:jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK] Sent: 16. marts 2009 11:04 Subject: Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 09:08:23AM +0100, SHLL (Scott Heller) typed out: > I have been tossing some mails back and forth with a few about the > Portchester Hall gigs in August and I now, really curious what > ex-hawkwind members could actually show up and play. I wonder if they > have announced this without actually signing anyone on board. If we > make a list of the ex-members, besides Huw Lloyd Langton (who I am not > really sure can play electric space rock anymore as he was a disaster > the last two times I saw him), who else is there: > > These people will not play with Dave and Co (at least I don't think): > > Nik, dave anderson, simon house, alan davey, lemmy, jerry richards, > ron tree, terry ollis, Thomas Crimble, michael moorcock (probably too > ill), adrian shaw, Mick Slattery, Steve Swindells, Harvey Bainbridge, > Bridget Wishart, Danny Thompson.. This looks like a ga From StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Tue Mar 17 10:09:21 2009 From: StevePXR5 at AOL.COM (StevePXR5 at AOL.COM) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 10:09:21 EDT Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show Message-ID: I am playing the Atomhenge Live Chronicles at a rather high volume and I have to say it is immense! That era was superb - I'll never forget the show at Preston's Guildhall. Steve. In a message dated 17/03/2009 13:26:13 GMT Standard Time, swann1066 at GMAIL.COM writes: I've been listening to Live Chronicles a lot lately and I gotta say, I think their "Lloyd-Langton Speed Metal Era" (as one of you wiseacres dubbed it), is probably my favorite post-Space Ritual Hawkwind era.... From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Tue Mar 17 16:43:00 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:43:00 -0000 Subject: Trev begs again Message-ID: Yes, the underclass freeloader Judge Trev is again begging for free advice and services from BOC boffins... the beg: This Real Festival Music page displays correctly when viewed on Internet explorer, but not on Firefox http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk/guilfin09maste.html Who can fix this...for nothing of course...don't want to break with the tradition of a lifetime. Judge Freeload From Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK Tue Mar 17 18:22:42 2009 From: Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK (Steve Pond) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 22:22:42 +0000 Subject: Trev begs again In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:43:00 -0000, you sent through the ether: >This Real Festival Music page displays correctly when viewed on Internet explorer, but not on Firefox Works fine on Firefox 3 here, what's not working there? -S. From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Tue Mar 17 18:52:45 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 22:52:45 -0000 Subject: Trev begs again In-Reply-To: Message-ID: text is ranged left on explorer, but is all centred on firefox trev -------------------------------------------------- From: "Steve Pond" Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 10:22 PM To: Subject: Re: Trev begs again > On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:43:00 -0000, you sent through the ether: > >>This Real Festival Music page displays correctly when viewed on Internet >>explorer, but not on Firefox > > > Works fine on Firefox 3 here, what's not working there? > > -S. > From Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK Tue Mar 17 19:15:42 2009 From: Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK (Steve Pond) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 23:15:42 +0000 Subject: Trev begs again In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I think it's because on line 55 of the code (blank lines counted too) you have an unclosed
tag.. rub it out and it all lines up left. The line in question looks like:

-S. On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 22:52:45 -0000, you sent through the ether: >text is ranged left on explorer, but is all centred on firefox > >trev > >-------------------------------------------------- >From: "Steve Pond" >Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 10:22 PM >To: >Subject: Re: Trev begs again > >> On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:43:00 -0000, you sent through the ether: >> >>>This Real Festival Music page displays correctly when viewed on Internet >>>explorer, but not on Firefox >> >> >> Works fine on Firefox 3 here, what's not working there? >> >> -S. >> > From cea at CARLAZ.COM Tue Mar 17 11:28:58 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 10:28:58 -0500 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show In-Reply-To: <3320126693.25842846@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 17 Mar 2009, at 08:24, Steve Swann wrote: > Oh man, if Dave got together a lineup with Tim and Huw I'd be > camped outside the venue already. I've been listening to Live > Chronicles a lot lately and I gotta say, I think their "Lloyd- > Langton Speed Metal Era" (as one of you wiseacres dubbed it), is > probably my favorite post-Space Ritual Hawkwind era.... I quite like the Chronicles stuff, and some of the other 80s-ish Huw- era things. "Shot Down in the Night" on _Live '79_, the "speed- metal" version of "Psy Power" from ... err, I forget which record or records, but you know what I mean, and "War I Survived" on _Xenon Codex_. Still, it also almost seems like those recordings belong to a different band .... though I suppose one could argue that almost _every_ Hawkwind "era" sounds like it belongs to a different band. Maybe it's that two guitars in Hawkwind sound not quite "right" to me -- for all that Huw was basically a founding member and a key member at other times. That may be why I really warm to the _Palace Spring_ macro-lineup more than the Chronicles-type lineup. Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Tue Mar 17 19:45:07 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 23:45:07 -0000 Subject: Trev begs again In-Reply-To: Message-ID: yes it all lines up left...including the stuff which is supposed to be centred, like the title etc and the width of the text range is right across the page...not like the explorer lay out at all ooer trev -------------------------------------------------- From: "Steve Pond" Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 11:15 PM To: Subject: Re: Trev begs again > I think it's because on line 55 of the code (blank lines counted too) > you have an unclosed

tag.. rub it out and it all lines up > left. > > The line in question looks like: > >

> > -S. > > > > On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 22:52:45 -0000, you sent through the ether: > >>text is ranged left on explorer, but is all centred on firefox >> >>trev >> >>-------------------------------------------------- >>From: "Steve Pond" >>Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 10:22 PM >>To: >>Subject: Re: Trev begs again >> >>> On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:43:00 -0000, you sent through the ether: >>> >>>>This Real Festival Music page displays correctly when viewed on Internet >>>>explorer, but not on Firefox >>> >>> >>> Works fine on Firefox 3 here, what's not working there? >>> >>> -S. >>> >> > From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Tue Mar 17 22:09:28 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 02:09:28 -0000 Subject: Trev begs again In-Reply-To: Message-ID: steve sorted it ta -------------------------------------------------- From: "trev" Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 11:45 PM To: Subject: Re: Trev begs again > yes it all lines up left...including the stuff which is supposed to be > centred, like the title etc > and the width of the text range is right across the page...not like the > explorer lay out at all > ooer > > trev > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Steve Pond" > Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 11:15 PM > To: > Subject: Re: Trev begs again > >> I think it's because on line 55 of the code (blank lines counted too) >> you have an unclosed

tag.. rub it out and it all lines up >> left. >> >> The line in question looks like: >> >>

>> >> -S. >> >> >> >> On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 22:52:45 -0000, you sent through the ether: >> >>>text is ranged left on explorer, but is all centred on firefox >>> >>>trev >>> >>>-------------------------------------------------- >>>From: "Steve Pond" >>>Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 10:22 PM >>>To: >>>Subject: Re: Trev begs again >>> >>>> On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:43:00 -0000, you sent through the ether: >>>> >>>>>This Real Festival Music page displays correctly when viewed on >>>>>Internet >>>>>explorer, but not on Firefox >>>> >>>> >>>> Works fine on Firefox 3 here, what's not working there? >>>> >>>> -S. >>>> >>> >> > From arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL Wed Mar 18 04:56:01 2009 From: arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL (Arjan Hulsebos) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 09:56:01 +0100 Subject: Trev begs again In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 18 Mar 2009 02:09:28 -0000, trev wrote > steve sorted it > > ta Just a plug for the validator service from the W3 consortium (http://validator.w3.org). It's very useful when you're writing web pages. It found 175 errors on this page, including the unclosed

tag. Most of these errors are harmless, like not quoting attribute values in tags, some concern questionable use of tags (like

, where

would be correct), and some are real errors, like the unclosed

tag. But, of course, correct pages may come out differently when viewed with different browsers. IE's failure to interpret correctly relative lengths in width and height attributes is one that springs to my mind. You wouldn't believe the stuff I had to put in to get around that... Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From shll at HAGEDORN.DK Wed Mar 18 05:06:02 2009 From: shll at HAGEDORN.DK (SHLL (Scott Heller)) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 10:06:02 +0100 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show Message-ID: I agree. it would be great it Huw and Tim and they went for this era a bit but the problem is I have very serious doubts that Huw can actually do it anymore. The last two times I have seen him it was a disaster... He can sit down and play some nice acoustic guitar but I think he lost as an electric rock guitarist anymore.. not sure why.. alcohol..perhaps... I love a lot of his stuff in the 80's... scott On 17 Mar 2009, at 08:24, Steve Swann wrote: > Oh man, if Dave got together a lineup with Tim and Huw I'd be camped > outside the venue already. I've been listening to Live Chronicles a > lot lately and I gotta say, I think their "Lloyd- Langton Speed Metal > Era" (as one of you wiseacres dubbed it), is probably my favorite > post-Space Ritual Hawkwind era.... I quite like the Chronicles stuff, and some of the other 80s-ish Huw- era things. "Shot Down in the Night" on _Live '79_, the "speed- metal" version of "Psy Power" from ... err, I forget which record or records, but you know what I mean, and "War I Survived" on _Xenon Codex_. Still, it also almost seems like those recordings belong to a different band .... though I suppose one could argue that almost _every_ Hawkwind "era" sounds like it belongs to a different band. Maybe it's that two guitars in Hawkwind sound not quite "right" to me -- for all that Huw was basically a founding member and a key member at other times. That may be why I really warm to the _Palace Spring_ macro-lineup more than the Chronicles-type lineup. Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From sloterdijk at MSN.COM Wed Mar 18 08:32:35 2009 From: sloterdijk at MSN.COM (Burro Mike) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 12:32:35 +0000 Subject: Franics Rossi says goodbye to his trademark ponytail..hair too thin :( Message-ID: Francis Rossi, has finally lopped off his ponytail, claiming that he realized "he looked ridiculous"..QUO will go on!! Read all about it! http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/showbiz/bizarre/article2309123.ece _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live?: Life without walls. http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_allup_1a_explore_032009 From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 18 08:52:17 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 06:52:17 -0600 Subject: Franics Rossi says goodbye to complete TOF?? Message-ID: Thanks for this Mike will report to my friend say, what did they do to new Text Of Festival LP?>? it seems to have gained some kind of gatefold sleeve, but it appears to be heavily mutilated songwise...I am presuming this is for better sound but god , not more mutilation. On 3/18/09, Burro Mike wrote: > > Francis Rossi, has finally lopped off his ponytail, claiming that he > realized "he looked ridiculous"..QUO will go on!! Read all about it! > > > > http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/showbiz/bizarre/article2309123.ece > > _________________________________________________________________ > Windows Live?: Life without walls. > http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_allup_1a_explore_032009 From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 18 09:09:57 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 06:09:57 -0700 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show Message-ID: Say it aint so! I have no idea how Huw rates among people who actually know about playing guitar, but to me as a fan his playing scorches my brain and makes my spine tingle. I think my Hawkwind fandom is probably a main reason I've never bothered messing with drugs - listening to Huw blazing through the guitar solo on Elric the Enchanter blows my mind perfectly well on its own thanks. :) Btw thanks to StevePXR5 for putting me on the the existence of the Atomhenge Live Chronicles, I just ordered it! Steve -----Original Message----- From: "SHLL (Scott Heller)" Date: Wednesday, Mar 18, 2009 5:08 am Subject: Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET I agree. it would be great it Huw and Tim and they went for this era a bit but the problem is I have very serious doubts that Huw can actually do it anymore. The last two times I have seen him it was a disaster... He can sit down and play some nice acoustic guitar but I think he lost as an electric rock guitarist anymore.. not sure why.. alcohol..perhaps... I love a lot of his stuff in the 80's... scott On 17 Mar 2009, at 08:24, Steve Swann wrote: > Oh man, if Dave got together a lineup with Tim and Huw I'd be camped > outside the venue already. I've been listening to Live Chronicles a > lot lately and I gotta say, I think their "Lloyd- Langton Speed Metal > Era" (as one of you wiseacres dubbed it), is probably my favorite > post-Space Ritual Hawkwind era.... I quite like the Chronicles stuff, and some of the other 80s-ish Huw- era things. "Shot Down in the Night" on _Live '79_, the "speed- metal" version of "Psy Power" from ... err, I forget which record or records, but you know what I mean, and "War I Survived" on _Xenon Codex_. Still, it also almost seems like those recordings belong to a different band .... though I suppose one could argue that almost _every_ Hawkwind "era" sounds like it belongs to a different band. Maybe it's that two guitars in Hawkwind sound not quite "right" to me -- for all that Huw was basically a founding member and a key member at other times. That may be why I really warm to the _Palace Spring_ macro-lineup more than the Chronicles-type lineup. Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Wed Mar 18 09:26:27 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 13:26:27 -0000 Subject: Trev begs again In-Reply-To: <20090318085500.M25111@dehulst.nl> Message-ID: Thanks Arjan, I've bookmarked the page. -------------------------------------------------- From: "Arjan Hulsebos" Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 8:56 AM To: Subject: Re: Trev begs again > On Wed, 18 Mar 2009 02:09:28 -0000, trev wrote >> steve sorted it >> >> ta > > Just a plug for the validator service from the W3 consortium > (http://validator.w3.org). It's very useful when you're writing web pages. > > It found 175 errors on this page, including the unclosed
tag. > Most of > these errors are harmless, like not quoting attribute values in tags, some > concern questionable use of tags (like

, where

would be > correct), and some are real errors, like the unclosed

tag. > > But, of course, correct pages may come out differently when viewed with > different browsers. IE's failure to interpret correctly relative lengths > in > width and height attributes is one that springs to my mind. You wouldn't > believe the stuff I had to put in to get around that... > > Gr, > > Arjan H > > -------------------------------- > Rock in the 70ies: > substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration > From cea at CARLAZ.COM Wed Mar 18 18:32:48 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 17:32:48 -0500 Subject: Atomhenge Live Chronicles (was Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show) In-Reply-To: <3320212197.28536001@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 18 Mar 2009, at 08:09, Steve Swann wrote: > Btw thanks to StevePXR5 for putting me on the the existence of the > Atomhenge Live Chronicles, I just ordered it! I think I've just twigged that this is a Thing. What's up with the Atomhenge Live Chronicles, and how is it different from the Griffin one? Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From david.hall6800 at NTLWORLD.COM Wed Mar 18 18:47:13 2009 From: david.hall6800 at NTLWORLD.COM (Dave Hall) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 22:47:13 +0000 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show - Huw In-Reply-To: <3320212197.28536001@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Huw was always rated highly. My non Hawkwind liking mates and guitar freaks turned out to the 80s gigs because of him. I was always, still am, a fan of his playing - in saying that he did have a tendency to cut through on the higher notes - perhaps to be heard against the synths/volume of the band? I've met a good number of the band members over the years, most have been great. Huw, I have to say has always been first class. Regards Dave ---- Steve Swann wrote: > Say it aint so! I have no idea how Huw rates among people who actually know about playing guitar, but to me as a fan his playing scorches my brain and makes my spine tingle. I think my Hawkwind fandom is probably a main reason I've never bothered messing with drugs - listening to Huw blazing through the guitar solo on Elric the Enchanter blows my mind perfectly well on its own thanks. :) > > Btw thanks to StevePXR5 for putting me on the the existence of the Atomhenge Live Chronicles, I just ordered it! > > Steve > > -----Original Message----- > From: "SHLL (Scott Heller)" > Date: Wednesday, Mar 18, 2009 5:08 am > Subject: Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show > To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > I agree. it would be great it Huw and Tim and they went for this era a bit but the problem is I have very serious doubts that Huw can actually do it anymore. The last two times I have seen him it was a disaster... He can sit down and play some nice acoustic guitar but I think he lost as an electric rock guitarist anymore.. not sure why.. alcohol..perhaps... I love a lot of his stuff in the 80's... > > scott > > > On 17 Mar 2009, at 08:24, Steve Swann wrote: > > Oh man, if Dave got together a lineup with Tim and Huw I'd be camped > > outside the venue already. I've been listening to Live Chronicles a > > lot lately and I gotta say, I think their "Lloyd- Langton Speed Metal > > Era" (as one of you wiseacres dubbed it), is probably my favorite > > post-Space Ritual Hawkwind era.... > > > I quite like the Chronicles stuff, and some of the other 80s-ish Huw- era things. "Shot Down in the Night" on _Live '79_, the "speed- metal" version of "Psy Power" from ... err, I forget which record or records, but you know what I mean, and "War I Survived" on _Xenon Codex_. Still, it also almost seems like those recordings belong to a different band .... though I suppose one could argue that almost > _every_ Hawkwind "era" sounds like it belongs to a different band. > Maybe it's that two guitars in Hawkwind sound not quite "right" to me > -- for all that Huw was basically a founding member and a key member at other times. That may be why I really warm to the _Palace Spring_ macro-lineup more than the Chronicles-type lineup. > > Cheers, > Carl > > -- > Carl Edlund Anderson > http://www.carlaz.com/ From StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Wed Mar 18 18:58:16 2009 From: StevePXR5 at AOL.COM (StevePXR5 at AOL.COM) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 18:58:16 EDT Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show - Huw Message-ID: In a message dated 18/03/2009 22:48:14 GMT Standard Time, david.hall6800 at NTLWORLD.COM writes: I've met a good number of the band members over the years, most have been great. Huw, I have to say has always been first class. Yeah. Huw's a great bloke. At Hawkfest 2007 during Hawkwind's set, I had to step out for some air (why the hell do they keep the wrap aroung the tent when it is so hot??? It kills us!) and I bumped into Huw... invited him back to the tent... We spent a very pleasant evening having a good chat and getting pissed listening to the Hawkwind set and beyond... What a guy. Yet another night I won't forget. Steve. From StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Wed Mar 18 19:01:36 2009 From: StevePXR5 at AOL.COM (StevePXR5 at AOL.COM) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:01:36 EDT Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show Message-ID: Glad to be of service. This month sees the release of Quark, PXR5 and Live Seventy-Nine. You have to get them all -- the sound is ('ow you Americans zay) AWSOME! Steve. In a message dated 18/03/2009 13:10:56 GMT Standard Time, swann1066 at GMAIL.COM writes: Btw thanks to StevePXR5 for putting me on the the existence of the Atomhenge Live Chronicles, I just ordered it! From jmajk at INDY.RR.COM Wed Mar 18 20:15:26 2009 From: jmajk at INDY.RR.COM (John Majka) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 20:15:26 -0400 Subject: HW 40th Anniversary Show - Huw Message-ID: As a guitar player myself, I've always been hugely impressed with Huw. He does indeed have a unique signature style quite unlike that of anyone else I've ever heard. I am always completely mesmerized listening to his leads in Hawkwind and on his solo albums. Others may speak of Simon's skills, but for me, Huw is definitely Hawkwind's most musically gifted member. I'd love for him to join up with the rest of the hawks for another musical journey.... John Majka > Hi > Huw was always rated highly. My non Hawkwind liking mates and guitar > freaks turned out to the 80s gigs because of him. I was always, still am, > a fan of his playing - in saying that he did have a tendency to cut > through on the higher notes - perhaps to be heard against the > synths/volume of the band? I've met a good number of the band members over > the years, most have been great. Huw, I have to say has always been first > class. > > Regards > > Dave > ---- Steve Swann wrote: >> Say it aint so! I have no idea how Huw rates among people who actually >> know about playing guitar, but to me as a fan his playing scorches my >> brain and makes my spine tingle. I think my Hawkwind fandom is probably >> a main reason I've never bothered messing with drugs - listening to Huw >> blazing through the guitar solo on Elric the Enchanter blows my mind >> perfectly well on its own thanks. :) >> >> Btw thanks to StevePXR5 for putting me on the the existence of the >> Atomhenge Live Chronicles, I just ordered it! >> >> Steve >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: "SHLL (Scott Heller)" >> Date: Wednesday, Mar 18, 2009 5:08 am >> Subject: Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show >> To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List >> To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET >> >> I agree. it would be great it Huw and Tim and they went for this era a >> bit but the problem is I have very serious doubts that Huw can actually >> do it anymore. The last two times I have seen him it was a disaster... He >> can sit down and play some nice acoustic guitar but I think he lost as an >> electric rock guitarist anymore.. not sure why.. alcohol..perhaps... I >> love a lot of his stuff in the 80's... >> >> scott >> >> >> On 17 Mar 2009, at 08:24, Steve Swann wrote: >> > Oh man, if Dave got together a lineup with Tim and Huw I'd be camped >> > outside the venue already. I've been listening to Live Chronicles a >> > lot lately and I gotta say, I think their "Lloyd- Langton Speed Metal >> > Era" (as one of you wiseacres dubbed it), is probably my favorite >> > post-Space Ritual Hawkwind era.... >> >> >> I quite like the Chronicles stuff, and some of the other 80s-ish Huw- era >> things. "Shot Down in the Night" on _Live '79_, the "speed- metal" >> version of "Psy Power" from ... err, I forget which record or records, >> but you know what I mean, and "War I Survived" on _Xenon Codex_. Still, >> it also almost seems like those recordings belong to a different band >> .... though I suppose one could argue that almost >> _every_ Hawkwind "era" sounds like it belongs to a different band. >> Maybe it's that two guitars in Hawkwind sound not quite "right" to me >> -- for all that Huw was basically a founding member and a key member at >> other times. That may be why I really warm to the _Palace Spring_ >> macro-lineup more than the Chronicles-type lineup. >> >> Cheers, >> Carl >> >> -- >> Carl Edlund Anderson >> http://www.carlaz.com/ > From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 18 21:06:36 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:06:36 -0600 Subject: Franics Rossi says goodbye to his trademark ponytail..hair too thin :( In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 3/18/09, Burro Mike wrote: > > Francis Rossi, has finally lopped off his ponytail, claiming that he > realized "he looked ridiculous"..QUO will go on!! Read all about it! > http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/showbiz/bizarre/article2309123.ece Now wait a minute!! I'm a bit annoyed here, this article made the ponytail sound to me like it was a 35-year mainstay institution, and being a subscriber to the corny angle, dissapointed that my friend who has collected the "band too big for the USA", or least Texas apparently anyway, since 1969 or so, is only tracing it back to an 86 LP.... I wonder if I can bring back the mullet in the form of clip-on ponytails? business during the day ponytailed freak by night.... hmm From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 19 07:29:32 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 04:29:32 -0700 Subject: Atomhenge Live Chronicles (was Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show) Message-ID: What I'm hoping for is that it will be better mastered than the Griffin release, which always sounded muted/muddy to me. As a result I always ended up listening to the original despite it bein an incomplete concert record.... Steve -----Original Message----- From: Carl Edlund Anderson Date: Wednesday, Mar 18, 2009 6:35 pm Subject: Atomhenge Live Chronicles (was Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show) To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET On 18 Mar 2009, at 08:09, Steve Swann wrote: Btw thanks to StevePXR5 for putting me on the the existence of the Atomhenge Live Chronicles, I just ordered it! I think I've just twigged that this is a Thing. What's up with the Atomhenge Live Chronicles, and how is it different from the Griffin one? Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From cea at CARLAZ.COM Thu Mar 19 08:28:01 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 07:28:01 -0500 Subject: Atomhenge Live Chronicles (was Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show) In-Reply-To: <3320292572.31111907@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 19 Mar 2009, at 06:29 , Steve Swann wrote: > What I'm hoping for is that it will be better mastered than the > Griffin release, which always sounded muted/muddy to me. As a > result I always ended up listening to the original despite it bein > an incomplete concert record.... Well, I await the report from your critical ear then. _Live Chronicles_ is a mighty album and a HW high point, for all that I feel more drawn towards the Palace Springs lineup .... In fact, I'll happily say that the band turned out more good material with the 80s-Huw lineups than with the Brock/Davey/Chadwick/House/ Bainbridge lineup (which barely produced part of the semi-live album that is Palace Springs). It's just the ... *vibe* on those bits of _Palace Springs_ that attracts me. And, somehow, HW seems _right_ to me when there is just Brocks guitar grinding away on its own -- for all that I can't really imagine something like "Shot Down in the Night" without Huw's part. Strange really; when I go and home-record my own space-rock things, I invariably end up with at least a couple of guitars scattered around it, despite my model being the 1-guitar HW incarnations. Go figure. Well, it's all of a part, I suppose! Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From sloterdijk at MSN.COM Thu Mar 19 08:46:00 2009 From: sloterdijk at MSN.COM (Burro Mike) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:46:00 +0000 Subject: Francis Rossi's ponytail..response to Mike Coleman Message-ID: In response to mike coleman's dating of the ponytail to about 1986..You are correct..Before that Francis just let all his hair hang down..It was about 86 that he decided to tie it back..Actually I think it was that way for live aid already..As for "the band too big for the USA", that's a nice addage but unfortunately NOT true. Quo only charted here once with Pictures of Matchstick men, and it seems every time they tour here they lose money. Last time was 2003, and I doubt they will ever be back, but who knows with Quo.. Cheers! Mike Burro _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live? Contacts: Organize your contact list. http://windowslive.com/connect/post/marcusatmicrosoft.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!503D1D86EBB2B53C!2285.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_UGC_Contacts_032009 From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 19 09:02:27 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 07:02:27 -0600 Subject: Francis Rossi's ponytail..response to Mike Coleman In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 3/19/09, Burro Mike wrote: > > In response to mike coleman's dating of the ponytail to about 1986..You are > correct..Before that Francis just let all his hair hang down..It was about > 86 that he decided to tie it back..Actually I think it was that way for live > aid already..As for "the band too big for the USA", that's a nice addage but > unfortunately NOT true. Quo only charted here once with Pictures of > Matchstick men, and it seems every time they tour here they lose money. > Last time was 2003, and I doubt they will ever be back, but who knows with > Quo.. > Cheers! Mike Burro and thanks for that, I was hoping you'd say something since I wanted to add- the article sonded to me like "he'd grown this RnR ponytail specifically for RnR", which is about the stupidest thought in the world IMHO, as I always thought you grew YOUR HAIR, and then occasionally pull it back in a tail, etc..... My friend Pierre is getting a bit senile at 58, so I am glad he was not too far off....My statement about them being too big was jesting of course, friend said they just are not really an opening act, and the USA just never worked out much for them the usual east-coast to west-coast type tour jumping, etc I had fun with this, is my whole point, and that tail certainly had to quo.....(imo) add: it is still a heck of a LONG time posing a ponytail, a realise.... From sloterdijk at MSN.COM Thu Mar 19 09:04:49 2009 From: sloterdijk at MSN.COM (Burro Mike) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 13:04:49 +0000 Subject: Mike Burro Birthday show: April 3rd 2009 Message-ID: Greetings friends, I want to invite you to come out for my Birthday show, Friday April 3rd. The show will take place in my hometown of Columbus, New Jersey, at the local tavern. There is no cover charge! good food, drink and more!! All event details are contained in the press release below.. Cheers! Mike Burro www.prlog.org/10201035 www.myspace.com/sloterdijk1 _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live? Contacts: Organize your contact list. http://windowslive.com/connect/post/marcusatmicrosoft.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!503D1D86EBB2B53C!2285.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_UGC_Contacts_032009 From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 19 09:15:15 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 06:15:15 -0700 Subject: Atomhenge Live Chronicles (was Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show) Message-ID: Carl have you seen the Cleveland Phantasy Theater video from that era? Given how much you like Palace Springs I would call that a must-have. Steve -----Original Message----- From: Carl Edlund Anderson Date: Thursday, Mar 19, 2009 8:33 am Subject: Re: Atomhenge Live Chronicles (was Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show) To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET On 19 Mar 2009, at 06:29 , Steve Swann wrote: What I'm hoping for is that it will be better mastered than the Griffin release, which always sounded muted/muddy to me. As a result I always ended up listening to the original despite it bein an incomplete concert record.... Well, I await the report from your critical ear then. _Live Chronicles_ is a mighty album and a HW high point, for all that I feel more drawn towards the Palace Springs lineup .... In fact, I'll happily say that the band turned out more good material with the 80s-Huw lineups than with the Brock/Davey/Chadwick/House/ Bainbridge lineup (which barely produced part of the semi-live album that is Palace Springs). It's just the ... *vibe* on those bits of _Palace Springs_ that attracts me. And, somehow, HW seems _right_ to me when there is just Brocks guitar grinding away on its own -- for all that I can't really imagine something like "Shot Down in the Night" without Huw's part. Strange really; when I go and home-record my own space-rock things, I invariably end up with at least a couple of guitars scattered around it, despite my model being the 1-guitar HW incarnations. Go figure. Well, it's all of a part, I suppose! Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 19 10:27:58 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 07:27:58 -0700 Subject: Atomhenge Live Chronicles (was Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show) Message-ID: Further to your point, a great part of my obsession with Hawkwind as a live unit has to do with how their sound can vary unbelievably from one era to another and yet still sound unmistakably Hawkwind. In my opinion the "unmistakably" bit is the monster slab of Brock guitar that everything else is layered on top of. So long as you've got Dave and the rythm section creating that core Hawkwind sound**, you can have any talented soloist add the frills on top: violin, synth, electric guitar, flute, saxophone - it all fucking rocks. Huw just happens to be my favorite of the many and varied "embellishers" of Hawkwind's sound. :) ** in fact when I saw them as a 3-piece, they basically had -just- that unmistakable core Hawkwind sound. It was interesting to note that the songs still sounded great when stripped of all frills and embellishments. It was like it got more at the core rock sound that's underneath the skin of all of their songs... Steve -----Original Message----- From: Carl Edlund Anderson Date: Thursday, Mar 19, 2009 8:33 am Subject: Re: Atomhenge Live Chronicles (was Re: HW 40th Anniversary Show) To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET On 19 Mar 2009, at 06:29 , Steve Swann wrote: What I'm hoping for is that it will be better mastered than the Griffin release, which always sounded muted/muddy to me. As a result I always ended up listening to the original despite it bein an incomplete concert record.... Well, I await the report from your critical ear then. _Live Chronicles_ is a mighty album and a HW high point, for all that I feel more drawn towards the Palace Springs lineup .... In fact, I'll happily say that the band turned out more good material with the 80s-Huw lineups than with the Brock/Davey/Chadwick/House/ Bainbridge lineup (which barely produced part of the semi-live album that is Palace Springs). It's just the ... *vibe* on those bits of _Palace Springs_ that attracts me. And, somehow, HW seems _right_ to me when there is just Brocks guitar grinding away on its own -- for all that I can't really imagine something like "Shot Down in the Night" without Huw's part. Strange really; when I go and home-record my own space-rock things, I invariably end up with at least a couple of guitars scattered around it, despite my model being the 1-guitar HW incarnations. Go figure. Well, it's all of a part, I suppose! Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Thu Mar 19 12:44:59 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 16:44:59 +0000 Subject: Douglass Smith now managing the Hawklords? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 03:08:54PM -0500, Lost Johnny typed out: > ON the website they say Douglass Smith is now managing the Hawklords . > Everything he gets involved with always turns to gold Or at least, Bronze. Oh ho ho, etc. Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 20 10:36:53 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 07:36:53 -0700 Subject: HW: best fan recorded shows Message-ID: So I tried asking about torrents, to a resounding silence... I figured since Hawkwind have explicitly ok'ed electronic distribution of the old "tape tree" live recordings, it would have made torrent less of a dirty word by now... So, let me try asking more generally: What are the best fan recorded shows to look out for? I know some of you out there know this stuff... Steve From bernhard.pospiech at T-ONLINE.DE Fri Mar 20 11:27:51 2009 From: bernhard.pospiech at T-ONLINE.DE (bernhard.pospiech) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 16:27:51 +0100 Subject: best fan recorded shows In-Reply-To: <3320390213.34190077@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Steve Sound quality or the gig itself ?? Bernhard -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On Behalf Of Steve Swann Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 3:37 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: HW: best fan recorded shows So I tried asking about torrents, to a resounding silence... I figured since Hawkwind have explicitly ok'ed electronic distribution of the old "tape tree" live recordings, it would have made torrent less of a dirty word by now... So, let me try asking more generally: What are the best fan recorded shows to look out for? I know some of you out there know this stuff... Steve From hawkwomble at TISCALI.CO.UK Fri Mar 20 11:26:43 2009 From: hawkwomble at TISCALI.CO.UK (john-paul) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 15:26:43 -0000 Subject: best fan recorded shows Message-ID: hi steve, there are dozens of excellent "fan recorded" shows out there. in my opinion some are better than so called official stuff. hammy odeon 21st and 22 october 81 are two great shows,bristol 31st october 82 is another, leeds irish centre 2001 is also very good. check out my site for a list of all my boots http://windwizard.110mb.com/ cheers, jp. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Swann" To: Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 2:36 PM Subject: HW: best fan recorded shows > So I tried asking about torrents, to a resounding silence... I figured > since Hawkwind have explicitly ok'ed electronic distribution of the old > "tape tree" live recordings, it would have made torrent less of a dirty > word by now... > > So, let me try asking more generally: What are the best fan recorded > shows to look out for? I know some of you out there know this stuff... > > Steve > From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Fri Mar 20 12:14:32 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 16:14:32 +0000 Subject: HW: Knights of Space audio mix In-Reply-To: <17d80c610902231305pe31c62cs366eb9c3e92416e8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 03:05:24PM -0600, mike coleman typed out: > also, isn't it maybe time Hawkwind was moving on label-wise, going by > their own history, and maybe this is what we are witnessing, just a thought Well, they have been trying to leave Voiceprint for some time, haven't they? There was the EMI deal that fell through, there was talk of a deal with Sanctuary, and I waas quite surprised with the Cherry Red thing too. But somehow it keeps being Voiceprint. Now, why would that be? Well, people with long memories round here may recall that before Mike C. returned to this particular digital fold, I found myself sitting on a train opposite Arthur Brown, and once I'd dared to open the conversation, the merits or not of Voiceprint came up because they'd just re-released the Kingdom Come albums with a single set of liner notes repeated between the three and a dreadful new sleeve each. He said to me, he said something like, "Well, you have to think very hard about this sort of thin, because at the end of the day a label like Sanctuary will give you forty pence per CD sold and Voiceprint will give you one pound twenty." I've never really wondered why Hawkwind can't quite bring themselves to do without Voiceprint since that conversation. Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Fri Mar 20 13:40:05 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 17:40:05 GMT Subject: best fan recorded shows In-Reply-To: bernhard.pospiech's message of Fri, 20 Mar 2009 16:27:51 +0100 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 20 14:01:40 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 11:01:40 -0700 Subject: best fan recorded shows Message-ID: I'm looking for the recordings that strike the right alchemical balance of performance and sound quality. :) For example, my favorite version of Hassan I Sabha is the one from Weird Tape 5, even though the sound recording is only what I would call "decent"... Stsve -----Original Message----- From: "bernhard.pospiech" Date: Friday, Mar 20, 2009 11:29 am Subject: Re: best fan recorded shows To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Hi Steve Sound quality or the gig itself ?? Bernhard -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On Behalf Of Steve Swann Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 3:37 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: HW: best fan recorded shows So I tried asking about torrents, to a resounding silence... I figured since Hawkwind have explicitly ok'ed electronic distribution of the old "tape tree" live recordings, it would have made torrent less of a dirty word by now... So, let me try asking more generally: What are the best fan recorded shows to look out for? I know some of you out there know this stuff... Steve From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Fri Mar 20 14:03:45 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 11:03:45 -0700 Subject: best fan recorded shows Message-ID: Thanks I'll have a look at that. Steve -----Original Message----- From: john-paul Date: Friday, Mar 20, 2009 11:29 am Subject: Re: best fan recorded shows To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET hi steve, there are dozens of excellent "fan recorded" shows out there. in my opinion some are better than so called official stuff. hammy odeon 21st and 22 october 81 are two great shows,bristol 31st october 82 is another, leeds irish centre 2001 is also very good. check out my site for a list of all my boots http://windwizard.110mb.com/ cheers, jp. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Swann" To: Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 2:36 PM Subject: HW: best fan recorded shows > So I tried asking about torrents, to a resounding silence... I figured since Hawkwind have explicitly ok'ed electronic distribution of the old "tape tree" live recordings, it would have made torrent less of a dirty word by now... > So, let me try asking more generally: What are the best fan recorded shows to look out for? I know some of you out there know this stuff... > Steve From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Sat Mar 21 09:22:13 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 13:22:13 +0000 Subject: HW: Knights of Space audio mix In-Reply-To: <3318313474.50870454@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 06:44:35AM -0800, Steve Swann typed out: > Now, I'm admittedly totally biased. My instructions to the audio > engineer would have been: MAKE BROCKS GUITAR STOMP ALL OVER EVERYTHING > LIKE A 900 FOOT STEEL ROBOT I've been to one gig where that was more or less how the mix was and it isn't necessarily what you'd want. For a start, it hurt to stand anywhere near his amp, and for a continuation, I couldn't hear Simon's violin. Actually, when one got as far left as one could, one found that Simon's violin was largely coming out as white noise but at least over there there was something like balance. This was Cambridge, and I was rather annoyed not to be able to enjoy it. Just saying, there can be too much Brock (and if my experience didn't show this, I'd just cite _Earthed to the Ground_...) Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 21 10:33:12 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 10:33:12 -0400 Subject: HW: Knights of Space audio mix In-Reply-To: <20090321132212.GI32671@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: But you see, that was deliberate hyperbole, like telling the waiter that you want your steak still mooing and struggling to get away, when you want it Rare. (Apologies to any vegans on the list.) Despite my jokes, I don't *really* want any instrument to drown out everything else, but I do think that Brock's guitar is the "core" of the Hawkwind sound, and I want to hear it blazing through the mix. The lead guitar/violin/synth/flute/theremin/sax/axe/kazoo is the embellishment, but if I can't hear Brock's guitar, then the Hawkwind sound is missing for me. There was a period when Dave was moving away from guitar to doing mostly synths, and that was my least favorite Hawkwind period. I saw them at one show during that period, and the sound was way too light for me - the only point where I felt like I was really hearing my favorite band was when he picked up his guitar for Hassan I Sabha (which they then split down the middle by inserting an ambient piece into it, argh!). :) I still think it's funny that Dave (based on what I've heard from interviews and comments of his) apparently doesn't think of himself as much of a guitar player, while l could listen to him play guitar *all goddamn day* (and I have), and prefer him over any number of guitar players who win Guitar Player Magazine readers awards, and have people obsessively trying to copy their wanky "watch me play scales at jet speed" style... I know it's not quite the same thing, and that in some ways it makes more sense to compare him to people like Malcolm Young, but you guys know what I mean. Dave's guitar playing is one of the great musical treasures of the world, I wonder if he has any idea. Steve On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 9:22 AM, Jonathan Jarrett wrote: > On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 06:44:35AM -0800, Steve Swann typed out: > > ? ? ? ? > >> Now, I'm admittedly totally biased. ?My instructions to the audio >> engineer would have been: MAKE BROCKS GUITAR STOMP ALL OVER EVERYTHING >> LIKE A 900 FOOT STEEL ROBOT > > ? ? ? ?I've been to one gig where that was more or less how the mix was > and it isn't necessarily what you'd want. For a start, it hurt to stand > anywhere near his amp, and for a continuation, I couldn't hear Simon's > violin. Actually, when one got as far left as one could, one found that > Simon's violin was largely coming out as white noise but at least over > there there was something like balance. This was Cambridge, and I was > rather annoyed not to be able to enjoy it. Just saying, there can be too > much Brock (and if my experience didn't show this, I'd just cite > _Earthed to the Ground_...) Yours, > ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Jon > > -- > "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" > ? ? ? ? ? ?(Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) > ?Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk > From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Sat Mar 21 11:39:28 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 11:39:28 -0400 Subject: best fan recorded shows In-Reply-To: <200903201740.n2KHe5Rt002834@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: Is it possible that we could just agree on some Torrent sharing site with an appropriate usage policy (for a example Dime A Dozen actually links directly to Hawkwind's official sharing policy on the band website) and start converting and uploading? I promise I will seed and not just leech**. ;-) Steve ** The language of Torrenting still mostly sounds like Aklo to me. ;-) On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 1:40 PM, M Holmes wrote: >> So I tried asking about torrents, to a resounding silence... ?I figured >> since Hawkwind have explicitly ok'ed electronic distribution of the old >> "tape tree" live recordings, it would have made torrent less of a dirty word >> by now... >> >> So, let me try asking more generally: ?What are the best fan recorded shows >> to look out for? ?I know some of you out there know this stuff... >> >> Steve > > Yeah. I really need to replace all my fan tapes with fan CD's and DVD's. > > Has anyone already done this and converted them to .wav CD's or DVD's? > > FoFP > > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Mon Mar 23 05:03:24 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 09:03:24 +0000 Subject: (OFF) Knights of Space audio mix In-Reply-To: <17d80c610902241632u36429a04u393bc7be275b76b1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 06:32:45PM -0600, mike coleman typed out: > Dilemma- attempt to clean the keypad, or spellchecker city for me > is a dishwasher really safe??? Dishwasher possibly not, but if you trust yourself to reassemble it correctly, then dismantling it, sticking it in a shallow warm bath and then letting it dry for a couple of days works wonders. What you would do meanwhile, though... Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Mon Mar 23 10:59:28 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 10:59:28 -0400 Subject: (OFF) Knights of Space audio mix In-Reply-To: <20090323090324.GM32671@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: I heard a can of compressed air works too? Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Jonathan Jarrett Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 5:03 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: (OFF) Knights of Space audio mix On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 06:32:45PM -0600, mike coleman typed out: > Dilemma- attempt to clean the keypad, or spellchecker city for me > is a dishwasher really safe??? Dishwasher possibly not, but if you trust yourself to reassemble it correctly, then dismantling it, sticking it in a shallow warm bath and then letting it dry for a couple of days works wonders. What you would do meanwhile, though... Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Mon Mar 23 11:19:41 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 15:19:41 GMT Subject: Anyone know... Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Mon Mar 23 12:26:38 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:26:38 +0000 Subject: HW: Reissues In-Reply-To: <17d80c610902270843s365f8375rf70144b07231c47d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 10:43:58AM -0600, Lost Johnny typed out: > Pearson's fine, he turns up on the Yahoo list I hear Thanks for the reassurance! Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 23 14:00:43 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (Mary Bruce) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 12:00:43 -0600 Subject: FW: [Hawkwind] Re: Dave Anderson in hospital after suffering two heart attacks In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hiya Big Boyz!! (curtsey, flirt flirt, eyelash wink), I thought this was newsworthy enough for the BOC-L mike coleman says hello, he's busy getting ready to go limpin' down the street so he can show off the black eye he gave himself last night somehow....people will think he's been in a fight..... -----Original Message----- From: Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com [mailto:Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Colin Allen Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2009 10:23 AM To: Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com Subject: [Hawkwind] Re: Dave Anderson in hospital after suffering two heart attacks Myself and Litmus have got to know Dave rather well over the last few years. He is a genuinely nice guy and an entertaining host. We wish him all the best and hope for a quick and complete recovery. Colin --- In Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com, "Dave Roberts" wrote: > > For those of you who are interested and would like to send Dave a get well card, he is in Ward 24 at the Royal Shrewsbury Hospital. > > Dave > > --- In Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com, Ian Abrahams wrote: > > > > How awful. I've spoken to and met Dave on occassions and he's a really cool guy as far as I'm concerned. As you say, get well soon Mr. A! > > > > Ian > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Dave Roberts > > To: Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2009 12:14:39 AM > > Subject: [Hawkwind] Dave Anderson in hospital after suffering two heart attacks > > > > > > I thought you should all know that Dave Anderson has had two heart attacks and is recovering in hospital. > > He has had a stent insrted to open up the artery which caused the problem. > > Dave is making a good recovery and I'm sure everyone wiill wish him a speedy recovery. > > Dave has been working with the Groundhogs again lately, I saw him in Liverpool on Sunday night and he was looking well then. > > He was taken to hospital Tuesday morning after complaining of chest pains. He had a further heart attack whilst in hospital. > > Get well soon Dave. > > > > Dave > > > ------------------------------------ Hawkwind e-group! The world's #1 and greatest e-source for Hawkwind fans -- created and maintained by Hawkwind fans! Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Hawkwind/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Hawkwind/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: mailto:Hawkwind-digest at yahoogroups.com mailto:Hawkwind-fullfeatured at yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Hawkwind-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Mon Mar 23 15:21:07 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 15:21:07 -0400 Subject: [Hawkwind] Re: Dave Anderson in hospital after suffering two heart attacks In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903231100h586d79c5j69f9aaee6955f648@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: HeyColin So Glad Dave is recovering nicely. Best wishes for a long and healthy life. Hey Coleman, don't go putting words in my mouth, I can't help it if you're so skitzed you're fighting with yourself. Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Mary Bruce Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 2:01 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: FW: [Hawkwind] Re: Dave Anderson in hospital after suffering two heart attacks Hiya Big Boyz!! (curtsey, flirt flirt, eyelash wink), I thought this was newsworthy enough for the BOC-L mike coleman says hello, he's busy getting ready to go limpin' down the street so he can show off the black eye he gave himself last night somehow....people will think he's been in a fight..... -----Original Message----- From: Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com [mailto:Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Colin Allen Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2009 10:23 AM To: Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com Subject: [Hawkwind] Re: Dave Anderson in hospital after suffering two heart attacks Myself and Litmus have got to know Dave rather well over the last few years. He is a genuinely nice guy and an entertaining host. We wish him all the best and hope for a quick and complete recovery. Colin --- In Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com, "Dave Roberts" wrote: > > For those of you who are interested and would like to send Dave a get well card, he is in Ward 24 at the Royal Shrewsbury Hospital. > > Dave > > --- In Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com, Ian Abrahams wrote: > > > > How awful. I've spoken to and met Dave on occassions and he's a really cool guy as far as I'm concerned. As you say, get well soon Mr. A! > > > > Ian > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Dave Roberts > > To: Hawkwind at yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2009 12:14:39 AM > > Subject: [Hawkwind] Dave Anderson in hospital after suffering two heart attacks > > > > > > I thought you should all know that Dave Anderson has had two heart attacks and is recovering in hospital. > > He has had a stent insrted to open up the artery which caused the problem. > > Dave is making a good recovery and I'm sure everyone wiill wish him a speedy recovery. > > Dave has been working with the Groundhogs again lately, I saw him in Liverpool on Sunday night and he was looking well then. > > He was taken to hospital Tuesday morning after complaining of chest pains. He had a further heart attack whilst in hospital. > > Get well soon Dave. > > > > Dave > > > ------------------------------------ Hawkwind e-group! The world's #1 and greatest e-source for Hawkwind fans -- created and maintained by Hawkwind fans! Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Hawkwind/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Hawkwind/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: mailto:Hawkwind-digest at yahoogroups.com mailto:Hawkwind-fullfeatured at yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Hawkwind-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Mon Mar 23 15:50:33 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 12:50:33 -0700 Subject: Fw: [Up-Tight] Classic Rock gets prog rock specials spin-off Message-ID: Are you contributing to this, Ian Abrahams? Gary ----- Forwarded Message ---- From: Telstar To: Up-tight at yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 10:11:49 AM Subject: [Up-Tight] Classic Rock gets prog rock specials spin-off "LONDON - Future Publishing is launching a special edition prog rock spin-off of its Classic Rock magazine, entitled Classic Prog. Classic Prog is a series of four special editions dedicated to progressive rock. If the specials are successful, they could lead to the development of a prog rock magazine by the publisher. " http://tinyurl. com/dlsk9b Al __._,_.___ Messages in this topic (1) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages | Files | Photos | Links | Polls MARKETPLACE Are you Einstein smart? Take our Fun Quiz and get your IQ score today at Quizyou.net. ________________________________ ________________________________ >From kitchen basics to easy recipes - join the Group from Kraft Foods Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch format to Traditional Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe Recent ActivityVisit Your Group Yahoo! Groups Everyday Wellness Zone Check out featured healthy living groups. 10 Day Club on Yahoo! Groups Share the benefits of a high fiber diet. Group Charity Hands On Network Volunteering has never been so easy . __,_._,___ From ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK Mon Mar 23 16:07:38 2009 From: ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Ian Abrahams) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 20:07:38 +0000 Subject: [Up-Tight] Classic Rock gets prog rock specials spin-off In-Reply-To: <666703.25109.qm@web36901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: No - but looks interesting doesn't it! Ian ________________________________ From: gary shindler To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:50:33 PM Subject: Fw: [Up-Tight] Classic Rock gets prog rock specials spin-off Are you contributing to this, Ian Abrahams? Gary ----- Forwarded Message ---- From: Telstar To: Up-tight at yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 10:11:49 AM Subject: [Up-Tight] Classic Rock gets prog rock specials spin-off "LONDON - Future Publishing is launching a special edition prog rock spin-off of its Classic Rock magazine, entitled Classic Prog. Classic Prog is a series of four special editions dedicated to progressive rock. If the specials are successful, they could lead to the development of a prog rock magazine by the publisher. " http://tinyurl. com/dlsk9b Al __._,_.___ Messages in this topic (1) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages | Files | Photos | Links | Polls MARKETPLACE Are you Einstein smart? Take our Fun Quiz and get your IQ score today at Quizyou.net. ________________________________ ________________________________ >From kitchen basics to easy recipes - join the Group from Kraft Foods Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch format to Traditional Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe Recent ActivityVisit Your Group Yahoo! Groups Everyday Wellness Zone Check out featured healthy living groups. 10 Day Club on Yahoo! Groups Share the benefits of a high fiber diet. Group Charity Hands On Network Volunteering has never been so easy . __,_._,___ From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 23 18:07:51 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:07:51 -0600 Subject: (OFF) [Hawkwind] Re: Dave Anderson in hospital after suffering two heart attacks Message-ID: On 3/23/09, mary wrote: re Mary's objection to my (attempt at) getting in touch with her feminine side: yeah I apologize for posting that when you had a headache, low of me From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 23 18:30:39 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:30:39 -0600 Subject: Anyone know... In-Reply-To: <200903231519.n2NFJfqW000060@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: On 3/23/09, M Holmes wrote: > > ...who the guys were with the Pan Transcendental Industries uniforms at > the Magna gig? > FoFP Were any special guests advertised?? sounds like an intelligent new spin on the lab coat craze Did you inform them they are being deceived by the likes of.....nevermind.... From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 23 18:49:29 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:49:29 -0600 Subject: (OFF) Knights of Space audio mix In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 3/23/09, mary wrote: > > I heard a can of compressed air works too? > Mary That would be for "normal" people who just do regular maintenance I want my reversible vacuum cleaner back, my favorite way to clean cds..... If dust fallout was my only problem I would ask you politely if I could make a neat little cranial incision and borrow some... duuohh I kinda miss my girlfriend's MANDATORY "tidy time" From stevefreight at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 24 14:46:32 2009 From: stevefreight at GMAIL.COM (Steve Freight) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 18:46:32 +0000 Subject: Atomhenge Discs Message-ID: I have not received mine yet - anyone else waiting? Steve -- View Steve's Photos of Hawkwind Porcupine Tree and Isle of Wight http://www.flickr.com/photos/venthawktree From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 24 15:17:46 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 12:17:46 -0700 Subject: Atomhenge Discs Message-ID: I got my Live Chronicles from Amazon. Review forthcoming. Steve -----Original Message----- From: Steve Freight Date: Tuesday, Mar 24, 2009 2:50 pm Subject: Atomhenge Discs To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET I have not received mine yet - anyone else waiting? Steve -- View Steve's Photos of Hawkwind Porcupine Tree and Isle of Wight http://www.flickr.com/photos/venthawktree From jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM Wed Mar 25 03:53:07 2009 From: jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM (Jerry Kranitz) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 03:53:07 -0400 Subject: Aural Innovations Radio: New Space Does Not Care show Message-ID: http://Aural-Innovations.com MARCH 25, 2009: NEW RADIO SHOW: SPACE DOES NOT CARE (#13) I've uploaded a new show from Space Does Not Care (show #13). See the playlist below. Aural Innovations broadcasts 24 hours a day in both streaming and download editions. You can go directly to the Radio shows page at: http://aural-innovations.com/radio/radio.html Space Does Not Care (show #13) Chuck did a radio show dubbed "Space Does Not Care" from 1999-2003 at KUCR out of Riverside, CA, which streamed on-line for most of that time. After moving up to San Luis Obispo county, Chuck met with politics and apathy from the local college and public stations, but recently got a nudge from a friend to ask Jerry Kranitz if there was space for another show on Aural Innovations' on-line radio site: Hence the return of "Space Does Not Care", the format of which I'll safely place under the umbrella of Psych/Space/Kraut/Electro/Indie/Folk/Noise-rock. SKYE KLAD - "Guru In the Echo" (from Live) PORCUPINE TREE - "Jupiter Island" (from On the Sunday of Life - Snapper) PRESSUREHED - "Silver Bird/Mastadon" (from V/A Space Daze - Cleopatra) JET JAGUAR - "Hot Wheels" (from Deathrace Beyond the Stars - Overlord) GUILD NAVIGATORS - "Nurse Onboard" (from Deathrace Beyond the Stars) KAWABATA MAKOTO & GINESTET AUDREY- "Improvisation" (from Private Tapes 3 - AMT) KIDO NATSUKI - "Disco! Space! Baby!" (from Acid Mothers Family/Do Whatever You Want... - Earworm) FURSAXA - "Mon Lion" (from AMT Family) COSMIC RIDERS - "Galactic Bomber (Roll Over Capt. Ultra!)" (from AMT Family) MAGIC AUM GIGI - "Love Potion 26" (from AMT Family) ACID MOTHERS TEMPLE - "Dohkoku" (from AMT Family) DANNY & THE NIGHTMARES - "Adventures of God As a Young Boy" (from ST'd - Eternal Yip Eye) MICHAEL YONKERS - "Swamp of Love" (from V/A Bread, Beard & Bear's Prayers - Bastet) ALIEN SEX FIEND - "Mad Daddy Drives a U.F.O." (from Curse - Anagram) PINK MOUNTAINTOPS - "New Drug Queens" (from Axis of Evol - Jag Jaguar) RESIDENTS - "Live @ the Apollo/I'll Go Crazy" (from George & James - Cryptic Corp) THE ORB - "Tower 23 (Spud vs. Kreature Mix)" (from Bicycles & Tricycles - Sanctuary) BARRY ADAMSON - "Jesus Wept" (from As Above So Below - Mute) OCTOPUS PROJECT w/BLACK MOTH SUPER RAINBOW - "Marshmallow Window/Spiracle" (from the House of Apples & Eyeballs - Graveface) BLISS BLOOD - "Vaudeville Distorted" (from V/A You've Got Your Orders Vol.1 - Chrome Peeler) NEUTRAL MILK HOTEL - "Engine" (from Hype City Soundtrack - '93 demo cassette) BROTHER JT - "Country Blues/Be With Us" (from Bread, Beard & Bear's Prayers) SIANspheric - "Watch Me Fall" (from Else - Sonic Unyon) MOGWAI - "Fear Satan (Surgeon Mix)" (from V/A Fear Satan Remixes - Jet Set) PSYCHIC ILLS - "Diamond City Redux" (from ST'd - Social Registry) http://Aural-Innovations.com From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Wed Mar 25 06:41:33 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 10:41:33 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From albert at CELLSUM.COM Wed Mar 25 07:26:52 2009 From: albert at CELLSUM.COM (Albert Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:26:52 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903251041.n2PAfXYU008509@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? What about other stuff? My 2 cents? On Mar 25, 2009, at 6:41 AM, M Holmes wrote: > That nice coloured bloke has joined the fascists: > > http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2009/03/obama-sides-wit.html > > So it's bankruptcy for you if you download a music track, but if > through > your greed, you totally destroy the economy for a generation, the > government will pay for your yacht. > > I guess the Obama Illusion was nice while it lasted. > > FoFP > > > > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 25 07:39:37 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 04:39:37 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: Hey Al, have you heard of the approach that the UK is taking (or maybe has taken?) to make music downloading llegal, and pay for though some kind of network tax or surcharge, which is then to be divided among the music industry? Sort of like what they did in the US with cassette tapes? Aside from the technical issues, it occurs to me that only the industry heavyweights will get their payday. I suspect that small indie labels will get left out in the cold... Steve -----Original Message----- From: Albert Bouchard Date: Wednesday, Mar 25, 2009 7:29 am Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? What about other stuff? My 2 cents? On Mar 25, 2009, at 6:41 AM, M Holmes wrote: > That nice coloured bloke has joined the fascists: > > http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2009/03/obama-sides-wit.html > > So it's bankruptcy for you if you download a music track, but if > through > your greed, you totally destroy the economy for a generation, the > government will pay for your yacht. > > I guess the Obama Illusion was nice while it lasted. > > FoFP > > > > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > From arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL Wed Mar 25 08:15:32 2009 From: arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL (Arjan Hulsebos) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:15:32 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <3320811576.42790996@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 04:39:37 -0700, Steve Swann wrote > Hey Al, have you heard of the approach that the UK is taking (or > maybe has taken?) to make music downloading llegal, and pay for > though some kind of network tax or surcharge, which is then to be > divided among the music industry? Sort of like what they did in the > US with cassette tapes? They did that in the Netherlands, too, and they're still doing that with CD-Rs, and undoubtably DVD-Rs. > Aside from the technical issues, it occurs to me that only the > industry heavyweights will get their payday. I suspect that small > indie labels will get left out in the cold... At least the indies try to innovate, the only innovations that have come from the big labels have been on the judicial side... Just to mention a real quirk: if I were to download an out-of-sale album, and I want to pay the royalties, the responsible agencies would refuse to accept my pay. Why? They'd be promoting piracy if they would, they say.... Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK Wed Mar 25 08:28:44 2009 From: Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK (Steve Pond) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 12:28:44 +0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:26:52 -0400, you sent through the ether: >So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? Every record company I've ever had dealings with does, so why not? -S. From paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU Wed Mar 25 08:38:39 2009 From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU (Paul Mather) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 08:38:39 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 25 Mar 2009, at 7:26 AM, Albert Bouchard wrote: > So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? What about other stuff? Even if you accept that stealing music is wrong, and that these criminals are doing a terrible thing, do you think that a $150,000 fine is an appropriate punishment commensurate with the crime? Would you be fined $150,000 if you obtained via the five-fingered discount a CD containing the same music from a regular bricks and mortar store? (Or even that the $750 lower limit mentioned in the article is appropriate.) What gets me nervous is that the whole thing stinks of legal policy being dictated by lobbyists. Then, of course, there's the law of unintended consequences aspect that worries me. Look at what happened when the penalties for possession of soft drugs like marijuana were ramped up for political reasons: the prison population skyrocketed and is buckling under the strain with no appreciable effect on consumption or attitudes. Sure, these people broke the law, but does the punishment fit the crime? I just wonder if the "slap 'em with heavy fines" route is a very creative (or likely to succeed) solution to the problem. Maybe next they'll advocate the death penalty as a deterrent for illegal downloading. (They already posited it for hardware...) Cheers, Paul. e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." --- Frank Vincent Zappa From smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 25 09:26:05 2009 From: smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM (Jonathan Smith) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 21:26:05 +0800 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <7r8ks4d9grtmcannqmhr5d8rl5pqp5e89l@4ax.com> Message-ID: Well said, Steve! On 25/03/2009, Steve Pond wrote: > > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:26:52 -0400, you sent through the ether: > > >So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? > > > Every record company I've ever had dealings with does, so why not? > > > -S. > From iainferguson at AOL.COM Wed Mar 25 09:50:38 2009 From: iainferguson at AOL.COM (iainferguson at AOL.COM) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 09:50:38 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <39dabad60903250626p6741cd9ev9973ae3feeb59f2e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I don't have any answers, but i do disagree in general with freeloading from professional musicians, it is fundamentally theft, and should be dealt with appropriately. However there are some real flaws here, out of print, discontinued, simply unavailable, and rare records, plus live boots all need to be available, and under strict laws they are illegal. But just not in the same league as contemporary bands releases. recent releases obviously cost money to make, promote, etc and therefore record companies & bands get all bend out of shape when people start freeloading from the lastest catalogue. record companies and technology are not in sync, and that is where the problem lies. The barn doors are open, you cannot ?shut them again. So a new solution needs to be found. Whilst i'm against people getting fined. I am also against musicians getting ripped off, they already get that enough from the record company. I play in a band and released the music via our own record label, its not expensive, and we can have it on amazon etc if we want. I've not gone to see if the music is available on line for download, I don't really care, we are a 2 bit band that charges ?5 for a CD. We all have fulltime jobs, so we are not dependant on the money collected through sales. However If I was in a serious band, trying to get up the ladder, or even already up the ladder and each CD sale is part of my actual salary, I'd be pretty p*ss*d off if any of my=2 0CURRENT IN PRINT albums appeared online for people do download.. regards iain -----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Smith To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:26 Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Well said, Steve! On 25/03/2009, Steve Pond wrote: > > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:26:52 -0400, you sent through the ether: > > >So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? > > > Every record company I've ever had dealings with does, so why not? > > > -S. > ________________________________________________________________________ AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today. From albert at CELLSUM.COM Wed Mar 25 09:53:33 2009 From: albert at CELLSUM.COM (albert at CELLSUM.COM) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 06:53:33 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: But how about if thousands of internet users started downloading those beautiful pictures on your website. Wouldn't you want to be paid a little something? Wouldn't you like to have a choice? Al On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:26:52 -0400, you sent through the ether: So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? Every record company I've ever had dealings with does, so why not? -S. From smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 25 10:32:38 2009 From: smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM (Jonathan Smith) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 22:32:38 +0800 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <47442.165.1237989213.squirrel@o10.hostbaby.com> Message-ID: I am very willing to buy from a band's web site, or someone like Atomhenge who doing such a good job, but I also feel that I've been ripped off time and again by record companies. Worst of all is iTunes, where you don't even get anything physical for your money, but Apple have made billions from marketing this con. What are you 'stealing' if you download an MP3? You don't get the CD. If you buy the CD, you only seem to own the CD itself. If you lose it, you have to buy it again, so you don't own the music. There are many angles to this. Not just is it, or is it not, theft. Perhaps people buy CDs because they have been able to listen to the music first, for example. There is no guarantee that everything a band produces is worth buying-- you don't get refunds. CDs themselves are outmoded technology. MP3s and Apple's format are poor lossy copies of an out of date 16-bit CD format. Some people have a rather more intelligent approach. Take Trent Reznor, of Nine Inch Nails, for example. He has given away an entire album on his web site, The Slip. He still made $1.5 million from it because people like me liked it so much they bought a physical copy (in 5.1 surround/ 24 bit). Martin Atkins of Pigface has said that you have to get used to downloads and tour more. DJ Spooky (aka Paul Miller) gives links to download sites on his web site! Maybe he wants more people to listen to him. The very rich such Bono whines about his music being sacred. TBH, they haven't produced anything worth downloading even for free for years. It is not as simple as stealing or not. Have you never taped a TV show? Is that stealing too? JS On 25/03/2009, albert at cellsum.com wrote: > > But how about if thousands of internet users started downloading those > beautiful pictures on your website. Wouldn't you want to be paid a little > something? Wouldn't you like to have a choice? > Al > > > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:26:52 -0400, you sent through the ether: > > So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? > > > Every record company I've ever had dealings with does, so why not? > > -S. > From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Wed Mar 25 10:46:30 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:46:30 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <39dabad60903250732m1e5d3107ub393c48bc0338d1e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I personally stopped downloading and burning years ago. A member recently offered me a burn and I turned it down. If I wanted it that bad I'd buy it and hopefully the artist would be compensated for my purchase. I even try not to buy used copies, the artist doesn't get any pay for that. All those promo copies filling up record stores that DJs would hock for "other things" that comes out of the artist's advance. Albert wants to be paid for his work, that's not a crime. Gary ________________________________ From: Jonathan Smith To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 9:32:38 AM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! I am very willing to buy from a band's web site, or someone like Atomhenge who doing such a good job, but I also feel that I've been ripped off time and again by record companies. Worst of all is iTunes, where you don't even get anything physical? for your money, but Apple have made billions from marketing this con. What are you 'stealing' if you download an MP3?? You don't get the CD. If you buy the CD, you only seem to own the CD itself. If you lose it, you have to buy it again, so you don't own the music. There are many angles to this. Not just is it, or is it not, theft. Perhaps people buy CDs because they have been able to listen to the music first, for example. There is no guarantee that everything a band produces is worth buying-- you don't get refunds. CDs themselves are outmoded technology. MP3s and Apple's format are poor lossy copies of an out of date 16-bit CD format. Some people have a rather more intelligent approach. Take Trent Reznor, of Nine Inch Nails, for example. He has given away an entire album on his web site, The Slip. He still made $1.5 million from it because people like me liked it so much they bought a physical copy (in 5.1 surround/ 24 bit). Martin Atkins of Pigface has said that you have to get used to downloads and tour more. DJ Spooky (aka Paul Miller) gives links to download sites on his web site! Maybe he wants more people to listen to him. The very rich such Bono whines about his music being sacred. TBH, they haven't produced anything worth downloading even for free for years. It is not as simple as stealing or not. Have you never taped a TV show? Is that stealing too? JS On 25/03/2009, albert at cellsum.com wrote: > > But how about if thousands of internet users started downloading those > beautiful pictures on your website. Wouldn't you want to be paid a little > something? Wouldn't you like to have a choice? > Al > > > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:26:52 -0400, you sent through the ether: > > So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? > > > Every record company I've ever had dealings with does, so why not? > > -S. > From Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK Wed Mar 25 11:35:40 2009 From: Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK (Steve Pond) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 15:35:40 +0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <47442.165.1237989213.squirrel@o10.hostbaby.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 06:53:33 -0700, you sent through the ether: >But how about if thousands of internet users started downloading those >beautiful pictures on your website. Wouldn't you want to be paid a little >something? Wouldn't you like to have a choice? That's not really the same, the images on my website are uploaded at a resolution that won't print larger than about 2" across, if people want to buy proper prints there's only one place to get them. Record companies have only themselves to blame for letting the music genie out of the bottle, if they'd acted quickly, and priced competitively every record company would have an online store and itunes wouldn't exist. But record companies were too welded to selling slices of plastic at gigantic profits. It's all moot anyway, I think we're in a transitional phase, the obvious end game is an annual "media fee" which will give you access to all music on the servers controlled by whoever is charging the fee.. 10 mergers down the line and that will be one server and one fee. (Ditto movies) the concept of "owning" music is outdated. Smaller bands will survive by playing live and offering value added content on their own website's, forums with active band members and daily/regular blogs from the band themselves, discount live tickets, merchandise etc.. think of it as philanthropy.. Like Hawkwind? ?5 per annum straight to the band for access to the good stuff on the website is a) cheaper than an annual CD release, and b) gives the band 500% more than they got 10 years ago if you bought their annual CD release. My comment was prompted more by my own experiences which are that record companies release my music "officially" and I never get paid. I call it theft. The Calvert Carlisle MP3's we've been giving away for 10 years on my website are being released by Voiceprint soon, have Fred or I been consulted? asked to supply sleeve notes? offered a free copy? entered into any sort of agreement? Nope. I hope it shows up on the Torrents the day after release. -Steve From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 25 11:01:42 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 08:01:42 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: I buy all my commercially produced MP3s from Amazon. (I just wish they had a broader selection, though it seems to be getting better all the time.) I heard a rumor that iTunes is going DRM-free, in which case I'll give them another look. Steve -----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Smith Date: Wednesday, Mar 25, 2009 10:35 am Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET I am very willing to buy from a band's web site, or someone like Atomhenge who doing such a good job, but I also feel that I've been ripped off time and again by record companies. Worst of all is iTunes, where you don't even get anything physical for your money, but Apple have made billions from marketing this con. What are you 'stealing' if you download an MP3? You don't get the CD. If you buy the CD, you only seem to own the CD itself. If you lose it, you have to buy it again, so you don't own the music. There are many angles to this. Not just is it, or is it not, theft. Perhaps people buy CDs because they have been able to listen to the music first, for example. There is no guarantee that everything a band produces is worth buying-- you don't get refunds. CDs themselves are outmoded technology. MP3s and Apple's format are poor lossy copies of an out of date 16-bit CD format. Some people have a rather more intelligent approach. Take Trent Reznor, of Nine Inch Nails, for example. He has given away an entire album on his web site, The Slip. He still made $1.5 million from it because people like me liked it so much they bought a physical copy (in 5.1 surround/ 24 bit). Martin Atkins of Pigface has said that you have to get used to downloads and tour more. DJ Spooky (aka Paul Miller) gives links to download sites on his web site! Maybe he wants more people to listen to him. The very rich such Bono whines about his music being sacred. TBH, they haven't produced anything worth downloading even for free for years. It is not as simple as stealing or not. Have you never taped a TV show? Is that stealing too? JS On 25/03/2009, albert at cellsum.com wrote: > But how about if thousands of internet users started downloading those beautiful pictures on your website. Wouldn't you want to be paid a little something? Wouldn't you like to have a choice? Al > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:26:52 -0400, you sent through the ether: > So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? > Every record company I've ever had dealings with does, so why not? > -S. From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Wed Mar 25 11:29:30 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 15:29:30 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Albert Bouchard's message of Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:26:52 -0400 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From denis at PTI-INC.DE Wed Mar 25 11:34:51 2009 From: denis at PTI-INC.DE (Denis Regenbrecht) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:34:51 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <3320823699.43112116@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, > I buy all my commercially produced MP3s from Amazon. (I just wish > they had a broader selection, though it seems to be getting better > all the time.) I wish there was a European amazon-music-store, or some way to use the US-store from Europe... *sigh* Perhaps some day in the future. > I heard a rumor that iTunes is going DRM-free, in which case I'll > give them another look. It's not a rumour anymore. iTunes-songs have been DRM-free since January this year. Additionally the standard bitrate is now 256k instead of 128k for all songs. (c)IAO D+R np: The Prodigy, "Invaders Must Die" From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 25 11:42:36 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 09:42:36 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903251529.n2PFTUQW004407@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: but this argumenat is about a nasty plague bestowed onto the people since about 1987 replacing music made by people for the people with, erm ALIEN CRAP where's the vinyl in this??? I still remember Neil Young's words "the mind is tricked but the heart is sad" attack the record companie's employees as they exit to go home and for god sake STEAL EVERYTHING that does not measure 12 x 12 no, I am not serious I enjoyed posting it though On 3/25/09, M Holmes wrote: > > Albert Bouchard writes: > > > So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? What about other stuff? > > My 2 cents? > > In fact my views on this will surprise many, since I actually do > advocate communism on this issue. > > I believe the tech will for the forseeable future be such that piracy of > movies/music/books is going to be possible and indeed easy. So how do we > organise things so that punters can easily download what they want when > they want, and still arrange for the originators/promoters to be paid? > > The same problem came up with radio broadcasting and we came up with the > whole Performing Rights arrangements. > > With computer networks, we can apply the same model in a better way: > > Charge, through network access providers, each and every denizen of the > interweb, one Dollar per week for access. For that they get access to > everything. Use the web itself to count accesses and then distribute the > cash in some way proportional to what's popular and what it cost to > produce and distribute it. Something along those lines would ensure that > folks do get paid for creative endeavour while ensuring that the punters > can get what they want as and when they want it. > > Of course, as with the BBC Licence Fee, the entertainment industries > would thereafter constantly be in a political battle to try to get the > user fee increased in order to have more pie to share out. Those sorts > of battles though have to be better than fights in Court to sue their > own fans into bankruptcy. > > So there you have it: this libertarian wants some communism. > > FoFP > > > > > > > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > From smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 25 11:58:18 2009 From: smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM (Jonathan Smith) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 23:58:18 +0800 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <7qiks4pqssf4f8ejldvioc8aka11akvpd0@4ax.com> Message-ID: Steve, I was wondering about that Calvert gig. Who will get the royalties, then? How did Voiceprint get hold of it? I probably will buy it for the better sound quality and extra tracks and it will get shared. Steve, your web site is great example an intelligent approach to downloading. I have appreciated that for years-- I may even have all the MP3's that used to be there (thanks Dave Anderson)-- and listened to fun music I couldn't have heard otherwise. It's good to be able to listen to Krankshaft, too. Jonathan On 25/03/2009, Steve Pond wrote: > > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 06:53:33 -0700, you sent through the ether: > > > >But how about if thousands of internet users started downloading those > >beautiful pictures on your website. Wouldn't you want to be paid a little > >something? Wouldn't you like to have a choice? > > > That's not really the same, the images on my website are uploaded at a > resolution that won't print larger than about 2" across, if people > want to buy proper prints there's only one place to get them. > > Record companies have only themselves to blame for letting the music > genie out of the bottle, if they'd acted quickly, and priced > competitively every record company would have an online store and > itunes wouldn't exist. > > But record companies were too welded to selling slices of plastic at > gigantic profits. > > It's all moot anyway, I think we're in a transitional phase, the > obvious end game is an annual "media fee" which will give you access > to all music on the servers controlled by whoever is charging the > fee.. 10 mergers down the line and that will be one server and one > fee. (Ditto movies) the concept of "owning" music is outdated. > > Smaller bands will survive by playing live and offering value added > content on their own website's, forums with active band members and > daily/regular blogs from the band themselves, discount live tickets, > merchandise etc.. think of it as philanthropy.. Like Hawkwind? ?5 per > annum straight to the band for access to the good stuff on the website > is a) cheaper than an annual CD release, and b) gives the band 500% > more than they got 10 years ago if you bought their annual CD release. > > My comment was prompted more by my own experiences which are that > record companies release my music "officially" and I never get paid. I > call it theft. > > The Calvert Carlisle MP3's we've been giving away for 10 years on my > website are being released by Voiceprint soon, have Fred or I been > consulted? asked to supply sleeve notes? offered a free copy? entered > into any sort of agreement? Nope. > > I hope it shows up on the Torrents the day after release. > > > -Steve > From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Wed Mar 25 12:19:20 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:19:20 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Paul Mather's message of Wed, 25 Mar 2009 08:38:39 -0400 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Wed Mar 25 12:48:41 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:48:41 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Jonathan Smith's message of Wed, 25 Mar 2009 22:32:38 +0800 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Wed Mar 25 13:20:46 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:20:46 -0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <47442.165.1237989213.squirrel@o10.hostbaby.com> <7qiks4pqssf4f8ejldvioc8aka11akvpd0@4ax.com> Message-ID: wot beautiful pictures are those then...ha ha ha real festival music is the only site with beautiful lovely wonderful pictures on it there are even some of me on it me me me me me d'ya hear??? REAL FESTIVAL MUSIC - RFM http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk Festival CD's, Festival Photo Reviews, Festival Listings, Video Downloads, News, Healers so there! trev -------------------------------------------------- From: "Steve Pond" Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 3:35 PM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 06:53:33 -0700, you sent through the ether: > >>But how about if thousands of internet users started downloading those >>beautiful pictures on your website. Wouldn't you want to be paid a little >>something? Wouldn't you like to have a choice? > > That's not really the same, the images on my website are uploaded at a > resolution that won't print larger than about 2" across, if people > want to buy proper prints there's only one place to get them. > > Record companies have only themselves to blame for letting the music > genie out of the bottle, if they'd acted quickly, and priced > competitively every record company would have an online store and > itunes wouldn't exist. > > But record companies were too welded to selling slices of plastic at > gigantic profits. > > It's all moot anyway, I think we're in a transitional phase, the > obvious end game is an annual "media fee" which will give you access > to all music on the servers controlled by whoever is charging the > fee.. 10 mergers down the line and that will be one server and one > fee. (Ditto movies) the concept of "owning" music is outdated. > > Smaller bands will survive by playing live and offering value added > content on their own website's, forums with active band members and > daily/regular blogs from the band themselves, discount live tickets, > merchandise etc.. think of it as philanthropy.. Like Hawkwind? ?5 per > annum straight to the band for access to the good stuff on the website > is a) cheaper than an annual CD release, and b) gives the band 500% > more than they got 10 years ago if you bought their annual CD release. > > My comment was prompted more by my own experiences which are that > record companies release my music "officially" and I never get paid. I > call it theft. > > The Calvert Carlisle MP3's we've been giving away for 10 years on my > website are being released by Voiceprint soon, have Fred or I been > consulted? asked to supply sleeve notes? offered a free copy? entered > into any sort of agreement? Nope. > > I hope it shows up on the Torrents the day after release. > > -Steve > From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Wed Mar 25 13:30:01 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:30:01 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903250842s77f15a20o60244a9cabff0d77@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I enjoyed reading it. What a long thread, wow! STEAL EVERYTHING that does not measure 12 x 12 no, I am not serious I enjoyed posting it though On 3/25/09, M Holmes wrote: > > Albert Bouchard writes: > > > So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? What about other stuff? > > My 2 cents? > > In fact my views on this will surprise many, since I actually do > advocate communism on this issue. > > I believe the tech will for the forseeable future be such that piracy of > movies/music/books is going to be possible and indeed easy. So how do we > organise things so that punters can easily download what they want when > they want, and still arrange for the originators/promoters to be paid? > > The same problem came up with radio broadcasting and we came up with the > whole Performing Rights arrangements. > > With computer networks, we can apply the same model in a better way: > > Charge, through network access providers, each and every denizen of the > interweb, one Dollar per week for access. For that they get access to > everything. Use the web itself to count accesses and then distribute the > cash in some way proportional to what's popular and what it cost to > produce and distribute it. Something along those lines would ensure that > folks do get paid for creative endeavour while ensuring that the punters > can get what they want as and when they want it. > > Of course, as with the BBC Licence Fee, the entertainment industries > would thereafter constantly be in a political battle to try to get the > user fee increased in order to have more pie to share out. Those sorts > of battles though have to be better than fights in Court to sue their > own fans into bankruptcy. > > So there you have it: this libertarian wants some communism. > > FoFP > > > > > > > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > From Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK Wed Mar 25 13:38:58 2009 From: Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK (Steve Pond) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:38:58 +0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:20:46 -0000, you sent through the ether: >real festival music is the only site with beautiful lovely wonderful >pictures on it I've seen those snapshots! From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Wed Mar 25 13:40:08 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:40:08 -0400 Subject: A computer question Message-ID: Hi, friends, I very carefully inserted a disc into the computer, and when I tried to get it out it wouldn't budge. I have tried the trick with the paper clip, and also leaning the tower forward, but the thing is jammed in there, and the computer doesn't acknowledge it as being there. Any other ideas? Honest, it wasn't me being clumsy. A friend was standing right there when it happened, but he knows less about computers than I do, if you can believe that. I hope someone has a good idea for getting the disc out, so I can get the burner back. Now, the real question is why does this always have to happen to me? I don't mean to be a pita with all these computer queries. Thanks, Mary From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Wed Mar 25 13:44:21 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 11:44:21 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <498768.71375.qm@web36906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 3/25/09, gary shindler wrote: > > . A member recently offered me a burn and I turned it down. If I wanted it > that bad I'd buy it and hopefully the artist would be compensated for my > purchase. That offer was through me, with the specific intention of KOS so you could have particpated in that thread. I don't even have it and I was trying to get you a copy on the assumption that you will be buying enough HW items in the future I have put enough dough in the HW machine to cover you and several more forum members FOR LIFE If you only know what I went through making that offer happen.......hehehe From Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK Wed Mar 25 13:45:15 2009 From: Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK (Steve Pond) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:45:15 +0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <39dabad60903250858s79487cecu6cb84a294c125483@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 23:58:18 +0800, you sent through the ether: >I was wondering about that Calvert gig. Who will get the royalties, then? >How did Voiceprint get hold of it? The gig was taped on a chrome cassette, the actual cassette belonged to our ... I have no idea what you'd call him, but he came to every gig, videoed & photographed every gig & rehearsal, he is now the mastering engineer that Voiceprint use. You don't have to be Sherlock Holmes :o) As for royalties, we won't see any. Probably a grand changed hands for the original tape, and then it's 100% to Voiceprint, maybe they'll bung some at Jill Calvert as they've put some demo's of Bobs on as extra tracks, and probably to lure people in who have the gig from the website. Who knows. Don't be so sure the CD will have the better audio quality.. I'll up the bitrate of mine & then we'll see! -S. From horse at DARKSTAR.UK.NET Wed Mar 25 13:46:57 2009 From: horse at DARKSTAR.UK.NET (Horse) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:46:57 +0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903251648.n2PGmfe0010646@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: So what do you guys think of spotify? Lots of 'free' music available. M Holmes wrote: > Jonathan Smith writes: > > >> It is not as simple as stealing or not. Have you never taped a TV show? Is >> that stealing too? >> > > There's an interesting debate all in itself. If you record a TV show to > watch later, it's "timeshift recording" and is quite legal. If you > forget to delete it after having watched it though, it now becomes > illegal. If you put it on a DVD and delete it, that's pirating too, even > if you or anyone else never ever watches the DVD again. > > The law almost worked when a recording was defined by a physical object. > It doesn't any more. > > FoFP > > > -- Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, wine in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming "WOO HOO what a ride!"... Hunter S Thompson From sloterdijk at MSN.COM Wed Mar 25 13:50:47 2009 From: sloterdijk at MSN.COM (Burro Mike) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:50:47 +0000 Subject: Looking 2 two bands to do 3 act show with me in Hamilton , New Jersey Message-ID: Greetings my friends, I am looking for two bands to do a 3 act bill with me in Hamilton , New Jersey on Friday, May 8th ( Muthas Day Weekend show ). Now although I am also performing on this bill, I am booking the other two acts myself, so I will be basing the selections from the responses I get on which acts I feel woould work best for this event. Below you'll see some technical information about the venue ( Hamilton Lanes ).You must be 18+ to enter and 21 to drink. There will be $7.00 cover charge at the door, and each band will receive 3 dollars of every 7 they bring in. THIS MEANS THAT PEOPLE AT THE DOOR ARE ASKED WHICH BAND THEY CAME TO SEE, AND WILL RESPOND BY MENTIONING YOUR NAME. A TALLY WILL BE KEPT FOR EACH BAND. THE TOTAL FOR ALL BANDS WILL NOT BE DIVIDED AMONG ALL THE PERFORMERS. YOU WILL RECEIVE 3 DOLLARS FOR EVERY PERSON THAT COMES SPECIFICALLY TO SEE YOUR BAND, SO THE MORE PEOPLE YOU BRING, THE MORE YOU MAKE. This IS NOT MY POLICY, BUT IS THE POLICY OF THE BOOKING AGENCY ( Captial City concerts ) and the Venue.Here is the relevent information: If you are interested in one of these slots, please email at BOTH this myspace page http://www.myspace.com/sloterdijk1 ( Sloterdijk ) and also at: Sloterdijk at msn.com Please respond ASAP and also only if you will really be able to do the gig Cheers! Mike Burro Hamilton Lanes Lounge 1200 Kuser Rd Hamilton, NJ (609) 585-2400 http://myspace.com/Hamiltonlanes 40 min sets/15 min changeovers 10pm-close Mike Burro and Friends $7 cover/Bands get $3 a head 18+ Show Bands must bring all equipment. This includes drums, amps, guitars etc.. We have full concert PA and Soundman Please Load in at 9:00pm. Please load in through front door outside in the parking lot. Bands can park anywhere. Capital City Concerts http://www.capitalcityconcerts.com Booking: *Finnigans, East Windsor, NJ ^Trocadero Balcony Theatre, Philly, PA *Maritas Cantina, New Brunswick, NJ ^JB's Showcase, Morrisville,PA *Hamilton Lanes, Hamilton, NJ *Denotes house booking agent _________________________________________________________________ Internet Explorer 8 ? Now Available. Faster, safer, easier. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/141323790/direct/01/ From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Wed Mar 25 14:00:26 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 11:00:26 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903251044g24f27ea3tc2c39800fac9e143@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: The Atomhenge releases have provoked some drooling on my part and I'm trying to discern which reissues I need/want. So far I'm only lacking "Live 79," "Electric Teepee" and "Distant Horizons" (I have originals of the catalogue, but not the extra stuff). Anyone care to rank the reissues so far for those sitting on the fence? Gary ________________________________ From: mike coleman To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 12:44:21 PM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On 3/25/09, gary shindler wrote: > > . A member recently offered me a burn and I turned it down. If I wanted it > that bad I'd buy it and hopefully the artist would be compensated for my > purchase. That offer was through me, with the specific intention of KOS so you could have particpated in that thread. I don't even have it and I was trying to get you a copy on the assumption that you will be buying enough HW items in the future I have put enough dough in the HW machine to cover you and several more forum members FOR LIFE If you only know what I went through making that offer happen.......hehehe From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Wed Mar 25 14:53:02 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 18:53:02 -0000 Subject: If you pirate clicks, you're downloading money In-Reply-To: <47442.165.1237989213.squirrel@o10.hostbaby.com> <7qiks4pqssf4f8ejldvioc8aka11akvpd0@4ax.com> <61rks4pbbjb11k30vs22vefif5eipr91k8@4ax.com> Message-ID: whaaaaaat?...palpitate...swoon...tremble...fart http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk/images.html we're selling out...putting up click ads he he so you can all give me money...soon money money money money money d'ya hear? d'ya hear?????? judge money -------------------------------------------------- From: "Steve Pond" Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 5:38 PM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:20:46 -0000, you sent through the ether: > >>real festival music is the only site with beautiful lovely wonderful >>pictures on it > > > I've seen those snapshots! > From alan.taylor96 at BLUEYONDER.CO.UK Wed Mar 25 15:44:01 2009 From: alan.taylor96 at BLUEYONDER.CO.UK (Alan Taylor) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 19:44:01 +0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <49CA6E11.9080607@darkstar.uk.net> Message-ID: I like spotify a lot. I don't care about security worries, there's no details of mine on there that are worth having. I like it because you can browse listening to bands I've never listened to before or for a long time. Yesterday, I was listening to HW, Ultravox, Julian Cope and Elvis Costello. It's limited obviously (no beatles for example) but I don't find the adverts too obtrusive. Horse wrote: > So what do you guys think of spotify? > Lots of 'free' music available. > > M Holmes wrote: >> Jonathan Smith writes: >> >> >>> It is not as simple as stealing or not. Have you never taped a TV >>> show? Is >>> that stealing too? >>> >> >> There's an interesting debate all in itself. If you record a TV show to >> watch later, it's "timeshift recording" and is quite legal. If you >> forget to delete it after having watched it though, it now becomes >> illegal. If you put it on a DVD and delete it, that's pirating too, even >> if you or anyone else never ever watches the DVD again. >> >> The law almost worked when a recording was defined by a physical object. >> It doesn't any more. >> >> FoFP >> >> >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.27/2021 - Release Date: 03/24/09 16:00:00 > > From paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU Wed Mar 25 16:15:42 2009 From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU (Paul Mather) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:15:42 -0400 Subject: Looking 2 two bands to do 3 act show with me in Hamilton , New Jersey In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 25 Mar 2009, at 1:50 PM, Burro Mike wrote: > There will be $7.00 cover charge at the door, and each band will > receive 3 dollars of every 7 they bring in. THIS MEANS THAT PEOPLE > AT THE DOOR ARE ASKED WHICH BAND THEY CAME TO SEE, AND WILL RESPOND > BY MENTIONING YOUR NAME. A TALLY WILL BE KEPT FOR EACH BAND. THE > TOTAL FOR ALL BANDS WILL NOT BE DIVIDED AMONG ALL THE PERFORMERS. > YOU WILL RECEIVE 3 DOLLARS FOR EVERY PERSON THAT COMES SPECIFICALLY > TO SEE YOUR BAND, SO THE MORE PEOPLE YOU BRING, THE MORE YOU MAKE. If asked which band you came to see you answer (quite reasonably), "all of them," does that mean that each band gets $1 each or do all three get nothing as punishment for lack of fan fervour? (Or, do they select one to receive the $3 on a round-robin basis?) Cheers, Paul. e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." --- Frank Vincent Zappa From albert at CELLSUM.COM Wed Mar 25 19:54:05 2009 From: albert at CELLSUM.COM (Albert Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 19:54:05 -0400 Subject: A computer question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On a mac the cd will spill its guts if you hold down the mouse button as it's starting up. That's my one trick. Al On Mar 25, 2009, at 1:40 PM, mary wrote: > Hi, friends, > I very carefully inserted a disc into the computer, and when I tried > to get > it out it wouldn't budge. I have tried the trick with the paper > clip, and > also leaning the tower forward, but the thing is jammed in there, > and the > computer doesn't acknowledge it as being there. Any other ideas? > Honest, > it wasn't me being clumsy. A friend was standing right there when it > happened, but he knows less about computers than I do, if you can > believe > that. I hope someone has a good idea for getting the disc out, so I > can get > the burner back. Now, the real question is why does this always > have to > happen to me? > I don't mean to be a pita with all these computer queries. > > Thanks, > > Mary > From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 07:44:40 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 04:44:40 -0700 Subject: A computer question Message-ID: I miss the days when burners had deep wells for the disk - you could hardly misplace the disk without -----Original Message----- From: mary Date: Wednesday, Mar 25, 2009 1:42 pm Subject: A computer question To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Hi, friends, I very carefully inserted a disc into the computer, and when I tried to get it out it wouldn't budge. I have tried the trick with the paper clip, and also leaning the tower forward, but the thing is jammed in there, and the computer doesn't acknowledge it as being there. Any other ideas? Honest, it wasn't me being clumsy. A friend was standing right there when it happened, but he knows less about computers than I do, if you can believe that. I hope someone has a good idea for getting the disc out, so I can get the burner back. Now, the real question is why does this always have to happen to me? I don't mean to be a pita with all these computer queries. Thanks, Mary From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 07:54:02 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 04:54:02 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: So I started writing this earlier and accidentally bumped the send button, so ignore my previous partial message... Anyway, bottom line is that if the paperclip trick doesn't work, about all you can do is remove the drive and try shaking it. Then you can re-test whether that's loosened the disc by just plugging in the power cable and hitting eject - no need to re-install the drive in the case (or connect the data cable) until it works. It not *hard* to do this but if you're not good with PC hardware you might have trouble getting it back in when you're done. Steve -----Original Message----- From: mary Date: Wednesday, Mar 25, 2009 1:32 pm Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET I enjoyed reading it. What a long thread, wow! STEAL EVERYTHING that does not measure 12 x 12 no, I am not serious I enjoyed posting it though On 3/25/09, M Holmes wrote: > Albert Bouchard writes: > > So I guess you think it's OK to steal music? What about other stuff? > My 2 cents? > In fact my views on this will surprise many, since I actually do advocate communism on this issue. > I believe the tech will for the forseeable future be such that piracy of movies/music/books is going to be possible and indeed easy. So how do we organise things so that punters can easily download what they want when they want, and still arrange for the originators/promoters to be paid? > The same problem came up with radio broadcasting and we came up with the whole Performing Rights arrangements. > With computer networks, we can apply the same model in a better way: > Charge, through network access providers, each and every denizen of the interweb, one Dollar per week for access. For that they get access to everything. Use the web itself to count accesses and then distribute the cash in some way proportional to what's popular and what it cost to produce and distribute it. Something along those lines would ensure that folks do get paid for creative endeavour while ensuring that the punters can get what they want as and when they want it. > Of course, as with the BBC Licence Fee, the entertainment industries would thereafter constantly be in a political battle to try to get the user fee increased in order to have more pie to share out. Those sorts of battles though have to be better than fights in Court to sue their own fans into bankruptcy. > So there you have it: this libertarian wants some communism. > FoFP > > > > -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336. From cea at CARLAZ.COM Thu Mar 26 08:20:54 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 07:20:54 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <39dabad60903250732m1e5d3107ub393c48bc0338d1e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 25 Mar 2009, at 09:32, Jonathan Smith wrote: > Worst of all is iTunes, where you don't even get anything physical > for your > money, but Apple have made billions from marketing this con. I don't feel like I need anything physical -- the files will do me. However, I _don't_ like iTunes because you pay about as much as a CD for a lossy format. This is uncool. I should pay _less_ than a CD for a lossless file, and unless I can, why the heck am I gonna buy a download. However, I would dearly love to see the opportunity to buy lossless downloads legally as a regular thing. I live in a place without a terribly developed infrastructure, and ordering CDs through the post is not a terribly viable option; if they ever arrived, it would take a very long time and there would be all kinds of extra tariffs and charges tacked on to make the experience irritating and tedious. I'd probably have to go off to some office and sign forms and pay extras -- just to get a remaindered CD that cost less than 10 bucks! My house doesn't even have an official postal address anyway. But it does have perfectly serviceable broadband internet :) and I could download that same CD within a few hours, with any luck .... If only someone would let me! Yes, there will remain issues with pricing and digital copies -- it's no surprise that where I live and throughout the developing world there is such widespread piracy, as the average person here can't possibly afford UK prices -- but for heaven's sake, there is lots of music that I effectively can't buy because physical CDs simply are locally available, but that I _could_ pirate with speed and ease because fast internet access _is_ available. For anyone in the music business -- at least anyone who wants to sell me anything -- there should be something wrong with this picture. Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From cea at CARLAZ.COM Thu Mar 26 08:28:02 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 07:28:02 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <498768.71375.qm@web36906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 25 Mar 2009, at 09:46, gary shindler wrote: > I even try not to buy used copies, the artist doesn't get any pay > for that. Well, the artist _did_ get paid when the first person bought it. :) Otherwise, with this argument, we may as well say that renting an apartment is immoral because the architect or construction workers aren't getting a continuing cut of the building they designed or built. :) Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From jswartz at MITRE.ORG Thu Mar 26 08:34:01 2009 From: jswartz at MITRE.ORG (Swartz, John A.) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 08:34:01 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: > I am very willing to buy from a band's web site, or someone like Atomhenge > who doing such a good job, but I also feel that I've been ripped off time > and again by record companies. Agree. It is, however, not possible to set up a system by which people are "willing to buy from" because they don't feel that they are being ripped off from. People seem to feel that because the record companies have ripped them off (and I agree that we have been), that they have the right to download and copy music illegally. > > Worst of all is iTunes, where you don't even get anything physical for > your > money, but Apple have made billions from marketing this con. > Hey, I've spent hundreds of dollars from the iTunes music store - all music that I could have gone to a store and purchased on CD if I wanted to. Apple didn't put a gun to my head, and I've gotten lots of music that I wanted at a reasonable price - and as long as I take care of my electronic copies and back up my files, I'll never need to find those particular songs likely ever again (unlike when I first had them on vinyl or 8-track, then cassette, then ANOTHER cassette when the first one wore out, then CD...). > What are you 'stealing' if you download an MP3? You don't get the CD. If > you buy the CD, you only seem to own the CD itself. If you lose it, you > have > to buy it again, so you don't own the music. You are "stealing" from the people responsible for creating that music in the first place - YOU don't have a CD, but at the same time, the artist (and yes, I know the record companies take a huge share, perhaps ripping off the artist, but again, I don't think that's a legit argument for stealing music) doesn't get his due share of the sale of the CD you would have had to purchase if you didn't download the file. Oh, and I know people will argue that they never would have bought the CD in the first place - so is it o.k. to steal an expensive car because you couldn't ever afford it and would never buy it anyway? > There are many angles to this. Not just is it, or is it not, theft. Perhaps > people buy CDs because they have been able to listen to the music first, > for > example. There is no guarantee that everything a band produces is worth > buying-- you don't get refunds. CDs themselves are outmoded technology. > MP3s > and Apple's format are poor lossy copies of an out of date 16-bit CD > format. And how do you want your music produced? 64-bit recordings on Blu-ray? > > Some people have a rather more intelligent approach. Take Trent Reznor, of > Nine Inch Nails, for example. He has given away an entire album on his web > site, The Slip. He still made $1.5 million from it because people like me > liked it so much they bought a physical copy (in 5.1 surround/ 24 bit). > Martin Atkins of Pigface has said that you have to get used to downloads > and > tour more. DJ Spooky (aka Paul Miller) gives links to download sites on his > web site! Maybe he wants more people to listen to him. I'm all for new and innovative ways to do this - but the fact that some will give away their music in the hopes that people will buy more does not mean everyone who ever signed an agreement with a record company to distribute their music agreed that people could get their stuff for free. > > The very rich such Bono whines about his music being sacred. TBH, they > haven't produced anything worth downloading even for free for years. Your opinion. Sales of U2 music in the past few years (both CDs and online) would suggest otherwise. > It is not as simple as stealing or not. Have you never taped a TV show? Is > that stealing too? I think this falls under "fair use" - essentially making a back-up copy, if you are taping a TV show that you can receive. Distributing it would be another matter. My 2 cents... John From cea at CARLAZ.COM Thu Mar 26 08:41:50 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 07:41:50 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 26 Mar 2009, at 07:34, Swartz, John A. wrote: > And how do you want your music produced? 64-bit recordings on Blu- > ray? Sure, why not? :) After all, as the internet gets faster 16-bit CD audio will start to seem small and dinky. :) Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Thu Mar 26 09:19:09 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 06:19:09 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <9AFE2FFA-D785-4B01-B880-EB40EE8CF486@carlaz.com> Message-ID: But a large number of CDs, albums, etc. at used shops are promo copies that the bands are charged for in their advance. ________________________________ From: Carl Edlund Anderson To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 7:28:02 AM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On 25 Mar 2009, at 09:46, gary shindler wrote: > I even try not to buy used copies, the artist doesn't get any pay for that. Well, the artist _did_ get paid when the first person bought it.? :)? Otherwise, with this argument, we may as well say that renting an apartment is immoral because the architect or construction workers aren't getting a continuing cut of the building they designed or built. :) Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 09:20:18 2009 From: smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM (Jonathan Smith) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 21:20:18 +0800 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It's great to have a healthy discussion! As far as I am concerned, buying from *iTunes* is like flushing your money down the toilet. I certainly feel no moral obligation towards Apple or Steve Jobs. Like Microsoft, Apple is very happy to steal other people's ideas. For example, they stole the design for the controls for the iPod from Creative, a small and innovative Singapore company. They happily paid up US$100 million in fines, which you helped them pay.:) I have bought from eMusic. They have a much better value for money system, but they bare shunned by the more greedy artists becuse they don't cxharge enough. MP3 and Apples' files are quite poor quality if you listen to them on a decdent hi-fi system, even burned onto a CD/ DVD. 24-bit DVD Audio and SACD's have been around for ages. Lossless FLAC files are now easy to distribute. Better qualilty Blu-Ray-- yes, please!! I do buy Hawkwind's CDs because I want them to get royalties-- I wish they got 100% of the cost (how they nwould distribute betwen themselves is another issue) and I still like CDs-- although they will be a thing of the past soon. To be honest I am more of an anarchist than a 'good morning device' so I don't really care that much at the of the day. ;) We live in a world governed by violent cleptocracies. More enough cents from me.... 2009/3/26 Swartz, John A. > > I am very willing to buy from a band's web site, or someone like > Atomhenge > > who doing such a good job, but I also feel that I've been ripped off time > > and again by record companies. > > Agree. It is, however, not possible to set up a system by which people are > "willing to buy from" because they don't feel that they are being ripped off > from. People seem to feel that because the record companies have ripped > them off (and I agree that we have been), that they have the right to > download and copy music illegally. > > > > > Worst of all is iTunes, where you don't even get anything physical for > > your > > money, but Apple have made billions from marketing this con. > > > > Hey, I've spent hundreds of dollars from the iTunes music store - all music > that I could have gone to a store and purchased on CD if I wanted to. Apple > didn't put a gun to my head, and I've gotten lots of music that I wanted at > a reasonable price - and as long as I take care of my electronic copies and > back up my files, I'll never need to find those particular songs likely ever > again (unlike when I first had them on vinyl or 8-track, then cassette, then > ANOTHER cassette when the first one wore out, then CD...). > > > > What are you 'stealing' if you download an MP3? You don't get the CD. If > > you buy the CD, you only seem to own the CD itself. If you lose it, you > > have > > to buy it again, so you don't own the music. > > You are "stealing" from the people responsible for creating that music in > the first place - YOU don't have a CD, but at the same time, the artist (and > yes, I know the record companies take a huge share, perhaps ripping off the > artist, but again, I don't think that's a legit argument for stealing music) > doesn't get his due share of the sale of the CD you would have had to > purchase if you didn't download the file. Oh, and I know people will argue > that they never would have bought the CD in the first place - so is it o.k. > to steal an expensive car because you couldn't ever afford it and would > never buy it anyway? > > > > There are many angles to this. Not just is it, or is it not, theft. > Perhaps > > people buy CDs because they have been able to listen to the music first, > > for > > example. There is no guarantee that everything a band produces is worth > > buying-- you don't get refunds. CDs themselves are outmoded technology. > > MP3s > > and Apple's format are poor lossy copies of an out of date 16-bit CD > > format. > > And how do you want your music produced? 64-bit recordings on Blu-ray? > > > > > Some people have a rather more intelligent approach. Take Trent Reznor, > of > > Nine Inch Nails, for example. He has given away an entire album on his > web > > site, The Slip. He still made $1.5 million from it because people like me > > liked it so much they bought a physical copy (in 5.1 surround/ 24 bit). > > Martin Atkins of Pigface has said that you have to get used to downloads > > and > > tour more. DJ Spooky (aka Paul Miller) gives links to download sites on > his > > web site! Maybe he wants more people to listen to him. > > I'm all for new and innovative ways to do this - but the fact that some > will give away their music in the hopes that people will buy more does not > mean everyone who ever signed an agreement with a record company to > distribute their music agreed that people could get their stuff for free. > > > > > The very rich such Bono whines about his music being sacred. TBH, they > > haven't produced anything worth downloading even for free for years. > > Your opinion. Sales of U2 music in the past few years (both CDs and > online) would suggest otherwise. > > > > It is not as simple as stealing or not. Have you never taped a TV show? > Is > > that stealing too? > > I think this falls under "fair use" - essentially making a back-up copy, if > you are taping a TV show that you can receive. Distributing it would be > another matter. > > My 2 cents... > > John > From ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK Thu Mar 26 09:26:18 2009 From: ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Ian Abrahams) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 13:26:18 +0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <629628.56848.qm@web36904.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Which have hopefully previously been used to generate publicity and sell albums. If you haven't got any publicity, you've not got any sales anyway... ________________________________ From: gary shindler To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:19:09 PM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! But a large number of CDs, albums, etc. at used shops are promo copies that the bands are charged for in their advance. ________________________________ From: Carl Edlund Anderson To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 7:28:02 AM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On 25 Mar 2009, at 09:46, gary shindler wrote: > I even try not to buy used copies, the artist doesn't get any pay for that. Well, the artist _did_ get paid when the first person bought it.? :)? Otherwise, with this argument, we may as well say that renting an apartment is immoral because the architect or construction workers aren't getting a continuing cut of the building they designed or built. :) Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK Thu Mar 26 09:27:51 2009 From: ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Ian Abrahams) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 13:27:51 +0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <9AFE2FFA-D785-4B01-B880-EB40EE8CF486@carlaz.com> Message-ID: Books, CDs etc must all be priced to amortise the fact that a percentage will get sold on again. I've heard of artists agains taping but I've never heard of any against secondhand shops. ________________________________ From: Carl Edlund Anderson To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:28:02 PM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On 25 Mar 2009, at 09:46, gary shindler wrote: > I even try not to buy used copies, the artist doesn't get any pay for that. Well, the artist _did_ get paid when the first person bought it.? :)? Otherwise, with this argument, we may as well say that renting an apartment is immoral because the architect or construction workers aren't getting a continuing cut of the building they designed or built. :) Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 09:29:10 2009 From: smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM (Jonathan Smith) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 21:29:10 +0800 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Don't be so sure the CD will have the better audio quality.. I'll up the bitrate of mine & then we'll see! Excellent! I will look forward to hearing better MP3s (or even FLAC?). So that's where the lousy bootlegs from Voiceprint came from-- you can't even steal those so maybe no one bought them :( Obviously there is nothing more from Bob left. JS 2009/3/26 Steve Pond > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 23:58:18 +0800, you sent through the ether: > > >I was wondering about that Calvert gig. Who will get the royalties, then? > >How did Voiceprint get hold of it? > > > The gig was taped on a chrome cassette, the actual cassette belonged > to our ... I have no idea what you'd call him, but he came to every > gig, videoed & photographed every gig & rehearsal, he is now the > mastering engineer that Voiceprint use. > > You don't have to be Sherlock Holmes :o) > > As for royalties, we won't see any. Probably a grand changed hands for > the original tape, and then it's 100% to Voiceprint, maybe they'll > bung some at Jill Calvert as they've put some demo's of Bobs on as > extra tracks, and probably to lure people in who have the gig from the > website. Who knows. > > Don't be so sure the CD will have the better audio quality.. I'll up > the bitrate of mine & then we'll see! > > > -S. > From cea at CARLAZ.COM Thu Mar 26 09:29:47 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 08:29:47 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <629628.56848.qm@web36904.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 26 Mar 2009, at 08:19 , gary shindler wrote: > But a large number of CDs, albums, etc. at used shops are promo > copies that the bands are charged for in their advance. But I expect that the vast _majority_ of used CDs bought and sold are regular commercial products which were first purchased by someone else. Yes, it's doubtless immoral to buy a promo copy -- and more immoral for a DJ to sell it on, but I expect this is not nearly as big an issue as digital piracy. Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU Thu Mar 26 09:32:47 2009 From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU (Paul Mather) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 09:32:47 -0400 Subject: 64-bit audio (was: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism!) In-Reply-To: <70410FC3-2D6B-43F4-8548-18DC8A8EB6EF@carlaz.com> Message-ID: On 26 Mar 2009, at 8:41 AM, Carl Edlund Anderson wrote: > On 26 Mar 2009, at 07:34, Swartz, John A. wrote: >> And how do you want your music produced? 64-bit recordings on Blu- >> ray? > > > Sure, why not? :) After all, as the internet gets faster 16-bit CD > audio will start to seem small and dinky. :) Why wait? I think you should pioneer this format yourself. And here's how: all you need to do is insert random numbers into the lower 32 bits or so of each sample and you'll have something approaching what the real thing would be should it ever arrive. Seriously, though, there is even argument that 24-bit audio runs up against the quantisation limits of A/D hardware: in essence that the lower bits are just random noise and are not giving you any real information because the hardware cannot resolve that sufficiently. I can appreciate going to 32-bits as an editing format, to give numerical headroom when performing signal processing algorithms, but 64-bit would be redundant as a listening format---certainly until the human perceptual system itself undergoes a massive evolution and is able to perceive finer just-noticeable-differences than it currently does. (Humans do not perceive loudness or pitch linearly.) Besides, in the history of digital audio, word length has not been the enemy of fidelity, lossy compression has. Even if you went to 64-bit audio, lossy compression would still be trying to throw away as many of those 64-bit samples as it could. :-) Better for all around if lossless formats became de facto, with lossy used as a temporary format used only for resource-limited portable listening devices or lo- fi previews. Sad to realise it, but as technology has improved audio fidelity has gone down. How bizarre! (It's all down to a triumph of marketing/ convenience, I reckon.) Cheers, Paul. e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." --- Frank Vincent Zappa From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Thu Mar 26 09:33:20 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 06:33:20 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <864593.31185.qm@web26903.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Garth Brooks has (I know there are lots of his fans on the list). ________________________________ From: Ian Abrahams To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 8:27:51 AM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Books, CDs etc must all be priced to amortise the fact that a percentage will get sold on again. I've heard of artists agains taping but I've never heard of any against secondhand shops. ________________________________ From: Carl Edlund Anderson To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:28:02 PM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On 25 Mar 2009, at 09:46, gary shindler wrote: > I even try not to buy used copies, the artist doesn't get any pay for that. Well, the artist _did_ get paid when the first person bought it.? :)? Otherwise, with this argument, we may as well say that renting an apartment is immoral because the architect or construction workers aren't getting a continuing cut of the building they designed or built. :) Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK Thu Mar 26 09:37:09 2009 From: ianabrahams1 at YAHOO.CO.UK (Ian Abrahams) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 13:37:09 +0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <864505.49754.qm@web36902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: OK. Well, when someone tires of his music, or received and didn't like it in the first place, and donates it to Oxfam, I'm sure whoever is straving and looking for Oxfam's help will opt of money generated from selling his stuff secondhand :) Still my point is that new product is sold priced in the knowledge that a percentage will sell on. Ian ________________________________ From: gary shindler To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:33:20 PM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Garth Brooks has (I know there are lots of his fans on the list). ________________________________ From: Ian Abrahams To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 8:27:51 AM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Books, CDs etc must all be priced to amortise the fact that a percentage will get sold on again. I've heard of artists agains taping but I've never heard of any against secondhand shops. ________________________________ From: Carl Edlund Anderson To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:28:02 PM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On 25 Mar 2009, at 09:46, gary shindler wrote: > I even try not to buy used copies, the artist doesn't get any pay for that. Well, the artist _did_ get paid when the first person bought it.? :)? Otherwise, with this argument, we may as well say that renting an apartment is immoral because the architect or construction workers aren't getting a continuing cut of the building they designed or built. :) Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL Thu Mar 26 09:40:43 2009 From: arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL (Arjan Hulsebos) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:40:43 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 26 Mar 2009 08:34:01 -0400, Swartz, John A. wrote > Hey, I've spent hundreds of dollars from the iTunes music store - > all music that I could have gone to a store and purchased on CD if > I wanted to. Apple didn't put a gun to my head, and I've gotten > lots of music that I wanted at a reasonable price - and as long as I > take care of my electronic copies and back up my files, I'll never > need to find those particular songs likely ever again (unlike when I > first had them on vinyl or 8-track, then cassette, then ANOTHER > cassette when the first one wore out, then CD...). Well.....if the stuff is DRMed, then you also depend on the distributer's authentication servers. When they're gone, your electronic copies won't play anymore. You only get to lease music when it's DRMed, you don't own it (as you whould when buying, say, a CD). -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From cea at CARLAZ.COM Thu Mar 26 09:41:46 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 08:41:46 -0500 Subject: 64-bit audio (was: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism!) In-Reply-To: <9369D01D-7832-4652-B69F-1A1328F118A6@gromit.dlib.vt.edu> Message-ID: On 26 Mar 2009, at 08:32, Paul Mather wrote: > Better for all around if lossless formats became de facto, with > lossy used as a temporary format used only for resource-limited > portable listening devices or lo-fi previews. Agreed. Though I also think the real limitation on my audio quality will end up being the quality of my reproduction equipment and, particularly, speakers. High quality audio is easily made and schlepped around the Internet -- but good quality players and speakers and such remain more expensive. At least they are so from where I'm sitting! Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From cea at CARLAZ.COM Thu Mar 26 09:42:51 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 08:42:51 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <864505.49754.qm@web36902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 26 Mar 2009, at 08:33, gary shindler wrote: > Garth Brooks has (I know there are lots of his fans on the list). I guess you could keep people from selling on your CDs second hand by never selling any CDs in the first place. (It's worked for me ;) ;) ;).) Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 10:59:06 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 07:59:06 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: Re: lossy formats I realize it's bordering on a religious issue, but I find that MP3s starting around 192 VBR or 256 CBR I can barely tell the difference (even on the "big stereo") except in extreme boundary cases... Actually I guess the real acid test would be my old Sony MDR V5 headphones - now *those* things are revealing of sonic inadequacies, (Sennheiser fanboys notwithstanding). :) I've been tempted to go in on a set of MDR 7506 which are purportedly the next step up... Steve -----Original Message----- From: Carl Edlund Anderson Date: Thursday, Mar 26, 2009 8:23 am Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET On 25 Mar 2009, at 09:32, Jonathan Smith wrote: Worst of all is iTunes, where you don't even get anything physical for your money, but Apple have made billions from marketing this con. I don't feel like I need anything physical -- the files will do me. However, I _don't_ like iTunes because you pay about as much as a CD for a lossy format. This is uncool. I should pay _less_ than a CD for a lossless file, and unless I can, why the heck am I gonna buy a download. However, I would dearly love to see the opportunity to buy lossless downloads legally as a regular thing. I live in a place without a terribly developed infrastructure, and ordering CDs through the post is not a terribly viable option; if they ever arrived, it would take a very long time and there would be all kinds of extra tariffs and charges tacked on to make the experience irritating and tedious. I'd probably have to go off to some office and sign forms and pay extras -- just to get a remaindered CD that cost less than 10 bucks! My house doesn't even have an official postal address anyway. But it does have perfectly serviceable broadband internet :) and I could download that same CD within a few hours, with any luck .... If only someone would let me! Yes, there will remain issues with pricing and digital copies -- it's no surprise that where I live and throughout the developing world there is such widespread piracy, as the average person here can't possibly afford UK prices -- but for heaven's sake, there is lots of music that I effectively can't buy because physical CDs simply are locally available, but that I _could_ pirate with speed and ease because fast internet access _is_ available. For anyone in the music business -- at least anyone who wants to sell me anything -- there should be something wrong with this picture. Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Thu Mar 26 11:54:10 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 15:54:10 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Steve Swann's message of Thu, 26 Mar 2009 04:54:02 -0700 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Thu Mar 26 11:56:33 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 15:56:33 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Carl Edlund Anderson's message of Thu, 26 Mar 2009 07:28:02 -0500 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Thu Mar 26 12:14:01 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 16:14:01 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Swartz, John A.'s message of Thu, 26 Mar 2009 08:34:01 -0400 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Thu Mar 26 12:15:21 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 16:15:21 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Jonathan Smith's message of Thu, 26 Mar 2009 21:20:18 +0800 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Thu Mar 26 12:46:32 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 16:46:32 +0000 Subject: HW: Gun-slung-it In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 09:25:06AM -0500, Lost Johnny typed out: > None of the bands > ,Spaceritual ,Hawkwind ,Alan Davey ,are exactly drawing "great" crowds live > . They all play small venues with small crowds. A big part of that is the > money problems from the economy ,and especially no major record labels to > fund publicity and promote and pay for tours .But also the fact that in the > UK ,Nik's Spaceritual crowd won't go see Dave's Hawkwind and Dave's Hawkwind > crowd won't go see Nik's Spaceritual . And Dave's Hawkwind fans won't go see > Alan's Gunslinger and Alan's fans won't go Dave's Hawkwind . And that > thinking hurts all three bands big time in ticket and record sales and money > coming in . Come anywhere around Chicago ,and I'll go see all three . This just doesn't match my experience at all. There are a fvew hardliners in the Nik camp who won't go and see Dave, mainly it seems because Nik's gigs are cheaper or because they count themselves as Nik's friends. And there is just a size to Hawkwind gigs, with attendant postering and gig listings for the relevant venues, that mean people come out for them who don't for the smaller bands, perhaps because they just don't know. But mainly I see the same people at HW and SR and when I saw Gunslinger some of them were there too. The opposition is mainly the bands themselves, really. Yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 13:00:27 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 10:00:27 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: The makers of Soundblaster are a small company? You learn something new every day. :) Steve -----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Smith Date: Thursday, Mar 26, 2009 9:23 am Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET It's great to have a healthy discussion! As far as I am concerned, buying from *iTunes* is like flushing your money down the toilet. I certainly feel no moral obligation towards Apple or Steve Jobs. Like Microsoft, Apple is very happy to steal other people's ideas. For example, they stole the design for the controls for the iPod from Creative, a small and innovative Singapore company. They happily paid up US$100 million in fines, which you helped them pay.:) I have bought from eMusic. They have a much better value for money system, but they bare shunned by the more greedy artists becuse they don't cxharge enough. MP3 and Apples' files are quite poor quality if you listen to them on a decdent hi-fi system, even burned onto a CD/ DVD. 24-bit DVD Audio and SACD's have been around for ages. Lossless FLAC files are now easy to distribute. Better qualilty Blu-Ray-- yes, please!! I do buy Hawkwind's CDs because I want them to get royalties-- I wish they got 100% of the cost (how they nwould distribute betwen themselves is another issue) and I still like CDs-- although they will be a thing of the past soon. To be honest I am more of an anarchist than a 'good morning device' so I don't really care that much at the of the day. ;) We live in a world governed by violent cleptocracies. More enough cents from me.... 2009/3/26 Swartz, John A. > > I am very willing to buy from a band's web site, or someone like Atomhenge > who doing such a good job, but I also feel that I've been ripped off time > and again by record companies. > Agree. It is, however, not possible to set up a system by which people are "willing to buy from" because they don't feel that they are being ripped off from. People seem to feel that because the record companies have ripped them off (and I agree that we have been), that they have the right to download and copy music illegally. > > > Worst of all is iTunes, where you don't even get anything physical for > your > money, but Apple have made billions from marketing this con. > > Hey, I've spent hundreds of dollars from the iTunes music store - all music that I could have gone to a store and purchased on CD if I wanted to. Apple didn't put a gun to my head, and I've gotten lots of music that I wanted at a reasonable price - and as long as I take care of my electronic copies and back up my files, I'll never need to find those partic From visionaryhead at DORAMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 14:06:28 2009 From: visionaryhead at DORAMAIL.COM (Visionary Head) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 02:06:28 +0800 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: > Apple have made billions from marketing this con. Totally. 100%. Wrong! -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://mail.doramail.com Powered by Outblaze From asg at MECREANT.ORG Thu Mar 26 16:54:05 2009 From: asg at MECREANT.ORG (Alex S. Garcia) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:54:05 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: Interesting thread and good timing, as there is a lot of talk about a new law here in France to fight against "illegal downloading" (the Hadopi law). Ian wrote: > I don't have any answers, but i do disagree in general with freeloading from professional musicians, it is > fundamentally theft, and should be dealt with appropriately. There is an aspect that most people seem not to realize (or purposefully ignore) which is that 90% of the people who download DO still buy CD's (and go to movies, buy video games, watch TV, etc). These people simply use downloading as a means to discover music they wouldn't be able to know otherwise. It's a selection tool. Just like borrowing a CD from a friend and deciding you like it enough to buy it. So why is the RIAA pissed? Because this of course does not fit their plans of selling just any crap to the public at large. People are becoming more picky and selective. Of course there are also people who just can't afford to buy music. For them downloading is the only way they can listen to the music they like. The artists they listen to thus gain listeners who will most likely buy some of their music in the future (provided their financial situation improves... and that they don't first get sued & bankrupted by their favorite artist or the artist's label!) > However there are some real flaws here, out of print, discontinued, simply unavailable, and rare records, plus live > boots all need to be available, and under strict laws they are illegal. Yep. That is another important issue. Laws as they currently stand tend to place everything in the same bag. > Whilst i'm against people getting fined. The Hadopi law mentioned earlier proposes to give downloaders 3 warnings, after which (if they do not stop) their internet connection would be shut down by their ISP (though they would still have to pay for it!) This is wrong in so many ways... I doubt it will hold though, as many people are stating this would go against human rights (as it would block access to an important source of cultural information). Besides, some folks on the internet have already come up with a way to make the law obsolete (by mixing in fake IP's to the ones of real downloaders, meaning that innocents could just as easily end up getting sued for something they never did!) > I am also against musicians > getting ripped off, they already get that enough > from the record company. Heh, I think the artists are getting more ripped off by the labels then they are by downloading. And if anyone is really getting hurt by the downloading (which I seriously doubt) it would be more the labels themselves for that matter. By the way, one of the many reasons why I doubt that downloading is having such a terrible effect on the industry is because of the comic book scene. All the comic book stores that have been questioned on this matter have stated that sales have actually *increased* since the downloading of comic books started. So I'd be interested in hearing an explanation of why the music & movie industries are supposedly going the other way... I think the comic book stores are just being much more honest about the whole thing ;-) And remember folks, when the VCR first appeared everyone got scared and started worrying about copyright infringements as well. I just hope things get resolved as smoothly... > I play in a band and released the music via our own record label, its not expensive, and we can have it on amazon etc > if we want. I've not gone to see if the music is available on line for download, I don't really care, we are a 2 bit band > that charges ??5 for a CD. We all have fulltime jobs, so we are not dependant on the money collected through sales. > However If I was in a serious band, trying to get up the ladder, or even already up the ladder and each CD sale is > part of my actual salary, I'd be pretty p*ss*d off if any of my=2 0CURRENT IN PRINT albums appeared online for people do > download.. Not me. I'm working on a number of albums myself and really wouldn't care either way. I guess as a writer I just want people to have access to what I do. It is a form of expression after all. Sure, earning a living from it would be pretty cool (and yes, it is the ultimate goal) but I'm pretty sure that can be achieved regardless of downloads (I really doubt U2 or Metallica will ever be poor because of people downloading their music!) I really am not worried about this. >> Hey Al, have you heard of the approach that the UK is taking (or maybe >> has taken?) to make music downloading llegal, and pay for though some >> kind of network tax or surcharge, which is then to be divided among the >> music industry? Sort of like what they did in the US with cassette >> tapes? > > They did that in the Netherlands, too, and they're still doing that with > CD-Rs, and undoubtably DVD-Rs. In France too! And that's another thing that pisses me off. If we are paying a tax for blank CD's & DVD's then why the heck are the authorities bugging us about downloads?!? That's what those taxes are supposed to be for! Of course, they're not being too vocal about it... they'd rather we forgot about the tax, heh! M. Holmes: > There's an interesting debate all in itself. If you record a TV show to > watch later, it's "timeshift recording" and is quite legal. If you forget > to delete it after having watched it though, it now becomes illegal. Now this is very interesting. It seems to imply though that you can keep it as long as you want so long as you haven't watched it yet... In which case, how do you prove whether you've watched something on your computer yet or not? :-o > It was technology which gifted the entertainment industries with vast > riches through mass-production and now technology is taking it all away. > Crying "Unfair!" and trying to prosecute the buyers into bankruptcy isn't > going to change the end result one iota. In fact it's more likely to > speed up the endgame through people becoming sickened at such antics. Oh definitely. And it's already started. I've heard of several cases of folks who were sued by labels and vowed to never again buy anything from those specific labels. Great customer service! Heh. Alex. From cea at CARLAZ.COM Thu Mar 26 20:33:30 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 19:33:30 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <50923.86.76.231.227.1238100845.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> Message-ID: On 26 Mar 2009, at 15:54, Alex S. Garcia wrote: > Interesting thread and good timing, as there is a lot of talk about > a new > law here in France to fight against "illegal downloading" (the Hadopi > law). Can I have a law that forces the music industry to give me a halfway decent _legal_ downloading option? :) Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 20:47:25 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 00:47:25 -0000 Subject: HW: Gun-slung-it In-Reply-To: <20090326164632.GH23242@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Message-ID: But everyone comes to see Trev and Kev (aka Trev and Fatso) Big venues Packed audiences Brilliant musicianship Humour Sex appeal Lots of drink No rehearsals Trev and Kev MySpace http://www.myspace.com/trevandkev Judge Trev MySpace http://www.myspace.com/judgetrev Inner City Unit Myspace http://www.myspace.com/nikturnerinnercityunit Judge Trev: http://www.judgetrev.com AND THE BEAST WAS CAST ALIVE IN THE LAKE OF BURNING FIRE AND THE REST OF THEM WERE SLAIN BY THE ONE UPON THE WHITE HORSE AND HIS EYES WERE AS A FLAME OF FIRE HE WAS CROWNED WITH MANY CROWNS AND IN RIGHTEOUSNESS HE JUDGES AND IN RIGHTEOUSNESS HE WAGES WAR REAL FESTIVAL MUSIC - RFM http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk Festival CD's, Festival Photo Reviews, Festival Listings, Video Downloads, News, Healers -------------------------------------------------- From: "Jonathan Jarrett" Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 4:46 PM To: Subject: Re: HW: Gun-slung-it > On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 09:25:06AM -0500, Lost Johnny typed out: >> None of the >> bands >> ,Spaceritual ,Hawkwind ,Alan Davey ,are exactly drawing "great" crowds >> live >> . They all play small venues with small crowds. A big part of that is >> the >> money problems from the economy ,and especially no major record labels to >> fund publicity and promote and pay for tours .But also the fact that in >> the >> UK ,Nik's Spaceritual crowd won't go see Dave's Hawkwind and Dave's >> Hawkwind >> crowd won't go see Nik's Spaceritual . And Dave's Hawkwind fans won't go >> see >> Alan's Gunslinger and Alan's fans won't go Dave's Hawkwind . And that >> thinking hurts all three bands big time in ticket and record sales and >> money >> coming in . Come anywhere around Chicago ,and I'll go see all three . > > This just doesn't match my experience at all. There are a fvew > hardliners in the Nik camp who won't go and see Dave, mainly it seems > because Nik's gigs are cheaper or because they count themselves as Nik's > friends. And there is just a size to Hawkwind gigs, with attendant > postering and gig listings for the relevant venues, that mean people > come out for them who don't for the smaller bands, perhaps because they > just don't know. But mainly I see the same people at HW and SR and when > I saw Gunslinger some of them were there too. The opposition is mainly > the bands themselves, really. Yours, > Jon > > -- > "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" > (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) > Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk > From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 21:08:25 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 01:08:25 -0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <50923.86.76.231.227.1238100845.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> Message-ID: Ok, I've read the threads The internet was "free" Festivals were "free" The days of freedom are gone As soon as the people come up with something original and good, and that is accessible, the big boys take it over and make their huge disproportionate fortunes out of it. This trend has increased as commercial and government control has increased it's grip on the populace. The gap between the rich and the poor is now greater than any time in history. Big Brother is here...who hasn't read 1984, Brave New World etc. Listen to the predictive lyrics of the 60's and 70's The golden age is over. WITHOUT THE SHEDDING OF BLOOD THERE WILL BE NO REMISSION! I have been involved in putting on over 100 emergent bands on in groovy Brighton over the past 4 years. Some are brilliant...much better than the middle of the road trash that the corrupt record company's promote. They will not be given record deals because their originality means that there is a commercial risk in signing them. They burn out in despair, learning that their hopes of playing music full-time are impossible. Ha Ha, lets dance! Judge Trev -------------------------------------------------- From: "Carl Edlund Anderson" Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 12:33 AM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > On 26 Mar 2009, at 15:54, Alex S. Garcia wrote: >> Interesting thread and good timing, as there is a lot of talk about a >> new >> law here in France to fight against "illegal downloading" (the Hadopi >> law). > > > Can I have a law that forces the music industry to give me a halfway > decent _legal_ downloading option? :) > > Cheers, > Carl > > -- > Carl Edlund Anderson > http://www.carlaz.com/ > From albert at CELLSUM.COM Thu Mar 26 21:51:57 2009 From: albert at CELLSUM.COM (Albert Bouchard) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 21:51:57 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <50923.86.76.231.227.1238100845.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> Message-ID: I wonder where you get that 90% figure. In my experience most people who download music download songs that are already popular. Otherwise the RIAA wouldn't have a leg to stand on. They do not use downloading as a way to "discover" new acts. They have internet radio to do that and much of it is quite good IMHO. I think that most people who download obscure acts do it because said acts, while being quite excellent in musical and other ways, have gotten discouraged and broken up by the time the true music enthusiast has actually discovered them. An ironic shame really. Am I upset because people download my mixes of Imaginos? No, because they would not be available otherwise. Maybe the folks at Sony would because they own the masters but it's already been paid for by me and the other guys in BOC so it should really be no skin off their noses. But the RIAA is standing up for people who've invested a lot of time and money into their craft and don't feel it's right for their work to be distributed for free. That's the bottom line, if you created it then you should have a say in what people should have to do to get it. Lots of artists give their music away for free and even more don't mind if people download it. There's plenty of music that is available for free. Why should people need to steal it? Isn't this obvious? I am sorry but much of the many arguments presented here just sound like rationalization. Is it really stealing? We're just getting our share from greedy people. It's a technology issue. Apple stole the iPod from Creative (who stole their drawing pad from wacom). Everybody lies, everybody steals. But it still comes down to that same bottom line. If we sanction stealing are we not becoming morally bankrupt? Al On Mar 26, 2009, at 4:54 PM, Alex S. Garcia wrote: > Interesting thread and good timing, as there is a lot of talk about > a new > law here in France to fight against "illegal downloading" (the Hadopi > law). > > Ian wrote: > >> I don't have any answers, but i do disagree in general with >> freeloading > from professional musicians, it is >> fundamentally theft, and should be dealt with appropriately. > > There is an aspect that most people seem not to realize (or > purposefully > ignore) which is that 90% of the people who download DO still buy CD's > (and go to movies, buy video games, watch TV, etc). These people > simply > use downloading as a means to discover music they wouldn't be able > to know > otherwise. It's a selection tool. Just like borrowing a CD from a > friend > and deciding you like it enough to buy it. So why is the RIAA pissed? > Because this of course does not fit their plans of selling just any > crap > to the public at large. People are becoming more picky and selective. > > Of course there are also people who just can't afford to buy music. > For > them downloading is the only way they can listen to the music they > like. > The artists they listen to thus gain listeners who will most likely > buy > some of their music in the future (provided their financial situation > improves... and that they don't first get sued & bankrupted by their > favorite artist or the artist's label!) > >> However there are some real flaws here, out of print, discontinued, > simply unavailable, and rare records, plus live >> boots all need to be available, and under strict laws they are >> illegal. > > Yep. That is another important issue. Laws as they currently stand > tend to > place everything in the same bag. > >> Whilst i'm against people getting fined. > > The Hadopi law mentioned earlier proposes to give downloaders 3 > warnings, > after which (if they do not stop) their internet connection would be > shut > down by their ISP (though they would still have to pay for it!) This > is > wrong in so many ways... I doubt it will hold though, as many people > are > stating this would go against human rights (as it would block access > to an > important source of cultural information). Besides, some folks on the > internet have already come up with a way to make the law obsolete (by > mixing in fake IP's to the ones of real downloaders, meaning that > innocents could just as easily end up getting sued for something they > never did!) > >> I am also against musicians >> getting ripped off, they already get that enough >> from the record company. > > Heh, I think the artists are getting more ripped off by the labels > then > they are by downloading. And if anyone is really getting hurt by the > downloading (which I seriously doubt) it would be more the labels > themselves for that matter. > > By the way, one of the many reasons why I doubt that downloading is > having > such a terrible effect on the industry is because of the comic book > scene. > All the comic book stores that have been questioned on this matter > have > stated that sales have actually *increased* since the downloading of > comic > books started. So I'd be interested in hearing an explanation of why > the > music & movie industries are supposedly going the other way... I > think the > comic book stores are just being much more honest about the whole > thing > ;-) > > And remember folks, when the VCR first appeared everyone got scared > and > started worrying about copyright infringements as well. I just hope > things > get resolved as smoothly... > >> I play in a band and released the music via our own record label, its > not expensive, and we can have it on amazon etc >> if we want. I've not gone to see if the music is available on line >> for > download, I don't really care, we are a 2 bit band >> that charges ??5 for a CD. We all have fulltime jobs, so we are not > dependant on the money collected through sales. >> However If I was in a serious band, trying to get up the ladder, or >> even > already up the ladder and each CD sale is >> part of my actual salary, I'd be pretty p*ss*d off if any of my=2 > 0CURRENT IN PRINT albums appeared online for people do >> download.. > > Not me. I'm working on a number of albums myself and really wouldn't > care > either way. I guess as a writer I just want people to have access to > what > I do. It is a form of expression after all. Sure, earning a living > from it > would be pretty cool (and yes, it is the ultimate goal) but I'm pretty > sure that can be achieved regardless of downloads (I really doubt U2 > or > Metallica will ever be poor because of people downloading their > music!) I > really am not worried about this. > >>> Hey Al, have you heard of the approach that the UK is taking (or >>> maybe >>> has taken?) to make music downloading llegal, and pay for though >>> some >>> kind of network tax or surcharge, which is then to be divided >>> among the >>> music industry? Sort of like what they did in the US with cassette >>> tapes? >> >> They did that in the Netherlands, too, and they're still doing that >> with >> CD-Rs, and undoubtably DVD-Rs. > > In France too! And that's another thing that pisses me off. If we are > paying a tax for blank CD's & DVD's then why the heck are the > authorities > bugging us about downloads?!? That's what those taxes are supposed > to be > for! Of course, they're not being too vocal about it... they'd > rather we > forgot about the tax, heh! > > M. Holmes: > >> There's an interesting debate all in itself. If you record a TV >> show to >> watch later, it's "timeshift recording" and is quite legal. If you >> forget >> to delete it after having watched it though, it now becomes illegal. > > Now this is very interesting. It seems to imply though that you can > keep > it as long as you want so long as you haven't watched it yet... In > which > case, how do you prove whether you've watched something on your > computer > yet or not? :-o > >> It was technology which gifted the entertainment industries with vast >> riches through mass-production and now technology is taking it all >> away. >> Crying "Unfair!" and trying to prosecute the buyers into bankruptcy >> isn't >> going to change the end result one iota. In fact it's more likely to >> speed up the endgame through people becoming sickened at such antics. > > Oh definitely. And it's already started. I've heard of several cases > of > folks who were sued by labels and vowed to never again buy anything > from > those specific labels. Great customer service! Heh. > > > > Alex. > From smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 22:03:07 2009 From: smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM (Jonathan Smith) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 10:03:07 +0800 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <266D5639-208E-451A-9E2C-3E15AB1CE448@cellsum.com> Message-ID: So we are are all equally 'morally bankrupt'? :) 2009/3/27 Albert Bouchard > I wonder where you get that 90% figure. In my experience most people who > download music download songs that are already popular. Otherwise the RIAA > wouldn't have a leg to stand on. They do not use downloading as a way to > "discover" new acts. They have internet radio to do that and much of it is > quite good IMHO. I think that most people who download obscure acts do it > because said acts, while being quite excellent in musical and other ways, > have gotten discouraged and broken up by the time the true music enthusiast > has actually discovered them. An ironic shame really. > > Am I upset because people download my mixes of Imaginos? No, because they > would not be available otherwise. Maybe the folks at Sony would because they > own the masters but it's already been paid for by me and the other guys in > BOC so it should really be no skin off their noses. But the RIAA is standing > up for people who've invested a lot of time and money into their craft and > don't feel it's right for their work to be distributed for free. That's the > bottom line, if you created it then you should have a say in what people > should have to do to get it. Lots of artists give their music away for free > and even more don't mind if people download it. There's plenty of music that > is available for free. Why should people need to steal it? Isn't this > obvious? > > I am sorry but much of the many arguments presented here just sound like > rationalization. Is it really stealing? We're just getting our share from > greedy people. It's a technology issue. Apple stole the iPod from Creative > (who stole their drawing pad from wacom). Everybody lies, everybody steals. > But it still comes down to that same bottom line. If we sanction stealing > are we not becoming morally bankrupt? > Al > > > On Mar 26, 2009, at 4:54 PM, Alex S. Garcia wrote: > > Interesting thread and good timing, as there is a lot of talk about a new >> law here in France to fight against "illegal downloading" (the Hadopi >> law). >> >> Ian wrote: >> >> I don't have any answers, but i do disagree in general with freeloading >>> >> from professional musicians, it is >> >>> fundamentally theft, and should be dealt with appropriately. >>> >> >> There is an aspect that most people seem not to realize (or purposefully >> ignore) which is that 90% of the people who download DO still buy CD's >> (and go to movies, buy video games, watch TV, etc). These people simply >> use downloading as a means to discover music they wouldn't be able to know >> otherwise. It's a selection tool. Just like borrowing a CD from a friend >> and deciding you like it enough to buy it. So why is the RIAA pissed? >> Because this of course does not fit their plans of selling just any crap >> to the public at large. People are becoming more picky and selective. >> >> Of course there are also people who just can't afford to buy music. For >> them downloading is the only way they can listen to the music they like. >> The artists they listen to thus gain listeners who will most likely buy >> some of their music in the future (provided their financial situation >> improves... and that they don't first get sued & bankrupted by their >> favorite artist or the artist's label!) >> >> However there are some real flaws here, out of print, discontinued, >>> >> simply unavailable, and rare records, plus live >> >>> boots all need to be available, and under strict laws they are illegal. >>> >> >> Yep. That is another important issue. Laws as they currently stand tend to >> place everything in the same bag. >> >> Whilst i'm against people getting fined. >>> >> >> The Hadopi law mentioned earlier proposes to give downloaders 3 warnings, >> after which (if they do not stop) their internet connection would be shut >> down by their ISP (though they would still have to pay for it!) This is >> wrong in so many ways... I doubt it will hold though, as many people are >> stating this would go against human rights (as it would block access to an >> important source of cultural information). Besides, some folks on the >> internet have already come up with a way to make the law obsolete (by >> mixing in fake IP's to the ones of real downloaders, meaning that >> innocents could just as easily end up getting sued for something they >> never did!) >> >> I am also against musicians >>> getting ripped off, they already get that enough >>> from the record company. >>> >> >> Heh, I think the artists are getting more ripped off by the labels then >> they are by downloading. And if anyone is really getting hurt by the >> downloading (which I seriously doubt) it would be more the labels >> themselves for that matter. >> >> By the way, one of the many reasons why I doubt that downloading is having >> such a terrible effect on the industry is because of the comic book scene. >> All the comic book stores that have been questioned on this matter have >> stated that sales have actually *increased* since the downloading of comic >> books started. So I'd be interested in hearing an explanation of why the >> music & movie industries are supposedly going the other way... I think the >> comic book stores are just being much more honest about the whole thing >> ;-) >> >> And remember folks, when the VCR first appeared everyone got scared and >> started worrying about copyright infringements as well. I just hope things >> get resolved as smoothly... >> >> I play in a band and released the music via our own record label, its >>> >> not expensive, and we can have it on amazon etc >> >>> if we want. I've not gone to see if the music is available on line for >>> >> download, I don't really care, we are a 2 bit band >> >>> that charges ??5 for a CD. We all have fulltime jobs, so we are not >>> >> dependant on the money collected through sales. >> >>> However If I was in a serious band, trying to get up the ladder, or even >>> >> already up the ladder and each CD sale is >> >>> part of my actual salary, I'd be pretty p*ss*d off if any of my=2 >>> >> 0CURRENT IN PRINT albums appeared online for people do >> >>> download.. >>> >> >> Not me. I'm working on a number of albums myself and really wouldn't care >> either way. I guess as a writer I just want people to have access to what >> I do. It is a form of expression after all. Sure, earning a living from it >> would be pretty cool (and yes, it is the ultimate goal) but I'm pretty >> sure that can be achieved regardless of downloads (I really doubt U2 or >> Metallica will ever be poor because of people downloading their music!) I >> really am not worried about this. >> >> Hey Al, have you heard of the approach that the UK is taking (or maybe >>>> has taken?) to make music downloading llegal, and pay for though some >>>> kind of network tax or surcharge, which is then to be divided among the >>>> music industry? Sort of like what they did in the US with cassette >>>> tapes? >>>> >>> >>> They did that in the Netherlands, too, and they're still doing that with >>> CD-Rs, and undoubtably DVD-Rs. >>> >> >> In France too! And that's another thing that pisses me off. If we are >> paying a tax for blank CD's & DVD's then why the heck are the authorities >> bugging us about downloads?!? That's what those taxes are supposed to be >> for! Of course, they're not being too vocal about it... they'd rather we >> forgot about the tax, heh! >> >> M. Holmes: >> >> There's an interesting debate all in itself. If you record a TV show to >>> watch later, it's "timeshift recording" and is quite legal. If you forget >>> to delete it after having watched it though, it now becomes illegal. >>> >> >> Now this is very interesting. It seems to imply though that you can keep >> it as long as you want so long as you haven't watched it yet... In which >> case, how do you prove whether you've watched something on your computer >> yet or not? :-o >> >> It was technology which gifted the entertainment industries with vast >>> riches through mass-production and now technology is taking it all away. >>> Crying "Unfair!" and trying to prosecute the buyers into bankruptcy isn't >>> going to change the end result one iota. In fact it's more likely to >>> speed up the endgame through people becoming sickened at such antics. >>> >> >> Oh definitely. And it's already started. I've heard of several cases of >> folks who were sued by labels and vowed to never again buy anything from >> those specific labels. Great customer service! Heh. >> >> >> >> Alex. >> >> From albert at CELLSUM.COM Thu Mar 26 22:12:12 2009 From: albert at CELLSUM.COM (Albert Bouchard) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 22:12:12 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <39dabad60903261903r32b2bcbn7b74520eb671b919@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: sanction is the crucial word there. On Mar 26, 2009, at 10:03 PM, Jonathan Smith wrote: > So we are are all equally 'morally bankrupt'? :) > > 2009/3/27 Albert Bouchard > >> I wonder where you get that 90% figure. In my experience most >> people who >> download music download songs that are already popular. Otherwise >> the RIAA >> wouldn't have a leg to stand on. They do not use downloading as a >> way to >> "discover" new acts. They have internet radio to do that and much >> of it is >> quite good IMHO. I think that most people who download obscure acts >> do it >> because said acts, while being quite excellent in musical and other >> ways, >> have gotten discouraged and broken up by the time the true music >> enthusiast >> has actually discovered them. An ironic shame really. >> >> Am I upset because people download my mixes of Imaginos? No, >> because they >> would not be available otherwise. Maybe the folks at Sony would >> because they >> own the masters but it's already been paid for by me and the other >> guys in >> BOC so it should really be no skin off their noses. But the RIAA is >> standing >> up for people who've invested a lot of time and money into their >> craft and >> don't feel it's right for their work to be distributed for free. >> That's the >> bottom line, if you created it then you should have a say in what >> people >> should have to do to get it. Lots of artists give their music away >> for free >> and even more don't mind if people download it. There's plenty of >> music that >> is available for free. Why should people need to steal it? Isn't this >> obvious? >> >> I am sorry but much of the many arguments presented here just sound >> like >> rationalization. Is it really stealing? We're just getting our >> share from >> greedy people. It's a technology issue. Apple stole the iPod from >> Creative >> (who stole their drawing pad from wacom). Everybody lies, everybody >> steals. >> But it still comes down to that same bottom line. If we sanction >> stealing >> are we not becoming morally bankrupt? >> Al >> >> >> On Mar 26, 2009, at 4:54 PM, Alex S. Garcia wrote: >> >> Interesting thread and good timing, as there is a lot of talk about >> a new >>> law here in France to fight against "illegal downloading" (the >>> Hadopi >>> law). >>> >>> Ian wrote: >>> >>> I don't have any answers, but i do disagree in general with >>> freeloading >>>> >>> from professional musicians, it is >>> >>>> fundamentally theft, and should be dealt with appropriately. >>>> >>> >>> There is an aspect that most people seem not to realize (or >>> purposefully >>> ignore) which is that 90% of the people who download DO still buy >>> CD's >>> (and go to movies, buy video games, watch TV, etc). These people >>> simply >>> use downloading as a means to discover music they wouldn't be able >>> to know >>> otherwise. It's a selection tool. Just like borrowing a CD from a >>> friend >>> and deciding you like it enough to buy it. So why is the RIAA >>> pissed? >>> Because this of course does not fit their plans of selling just >>> any crap >>> to the public at large. People are becoming more picky and >>> selective. >>> >>> Of course there are also people who just can't afford to buy >>> music. For >>> them downloading is the only way they can listen to the music they >>> like. >>> The artists they listen to thus gain listeners who will most >>> likely buy >>> some of their music in the future (provided their financial >>> situation >>> improves... and that they don't first get sued & bankrupted by their >>> favorite artist or the artist's label!) >>> >>> However there are some real flaws here, out of print, discontinued, >>>> >>> simply unavailable, and rare records, plus live >>> >>>> boots all need to be available, and under strict laws they are >>>> illegal. >>>> >>> >>> Yep. That is another important issue. Laws as they currently stand >>> tend to >>> place everything in the same bag. >>> >>> Whilst i'm against people getting fined. >>>> >>> >>> The Hadopi law mentioned earlier proposes to give downloaders 3 >>> warnings, >>> after which (if they do not stop) their internet connection would >>> be shut >>> down by their ISP (though they would still have to pay for it!) >>> This is >>> wrong in so many ways... I doubt it will hold though, as many >>> people are >>> stating this would go against human rights (as it would block >>> access to an >>> important source of cultural information). Besides, some folks on >>> the >>> internet have already come up with a way to make the law obsolete >>> (by >>> mixing in fake IP's to the ones of real downloaders, meaning that >>> innocents could just as easily end up getting sued for something >>> they >>> never did!) >>> >>> I am also against musicians >>>> getting ripped off, they already get that enough >>>> from the record company. >>>> >>> >>> Heh, I think the artists are getting more ripped off by the labels >>> then >>> they are by downloading. And if anyone is really getting hurt by the >>> downloading (which I seriously doubt) it would be more the labels >>> themselves for that matter. >>> >>> By the way, one of the many reasons why I doubt that downloading >>> is having >>> such a terrible effect on the industry is because of the comic >>> book scene. >>> All the comic book stores that have been questioned on this matter >>> have >>> stated that sales have actually *increased* since the downloading >>> of comic >>> books started. So I'd be interested in hearing an explanation of >>> why the >>> music & movie industries are supposedly going the other way... I >>> think the >>> comic book stores are just being much more honest about the whole >>> thing >>> ;-) >>> >>> And remember folks, when the VCR first appeared everyone got >>> scared and >>> started worrying about copyright infringements as well. I just >>> hope things >>> get resolved as smoothly... >>> >>> I play in a band and released the music via our own record label, >>> its >>>> >>> not expensive, and we can have it on amazon etc >>> >>>> if we want. I've not gone to see if the music is available on >>>> line for >>>> >>> download, I don't really care, we are a 2 bit band >>> >>>> that charges ??5 for a CD. We all have fulltime jobs, so we are not >>>> >>> dependant on the money collected through sales. >>> >>>> However If I was in a serious band, trying to get up the ladder, >>>> or even >>>> >>> already up the ladder and each CD sale is >>> >>>> part of my actual salary, I'd be pretty p*ss*d off if any of my=2 >>>> >>> 0CURRENT IN PRINT albums appeared online for people do >>> >>>> download.. >>>> >>> >>> Not me. I'm working on a number of albums myself and really >>> wouldn't care >>> either way. I guess as a writer I just want people to have access >>> to what >>> I do. It is a form of expression after all. Sure, earning a living >>> from it >>> would be pretty cool (and yes, it is the ultimate goal) but I'm >>> pretty >>> sure that can be achieved regardless of downloads (I really doubt >>> U2 or >>> Metallica will ever be poor because of people downloading their >>> music!) I >>> really am not worried about this. >>> >>> Hey Al, have you heard of the approach that the UK is taking (or >>> maybe >>>>> has taken?) to make music downloading llegal, and pay for though >>>>> some >>>>> kind of network tax or surcharge, which is then to be divided >>>>> among the >>>>> music industry? Sort of like what they did in the US with >>>>> cassette >>>>> tapes? >>>>> >>>> >>>> They did that in the Netherlands, too, and they're still doing >>>> that with >>>> CD-Rs, and undoubtably DVD-Rs. >>>> >>> >>> In France too! And that's another thing that pisses me off. If we >>> are >>> paying a tax for blank CD's & DVD's then why the heck are the >>> authorities >>> bugging us about downloads?!? That's what those taxes are supposed >>> to be >>> for! Of course, they're not being too vocal about it... they'd >>> rather we >>> forgot about the tax, heh! >>> >>> M. Holmes: >>> >>> There's an interesting debate all in itself. If you record a TV >>> show to >>>> watch later, it's "timeshift recording" and is quite legal. If >>>> you forget >>>> to delete it after having watched it though, it now becomes >>>> illegal. >>>> >>> >>> Now this is very interesting. It seems to imply though that you >>> can keep >>> it as long as you want so long as you haven't watched it yet... In >>> which >>> case, how do you prove whether you've watched something on your >>> computer >>> yet or not? :-o >>> >>> It was technology which gifted the entertainment industries with >>> vast >>>> riches through mass-production and now technology is taking it >>>> all away. >>>> Crying "Unfair!" and trying to prosecute the buyers into >>>> bankruptcy isn't >>>> going to change the end result one iota. In fact it's more likely >>>> to >>>> speed up the endgame through people becoming sickened at such >>>> antics. >>>> >>> >>> Oh definitely. And it's already started. I've heard of several >>> cases of >>> folks who were sued by labels and vowed to never again buy >>> anything from >>> those specific labels. Great customer service! Heh. >>> >>> >>> >>> Alex. >>> >>> > From smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM Thu Mar 26 22:48:50 2009 From: smithjm77x7 at GMAIL.COM (Jonathan Smith) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 10:48:50 +0800 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The fact that we are getting tangled up in semantics like this shows how unclear the whole issue is. 2009/3/27 Albert Bouchard > sanction is the crucial word there. > > > On Mar 26, 2009, at 10:03 PM, Jonathan Smith wrote: > > So we are are all equally 'morally bankrupt'? :) >> >> 2009/3/27 Albert Bouchard >> >> I wonder where you get that 90% figure. In my experience most people who >>> download music download songs that are already popular. Otherwise the >>> RIAA >>> wouldn't have a leg to stand on. They do not use downloading as a way to >>> "discover" new acts. They have internet radio to do that and much of it >>> is >>> quite good IMHO. I think that most people who download obscure acts do it >>> because said acts, while being quite excellent in musical and other ways, >>> have gotten discouraged and broken up by the time the true music >>> enthusiast >>> has actually discovered them. An ironic shame really. >>> >>> Am I upset because people download my mixes of Imaginos? No, because they >>> would not be available otherwise. Maybe the folks at Sony would because >>> they >>> own the masters but it's already been paid for by me and the other guys >>> in >>> BOC so it should really be no skin off their noses. But the RIAA is >>> standing >>> up for people who've invested a lot of time and money into their craft >>> and >>> don't feel it's right for their work to be distributed for free. That's >>> the >>> bottom line, if you created it then you should have a say in what people >>> should have to do to get it. Lots of artists give their music away for >>> free >>> and even more don't mind if people download it. There's plenty of music >>> that >>> is available for free. Why should people need to steal it? Isn't this >>> obvious? >>> >>> I am sorry but much of the many arguments presented here just sound like >>> rationalization. Is it really stealing? We're just getting our share from >>> greedy people. It's a technology issue. Apple stole the iPod from >>> Creative >>> (who stole their drawing pad from wacom). Everybody lies, everybody >>> steals. >>> But it still comes down to that same bottom line. If we sanction stealing >>> are we not becoming morally bankrupt? >>> Al >>> >>> >>> On Mar 26, 2009, at 4:54 PM, Alex S. Garcia wrote: >>> >>> Interesting thread and good timing, as there is a lot of talk about a new >>> >>>> law here in France to fight against "illegal downloading" (the Hadopi >>>> law). >>>> >>>> Ian wrote: >>>> >>>> I don't have any answers, but i do disagree in general with freeloading >>>> >>>>> >>>>> from professional musicians, it is >>>> >>>> fundamentally theft, and should be dealt with appropriately. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> There is an aspect that most people seem not to realize (or purposefully >>>> ignore) which is that 90% of the people who download DO still buy CD's >>>> (and go to movies, buy video games, watch TV, etc). These people simply >>>> use downloading as a means to discover music they wouldn't be able to >>>> know >>>> otherwise. It's a selection tool. Just like borrowing a CD from a friend >>>> and deciding you like it enough to buy it. So why is the RIAA pissed? >>>> Because this of course does not fit their plans of selling just any crap >>>> to the public at large. People are becoming more picky and selective. >>>> >>>> Of course there are also people who just can't afford to buy music. For >>>> them downloading is the only way they can listen to the music they like. >>>> The artists they listen to thus gain listeners who will most likely buy >>>> some of their music in the future (provided their financial situation >>>> improves... and that they don't first get sued & bankrupted by their >>>> favorite artist or the artist's label!) >>>> >>>> However there are some real flaws here, out of print, discontinued, >>>> >>>>> >>>>> simply unavailable, and rare records, plus live >>>> >>>> boots all need to be available, and under strict laws they are illegal. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Yep. That is another important issue. Laws as they currently stand tend >>>> to >>>> place everything in the same bag. >>>> >>>> Whilst i'm against people getting fined. >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> The Hadopi law mentioned earlier proposes to give downloaders 3 >>>> warnings, >>>> after which (if they do not stop) their internet connection would be >>>> shut >>>> down by their ISP (though they would still have to pay for it!) This is >>>> wrong in so many ways... I doubt it will hold though, as many people are >>>> stating this would go against human rights (as it would block access to >>>> an >>>> important source of cultural information). Besides, some folks on the >>>> internet have already come up with a way to make the law obsolete (by >>>> mixing in fake IP's to the ones of real downloaders, meaning that >>>> innocents could just as easily end up getting sued for something they >>>> never did!) >>>> >>>> I am also against musicians >>>> >>>>> getting ripped off, they already get that enough >>>>> from the record company. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Heh, I think the artists are getting more ripped off by the labels then >>>> they are by downloading. And if anyone is really getting hurt by the >>>> downloading (which I seriously doubt) it would be more the labels >>>> themselves for that matter. >>>> >>>> By the way, one of the many reasons why I doubt that downloading is >>>> having >>>> such a terrible effect on the industry is because of the comic book >>>> scene. >>>> All the comic book stores that have been questioned on this matter have >>>> stated that sales have actually *increased* since the downloading of >>>> comic >>>> books started. So I'd be interested in hearing an explanation of why the >>>> music & movie industries are supposedly going the other way... I think >>>> the >>>> comic book stores are just being much more honest about the whole thing >>>> ;-) >>>> >>>> And remember folks, when the VCR first appeared everyone got scared and >>>> started worrying about copyright infringements as well. I just hope >>>> things >>>> get resolved as smoothly... >>>> >>>> I play in a band and released the music via our own record label, its >>>> >>>>> >>>>> not expensive, and we can have it on amazon etc >>>> >>>> if we want. I've not gone to see if the music is available on line for >>>>> >>>>> download, I don't really care, we are a 2 bit band >>>> >>>> that charges ??5 for a CD. We all have fulltime jobs, so we are not >>>>> >>>>> dependant on the money collected through sales. >>>> >>>> However If I was in a serious band, trying to get up the ladder, or >>>>> even >>>>> >>>>> already up the ladder and each CD sale is >>>> >>>> part of my actual salary, I'd be pretty p*ss*d off if any of my=2 >>>>> >>>>> 0CURRENT IN PRINT albums appeared online for people do >>>> >>>> download.. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Not me. I'm working on a number of albums myself and really wouldn't >>>> care >>>> either way. I guess as a writer I just want people to have access to >>>> what >>>> I do. It is a form of expression after all. Sure, earning a living from >>>> it >>>> would be pretty cool (and yes, it is the ultimate goal) but I'm pretty >>>> sure that can be achieved regardless of downloads (I really doubt U2 or >>>> Metallica will ever be poor because of people downloading their music!) >>>> I >>>> really am not worried about this. >>>> >>>> Hey Al, have you heard of the approach that the UK is taking (or maybe >>>> >>>>> has taken?) to make music downloading llegal, and pay for though some >>>>>> kind of network tax or surcharge, which is then to be divided among >>>>>> the >>>>>> music industry? Sort of like what they did in the US with cassette >>>>>> tapes? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> They did that in the Netherlands, too, and they're still doing that >>>>> with >>>>> CD-Rs, and undoubtably DVD-Rs. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> In France too! And that's another thing that pisses me off. If we are >>>> paying a tax for blank CD's & DVD's then why the heck are the >>>> authorities >>>> bugging us about downloads?!? That's what those taxes are supposed to be >>>> for! Of course, they're not being too vocal about it... they'd rather we >>>> forgot about the tax, heh! >>>> >>>> M. Holmes: >>>> >>>> There's an interesting debate all in itself. If you record a TV show to >>>> >>>>> watch later, it's "timeshift recording" and is quite legal. If you >>>>> forget >>>>> to delete it after having watched it though, it now becomes illegal. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Now this is very interesting. It seems to imply though that you can keep >>>> it as long as you want so long as you haven't watched it yet... In which >>>> case, how do you prove whether you've watched something on your computer >>>> yet or not? :-o >>>> >>>> It was technology which gifted the entertainment industries with vast >>>> >>>>> riches through mass-production and now technology is taking it all >>>>> away. >>>>> Crying "Unfair!" and trying to prosecute the buyers into bankruptcy >>>>> isn't >>>>> going to change the end result one iota. In fact it's more likely to >>>>> speed up the endgame through people becoming sickened at such antics. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Oh definitely. And it's already started. I've heard of several cases of >>>> folks who were sued by labels and vowed to never again buy anything from >>>> those specific labels. Great customer service! Heh. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Alex. >>>> >>>> >>>> >> From shll at HAGEDORN.DK Fri Mar 27 03:16:05 2009 From: shll at HAGEDORN.DK (SHLL (Scott Heller)) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 08:16:05 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: This is a tough subject. Now that I run my own band I can see this in a slightly different light. What we have been doing is giving away high quality MP3 versions of all our jam sessions for free on our web site. We also have all our live concerts recorded and put up on the internet at www.archive.org for free. We do not have any of the tracks from our CDs on our main web site and hope to encourage people to buy our cds and sonn vinyl records! We do put tracks from our cds on myspace, but I think myspace has not lead to a lot of new fans for us. Fans that buy our music. As for illegal downloading, it is something we have to live with as our music lives in a digital world. If you release stuff only on cassette and vinyl, you will have a lot less problems with this as it is more effort for some one to digitize your stuff and put it up. It will of course happen. Our new CD came out last week in Feb and just a week ago, there was already a site : www.omega-music.com (I think) and they had the whole thing up for free download... What can you do??? Our record label tries to write to these people but if they don't want to do anything, little can be done from a small label. Lucky we do not have to live off music. I am just happy that we can get the whole thing to more or less go around and we can still afford to put out 1-2 cds a year... As long as we release music in a digital format, we will live with the problem of people getting our work for free. Scott www.oresundspacecollective.com www.myspace.com/oresundspacecollective From asg at MECREANT.ORG Fri Mar 27 05:07:23 2009 From: asg at MECREANT.ORG (Alex S. Garcia) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 03:07:23 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <266D5639-208E-451A-9E2C-3E15AB1CE448@cellsum.com> Message-ID: > I wonder where you get that 90% figure. Quite simply from personal experience. And I'm not talking about interviews or surveys where people could easily make things up but real conversations that were not necessarily about downloading but where the topic would pop up. It is a trend that I've noticed over and over again. And I will give more credit to these raw and sincere conversations any day over the statements of greedy labels. Yet another proof of the RIAA's hypocrisy: when they first started blaming downloaders for the decrease in CD sales they carefully avoided mentioning DVD's. None of the charts that were released at the time would take DVD sales into account. And yet those were steadily increasing. So. Wouldn't it make sense for CD sales to go down, then? DVD's were still fairly new at the time. If you're gonna start buying lots of those it makes sense that you'd have less money to spend on CD's, no? > In my experience most people > who download music download songs that are already popular. People download all sorts of things. I think you'd be surprised by some of the very specialized places out there ;-) But yes, the most popular stuff gets more downloaded, just like it gets sold more in the stores. But, again, from experience I can tell you people are getting more and more disenchanted with the popular stuff. In fact, I've noticed a shift in what is considered popular. Of course, you could see it as just a new trend, but still, I find it interesting. Of course your basic teenybop crap is still popular and likely will always be :-o but rock seems to have made a serious 'comeback'. We shall see what the future holds... > Otherwise > the RIAA wouldn't have a leg to stand on. Honestly, I don't think they do! What they do have is a lot of excuses, with tons of time and money to waste. Time and money that would be better spent paying the artists better and trying to find a REAL solution to the downloading issue. Someone suggested an annual fee. I love that idea. Of course they would still find ways to screw over the artists, but I guess that will never change :-( > They do not use downloading > as a way to "discover" new acts. They have internet radio to do that > and much of it is quite good IMHO. When it works :-) Internet radios can be a good alternative, that's true. However the quality is not always very good. Besides, hearing one song on a radio is not always enough. I've bought albums sometimes after hearing one song I really loved... and then ended up disappointed by the rest. I'm sure this has happened to most of us at least once. So it doesn't really, totally resolve the issue. > I think that most people who > download obscure acts do it because said acts, while being quite > excellent in musical and other ways, have gotten discouraged and > broken up by the time the true music enthusiast has actually > discovered them. An ironic shame really. I'm curious about something... Do professional musicians get regular mails from the RIAA or somesuch, anything keeping you "informed" about what they are doing and how downloading is affecting sales, etc. The reason I'm asking is that what you wrote above Al sounds to me so pessimistic and borderline depressing. Do you really believe this? There likely are some acts of this type, though if they are that obscure chances are they weren't selling CD's to begin with, downloading or not. Heck there were acts like that even before downloading started. So to blame the downloaders for their gruesome deaths would be a bit exaggerated ;-) If anything, downloading is helping many of those obscure bands of today by getting their music out, better spread, and acquiring them fans who would never otherwise have been able to know they even existed, let alone buy their music. > There's plenty of music that is available > for free. Why should people need to steal it? Isn't this obvious? I think the whole problem comes from the fact that the RIAA/labels/artists (some anyway) consider downloading as stealing. Whereas downloaders don't. Personally when/if I download something I don't think to myself 'oh what am I going to steal today'. It will more likely be something like 'hmm, I've heard that one song that sounds really cool, I wonder what the rest of the album sounds like'. Note that if I had a friend who owned the album I would borrow it from him. If not I'll download it. What's the difference? If I like it enough I'm still gonna go buy it anyway. If I borrow a CD, the artist doesn't get paid either. Is that stealing too? Heck, even copying a borrowed CD is not seen as stealing. Alex. From arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL Fri Mar 27 07:06:43 2009 From: arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL (Arjan Hulsebos) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 12:06:43 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <51361.86.76.231.227.1238144843.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 03:07:23 -0600, Alex S. Garcia wrote > I think the whole problem comes from the fact that the RIAA/labels/artists > (some anyway) consider downloading as stealing. Whereas downloaders don't. The problem is that the music industry (or the entertainment industry for that matter) is just that: an industry. They take raw material (i.e. the creativity of artists), and make a product out of it (CDs, DVDs, games, etc.) which they can sell for a profit. As they're a business, making profit is their main focus, and they'll do just about anything to protect their interests. > If I borrow a CD, the artist doesn't get paid either. Is that > stealing too? Heck, even copying a borrowed CD is not seen as stealing. When you borrow a CD, the guy or gal you borrowed it from, can't play it, so there's no lost revenue there. If you were to copy that borrowed CD, there is lost revenue. The music industry considers that to be stealing. I haven't looked at this carefully, but I think that borrowing a CD, and inviting someone over to listen to a CD, are considered to be copyright infringements by the music industry. Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From albert at CELLSUM.COM Fri Mar 27 07:29:26 2009 From: albert at CELLSUM.COM (Albert Bouchard) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 07:29:26 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <51361.86.76.231.227.1238144843.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> Message-ID: Alex: The RIAA is a music industry group. They do not deal with movies or things that come on dvd. I am a public high school teacher. I deal with teenagers every day. 0% of my students own a CD player. Very few ever go to live concerts. Most download music illegally. Is it still a mystery why I'm standing on this soapbox? The RIAA works for the record companies. They do not send letters to individual artists. An argument could be made that illegal downloading is helping maintain the popularity of music but I seriously doubt that if ISPs restricted access to illegal downloading, that the music would be less popular. Maybe some of these more obscure artists would be encouraged to stay together if they got some money for their efforts. I also think that if every artist was part time that the quality of the music would suffer. Maybe it already has. If you borrow a CD from someone, assuming that CD wasn't stolen, that someone paid for the right to listen to that CD and share it with their friends. The difference in downloading situation is just a matter of scale. Take yourself out of the argument for a second. Think about the billions of people who don't own CD players and want their music. How are all the people who've worked hard to create that music to get paid? I actually think that iTunes of something of that sort is the future. it's simple enough to sample some music for free on iTunes. I do, however, think they should be lowering their price not raising it. I know this might be out of the imagination of most people but what we have to get used to is that intellectual property is real. Just because it doesn't take up a lot of physical space doesn't meant that it is worthless. The air is free but if we take it for granted we could end up very sick and sorry. Al From asg at MECREANT.ORG Fri Mar 27 07:56:43 2009 From: asg at MECREANT.ORG (Alex S. Garcia) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 05:56:43 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <20090327104720.M95152@dehulst.nl> Message-ID: > If you were to copy that borrowed CD, there is > lost revenue. The music industry considers that to be stealing. Okay. But I've never heard of anyone getting sued (even less convicted) for copying a CD (or vinyl/tape in the old days). Most convictions I've heard of tended to concern folks who had SOLD copied material. Which I think makes a lot more sense. > I haven't looked at this carefully, but I think that borrowing a CD, and > inviting someone over to listen to a CD, are considered to be copyright > infringements by the music industry. I wouldn't be surprised if they did :-o Would they have a case in court, though, that's an entirely different issue. Alex. From arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL Fri Mar 27 08:29:04 2009 From: arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL (Arjan Hulsebos) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:29:04 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <5FF6DF45-831D-463A-AB08-180DEB58BA5A@cellsum.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 07:29:26 -0400, Albert Bouchard wrote > I actually think that iTunes of > something of that sort is the future. it's simple enough to sample > some music for free on iTunes. I do, however, think they should be > lowering their price not raising it. I think so, too, but just look at who's developing these kind of new distribution systems. Not the major record labels, not the RIAA. They're the ones that have been kicking and screaming, trying to stop any kind of development in this direction. If the music industry had been initiating, or at least supporting, these kind of developments, illegal downloading (which is _not_ illegal in the Netherlands, BTW), wouldn't be as a big problem as it is today. They more or less created their own problem. > I know this might be out of the imagination of most people but what > we have to get used to is that intellectual property is real. Just > because it doesn't take up a lot of physical space doesn't meant > that it is worthless. The air is free but if we take it for granted > we could end up very sick and sorry. Al True, but imposing ridiculously high fines for downloading is not going to solve the problem, just like the Sharia won't stop theft. Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL Fri Mar 27 08:33:41 2009 From: arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL (Arjan Hulsebos) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:33:41 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <52506.86.76.231.227.1238155003.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 05:56:43 -0600, Alex S. Garcia wrote > > If you were to copy that borrowed CD, there is > > lost revenue. The music industry considers that to be stealing. > > Okay. But I've never heard of anyone getting sued (even less > convicted) for copying a CD (or vinyl/tape in the old days). Most > convictions I've heard of tended to concern folks who had SOLD > copied material. Which I think makes a lot more sense. I'm sure that if the music industry could get a hold of the traffic information from the ISPs, they'd sue everyone who'd been downloading. > > I haven't looked at this carefully, but I think that borrowing a CD, and > > inviting someone over to listen to a CD, are considered to be copyright > > infringements by the music industry. > > I wouldn't be surprised if they did :-o Would they have a case in > court, though, that's an entirely different issue. Well, an employer was fined a couple of weeks ago because he allowed his employees to listen to their iPods at work... Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From cea at CARLAZ.COM Fri Mar 27 08:51:44 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 07:51:44 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <5FF6DF45-831D-463A-AB08-180DEB58BA5A@cellsum.com> Message-ID: On 27 Mar 2009, at 06:29, Albert Bouchard wrote: > Think about the billions of people who don't own CD players and > want their music. How are all the people who've worked hard to > create that music to get paid? I actually think that iTunes of > something of that sort is the future. it's simple enough to sample > some music for free on iTunes. I do, however, think they should be > lowering their price not raising it. I think I tend to agree with Al -- though, firstly, we don't have to wonder whether people are becoming morally bankrupt; we already _know_ people are morally bankrupt. Sure, there's an element in us that wants to "do the right thing", but we have all done plenty of things that we knew were wrong, that were a bad idea, that were illegal, etc. Usually we've done those things because, for whatever other reasons we might have had, it seemed _easy_. I think this is one of the keys to downloading music, either legally or illegally. People want music (evidently). And people want getting that music to be easy. When it became easier to listen to music on CD than on cassette or vinyl, people rushed to buy CDs. When it became easier to download stuff than buy CDs, people started doing it. The iTMS, whatever one thinks of it, proves that there is a market for selling downloads -- however, it's clearly not easy enough yet. But I think if one convinces people that it is "easier" (and that's a concept that includes formats, and bit rates, and price points, and everything) to buy the music than steal it, then people will buy it. What the music industry has failed to do is implement that easiness. So everyone in the music industry has a right to be upset that people are downloading pirated music. However, I think its a waste of time to try to halt downloading per se. That ship has sailed. That battle is over. It's a lost cause to try to force people into using some delivery model that they don't want, since they will just find a new way to get what they want. Napster got shut down, but bittorrent distribution arose; shut that down, and something else will come along. No, the only hope for the music industry in terms of sales of recorded music -- for suits and artists alike (though, perhaps, particularly suits) -- is to find a way to get people to pay for downloadable music that isn't such pain in the ass as it currently is. It needs to be cheaper and easier if it's going to compete. That's just a reality, and though everyone keeps repeating that truth, the music industry seems to remain a long way from doing something about it. I _should_ be able to buy CD-quality (at least) downloads of anything I want, whenever I want, from wherever I want; the technology exists and my desire to access it exists. It just hasn't been offered to me. (And even for iTMS, with its expensive lossy files, I'm not in a country that iTMS supports anyway!) I will never cease to find it bizarre how much time the music industry wrings its hands about piracy in contrast to how little time they spend trying to offer a functional alternative. %/ Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From cea at CARLAZ.COM Fri Mar 27 09:04:08 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 08:04:08 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <266D5639-208E-451A-9E2C-3E15AB1CE448@cellsum.com> Message-ID: On 26 Mar 2009, at 20:51, Albert Bouchard wrote: > Am I upset because people download my mixes of Imaginos? No, > because they would not be available otherwise. I freely confess that I stole that off the Internet myself! I wanted to hear it and there, it was, and wasn't anyone to buy it from legally. Had Sony or whoever coughed up that stuff as bonus tracks or boxed set stuff or whatever, would I have bought it? Of course! Gods know I've bought piles of stuff from bands I love just to get weird rarities. Would I have bought it even faster had Sony or whoever offered me CD-quality downloads at digital-delivery prices? Absolutely. And had Albert bootlegged it himself and sold it to me from under his overcoat on a street corner would I have bought it from him. Sure. After all: I'm a fan, I want to hear the music, and if someone will sell it to me legitimately, then I'll get it legitimately. If I can't get it legitimately, though, then I'll get it some other way, if I can. My morals rapidly bankrupt themselves when the thing is available _only_ in a less than legitimate way. I think if the music industry meets the demand that surely exists with a legitimate supply, the people will go down that road. But they will have to build a better mousetrap before the world is going to beat a path back to their door. Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Fri Mar 27 09:05:56 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:05:56 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Alex S. Garcia's message of Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:54:05 -0600 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Fri Mar 27 09:08:33 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:08:33 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 01:08:25 -0000 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Fri Mar 27 09:23:12 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:23:12 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Carl Edlund Anderson's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 07:51:44 -0500 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK Fri Mar 27 10:27:45 2009 From: Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK (Steve Pond) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:27:45 +0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <5FF6DF45-831D-463A-AB08-180DEB58BA5A@cellsum.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 07:29:26 -0400, you sent through the ether: >Very few >ever go to live concerts. Most download music illegally. Is it still a >mystery why I'm standing on this soapbox? I think we're missing the big picture here, which is people do the easiest thing. Pre-Internet the easiest way to listen to music of your choice was to buy a record. 2nd choice was to tape it off a friend, third choice was to tape it from the radio. The benefit of option 1) was that the quality was higher, but people still went for the easiest option. Nobody wanted to pay, but they had no choice so they did. Now we can get a generation 1 copy for free on the Internet because it's the easiest option, why buy it from itunes? the free option involves the same amount of mouse clicks, but it's free. All that needs to happen is we make the easiest way to obtain music, the way that gets people paid.. And the only way I can think of is a "media licence" much like we in the UK pay a TV licence, so when you "release" some music you register it with the licensing body they then give you your slice of the pie, as time goes on that could be based on downloads, or maybe media players "phone home" & say what's being played the most... or most likely the Internet will be so prevalent there will be no need to download, you just "play" on demand, and thus know the true play stats and the licence fee can be carved up accurately. Complicated old world innit! -S. From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Fri Mar 27 10:38:38 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 10:38:38 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Carl, well thought out response. I hope you're well. Your friend, Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Carl Edlund Anderson Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 9:04 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On 26 Mar 2009, at 20:51, Albert Bouchard wrote: > Am I upset because people download my mixes of Imaginos? No, > because they would not be available otherwise. I freely confess that I stole that off the Internet myself! I wanted to hear it and there, it was, and wasn't anyone to buy it from legally. Had Sony or whoever coughed up that stuff as bonus tracks or boxed set stuff or whatever, would I have bought it? Of course! Gods know I've bought piles of stuff from bands I love just to get weird rarities. Would I have bought it even faster had Sony or whoever offered me CD-quality downloads at digital-delivery prices? Absolutely. And had Albert bootlegged it himself and sold it to me from under his overcoat on a street corner would I have bought it from him. Sure. After all: I'm a fan, I want to hear the music, and if someone will sell it to me legitimately, then I'll get it legitimately. If I can't get it legitimately, though, then I'll get it some other way, if I can. My morals rapidly bankrupt themselves when the thing is available _only_ in a less than legitimate way. I think if the music industry meets the demand that surely exists with a legitimate supply, the people will go down that road. But they will have to build a better mousetrap before the world is going to beat a path back to their door. Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Fri Mar 27 10:46:55 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 07:46:55 -0700 Subject: Imaginos demos Message-ID: Doubt Albert gets anything from this but I found this when googling Imaginos demos. ? http://www.saturnrecords.com/cgi-bin/saturn/search.html From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Fri Mar 27 11:32:44 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 15:32:44 -0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <126A561607A76D4B90A6B67641C593E922C9808DFD@exdkmbx005.corp.novocorp.net> Message-ID: "it is something we have to live with as our music lives in a digital world" yes , the way to go seems to be to make some of your music downloadable on your website, but sell it on cd's (unless you can sell downloadable mp3's from your website...a big job...i'm looking into it) no one will buy your music just because it's on cd baby or any of the other download sites because there are thousands of other bands doing the same thing. 70% of people find your music and buy it by making an internet search of your band name or song name, so it's really best to do it all from your own site as long as your site is properly set up as far as keywords and search engine friendliness is concerned. myspace etc is just an extremely well thought out website with all the tricks in the book and is designed to remove power from the individual and pass that power on to the"big boys" who make a fortune out of it. people buy cd's because the music or name has been imprinted into their hearts and minds. the best way is for them to see you live (if you're good), the other way is to be influenced by the media (only signed bands can do this), or by personal word of mouth. in the good old days, the chances of making music a full-time occupation was one in a thousand...now it's one in a million. don't give up the day job lol judge trev ps buy my stuff... i'm one of the few old-timers who still lives off it...even if you do it out of pity lol (do i have your hearts...and minds?) REAL FESTIVAL MUSIC - RFM http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk Festival CD's, Festival Photo Reviews, Festival Listings, Video Downloads, News, Healers -------------------------------------------------- From: "SHLL (Scott Heller)" Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 7:16 AM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > This is a tough subject. Now that I run my own band I can see this in a > slightly different light. What we have been doing is giving away high > quality MP3 versions of all our jam sessions for free on our web site. We > also have all our live concerts recorded and put up on the internet at > www.archive.org for free. We do not have any of the tracks from our CDs on > our main web site and hope to encourage people to buy our cds and sonn > vinyl records! We do put tracks from our cds on myspace, but I think > myspace has not lead to a lot of new fans for us. Fans that buy our music. > > As for illegal downloading, it is something we have to live with as our > music lives in a digital world. If you release stuff only on cassette and > vinyl, you will have a lot less problems with this as it is more effort > for some one to digitize your stuff and put it up. It will of course > happen. > > Our new CD came out last week in Feb and just a week ago, there was > already a site : www.omega-music.com (I think) and they had the whole > thing up for free download... What can you do??? > > Our record label tries to write to these people but if they don't want to > do anything, little can be done from a small label. > > Lucky we do not have to live off music. I am just happy that we can get > the whole thing to more or less go around and we can still afford to put > out 1-2 cds a year... > > As long as we release music in a digital format, we will live with the > problem of people getting our work for free. > > Scott > > www.oresundspacecollective.com > www.myspace.com/oresundspacecollective From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Fri Mar 27 11:35:28 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 15:35:28 -0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <50923.86.76.231.227.1238100845.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> <266D5639-208E-451A-9E2C-3E15AB1CE448@cellsum.com> <51361.86.76.231.227.1238144843.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> <5FF6DF45-831D-463A-AB08-180DEB58BA5A@cellsum.com> Message-ID: hear hear...good insight, al trev -------------------------------------------------- From: "Albert Bouchard" Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 11:29 AM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > Alex: > The RIAA is a music industry group. They do not deal with movies or > things that come on dvd. I am a public high school teacher. I deal > with teenagers every day. 0% of my students own a CD player. Very few > ever go to live concerts. Most download music illegally. Is it still a > mystery why I'm standing on this soapbox? The RIAA works for the > record companies. They do not send letters to individual artists. > > An argument could be made that illegal downloading is helping maintain > the popularity of music but I seriously doubt that if ISPs restricted > access to illegal downloading, that the music would be less popular. > Maybe some of these more obscure artists would be encouraged to stay > together if they got some money for their efforts. I also think that > if every artist was part time that the quality of the music would > suffer. Maybe it already has. > > If you borrow a CD from someone, assuming that CD wasn't stolen, that > someone paid for the right to listen to that CD and share it with > their friends. The difference in downloading situation is just a > matter of scale. Take yourself out of the argument for a second. Think > about the billions of people who don't own CD players and want their > music. How are all the people who've worked hard to create that music > to get paid? I actually think that iTunes of something of that sort is > the future. it's simple enough to sample some music for free on > iTunes. I do, however, think they should be lowering their price not > raising it. > > I know this might be out of the imagination of most people but what we > have to get used to is that intellectual property is real. Just > because it doesn't take up a lot of physical space doesn't meant that > it is worthless. The air is free but if we take it for granted we > could end up very sick and sorry. > Al > From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Fri Mar 27 11:44:08 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 15:44:08 -0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903271308.n2RD8XXD023620@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: "In fact very few have made fortunes out of the music industry since the 70's" how much do the directors/owners of sony, emi, etc make? you are wrong It always grows during credit bubbles and it will shrink with the bust. study your social history holmes, the wealth gap between rich and poor IS greater than anytime in history, whether it shrinks or grows over short periods or not you are wrong judge trev -------------------------------------------------- From: "M Holmes" Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 1:08 PM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > trev writes: > >> As soon as the people come up with something original and good, and that >> is >> accessible, the big boys take it over and make their huge >> disproportionate >> fortunes out of it. > > In fact very few have made fortunes out of the music industry since the > 70's. > >> The gap between the rich and the poor is now greater than any time in >> history. > > It always grows during credit bubbles and it will shrink with the bust. > > FoFP > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Fri Mar 27 12:00:04 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 16:00:04 -0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <50923.86.76.231.227.1238100845.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> <266D5639-208E-451A-9E2C-3E15AB1CE448@cellsum.com> <51361.86.76.231.227.1238144843.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> <5FF6DF45-831D-463A-AB08-180DEB58BA5A@cellsum.com> Message-ID: good idea, why don't you run prs? in fact live performance copyright royalties use this system you tell prs where you have played over the past year you tell them the songs on your set-list they pay a royalty divided between the songwriters trouble is, unless you are big and play in big venues all the time, the royalty to be divided between the set list songwriters is ?5 so if you have personally written 50% (rare in most bands) of all your live material, you will have to do 20 gigs to make ?50 (how much will your petrol bill be?) judge trev -------------------------------------------------- From: "Steve Pond" Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 2:27 PM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 07:29:26 -0400, you sent through the ether: > >>Very few >>ever go to live concerts. Most download music illegally. Is it still a >>mystery why I'm standing on this soapbox? > > > I think we're missing the big picture here, which is people do the > easiest thing. > > Pre-Internet the easiest way to listen to music of your choice was to > buy a record. 2nd choice was to tape it off a friend, third choice was > to tape it from the radio. > > The benefit of option 1) was that the quality was higher, but people > still went for the easiest option. Nobody wanted to pay, but they had > no choice so they did. > > Now we can get a generation 1 copy for free on the Internet because > it's the easiest option, why buy it from itunes? the free option > involves the same amount of mouse clicks, but it's free. > > All that needs to happen is we make the easiest way to obtain music, > the way that gets people paid.. > > And the only way I can think of is a "media licence" much like we in > the UK pay a TV licence, so when you "release" some music you register > it with the licensing body they then give you your slice of the pie, > as time goes on that could be based on downloads, or maybe media > players "phone home" & say what's being played the most... or most > likely the Internet will be so prevalent there will be no need to > download, you just "play" on demand, and thus know the true play stats > and the licence fee can be carved up accurately. > > Complicated old world innit! > > -S. > > From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Fri Mar 27 12:22:38 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 16:22:38 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Steve Pond's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:27:45 +0000 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Fri Mar 27 12:29:54 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 16:29:54 GMT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 15:44:08 -0000 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Fri Mar 27 13:39:44 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:39:44 -0400 Subject: Perfect pitch? (better edited, sorry), Message-ID: Hi friends, I get very frustrated when I listen to music with someone and they can tell the chords automatically. I have a relatively good sense of pitch, and a little grounding in theory, I can pick an A note out of the air on key. Do you think perfect pitch is innate, or can be learned. I have 2 blind friends, and 1 is totally convinced that if I don't have it, I never will. Another, says it can be learned. Of course, I'm inclined to believe the latter. If I'm told that I can't do something, my Irish blood comes through and I'll do whatever I can to prove otherwise. I'd be very interested in what all you fine musicians, and other listeners like me, have to say on this. Many thanks, Mary From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Fri Mar 27 13:49:47 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:49:47 -0400 Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), Message-ID: Hi friends, I get very frustrated when I listen to music with someone and they can tell the chords automatically. I have a relatively good sense of pitch, and a little grounding in theory, I can pick an A note out of the air on key. Do you think perfect pitch is innate, or can be learned. I have 2 blind friends, and 1 is totally convinced that if I don't have it, I never will. Another, says it can be learned. Of course, I'm inclined to believe the latter. If I'm told that I can't do something, my Irish blood comes through and I'll do whatever I can to prove otherwise. I'd be very interested in what all you fine musicians, and other listeners like me, have to say. Many thanks, Mary From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Fri Mar 27 13:59:52 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:59:52 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hey Trev, Great job, well said, and inspiring (I hope), to all the other musicians, out there. I hope all's well with you. Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of trev Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 11:33 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! "it is something we have to live with as our music lives in a digital world" yes , the way to go seems to be to make some of your music downloadable on your website, but sell it on cd's (unless you can sell downloadable mp3's from your website...a big job...i'm looking into it) no one will buy your music just because it's on cd baby or any of the other download sites because there are thousands of other bands doing the same thing. 70% of people find your music and buy it by making an internet search of your band name or song name, so it's really best to do it all from your own site as long as your site is properly set up as far as keywords and search engine friendliness is concerned. myspace etc is just an extremely well thought out website with all the tricks in the book and is designed to remove power from the individual and pass that power on to the"big boys" who make a fortune out of it. people buy cd's because the music or name has been imprinted into their hearts and minds. the best way is for them to see you live (if you're good), the other way is to be influenced by the media (only signed bands can do this), or by personal word of mouth. in the good old days, the chances of making music a full-time occupation was one in a thousand...now it's one in a million. don't give up the day job lol judge trev ps buy my stuff... i'm one of the few old-timers who still lives off it...even if you do it out of pity lol (do i have your hearts...and minds?) REAL FESTIVAL MUSIC - RFM http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk Festival CD's, Festival Photo Reviews, Festival Listings, Video Downloads, News, Healers -------------------------------------------------- From: "SHLL (Scott Heller)" Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 7:16 AM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > This is a tough subject. Now that I run my own band I can see this in a > slightly different light. What we have been doing is giving away high > quality MP3 versions of all our jam sessions for free on our web site. We > also have all our live concerts recorded and put up on the internet at > www.archive.org for free. We do not have any of the tracks from our CDs on > our main web site and hope to encourage people to buy our cds and sonn > vinyl records! We do put tracks from our cds on myspace, but I think > myspace has not lead to a lot of new fans for us. Fans that buy our music. > > As for illegal downloading, it is something we have to live with as our > music lives in a digital world. If you release stuff only on cassette and > vinyl, you will have a lot less problems with this as it is more effort > for some one to digitize your stuff and put it up. It will of course > happen. > > Our new CD came out last week in Feb and just a week ago, there was > already a site : www.omega-music.com (I think) and they had the whole > thing up for free download... What can you do??? > > Our record label tries to write to these people but if they don't want to > do anything, little can be done from a small label. > > Lucky we do not have to live off music. I am just happy that we can get > the whole thing to more or less go around and we can still afford to put > out 1-2 cds a year... > > As long as we release music in a digital format, we will live with the > problem of people getting our work for free. > > Scott > > www.oresundspacecollective.com > www.myspace.com/oresundspacecollective From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Fri Mar 27 14:16:37 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903271629.n2RGTspO013306@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: c minus...gobbledegook a. your answer is badly presented b. you don't understand rhetoric c. you haven't lived in africa like wot i have d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? e. i'm afraid you'll have to spend another year in the 6th form... lol lets end this flaming now trev -------------------------------------------------- From: "M Holmes" Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 4:29 PM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > trev writes: > >> "In fact very few have made fortunes out of the music industry since the >> 70's" > >> how much do the directors/owners of sony, emi, etc make? > > How many directors do they have? What proportion do they represent as a > total of the population in the music business? > >> It always grows during credit bubbles and it will shrink with the bust. > >> study your social history holmes, the wealth gap between rich and poor IS >> greater than anytime in history > > We've also just passed the peak of the largest credit bubble in history. > I don't think that's a coincidence. > >> whether it shrinks or grows over short >> periods or not >> >> you are wrong > > The US has a GINI coefficient over 40 just now. Would you rather be poor > there or in some benighted dictatorship in Africa with a lower GINI > coefficient? > > For most folks, it's about what they do have, not how much worse off they > are than the nearest billionaire. Relative poverty hurts existentially. > Absolute poverty hurts in the guts. > > FoFP > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > From StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Fri Mar 27 14:23:49 2009 From: StevePXR5 at AOL.COM (StevePXR5 at AOL.COM) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:23:49 EDT Subject: HW: Gun-slung-it Message-ID: In a message dated 26/03/2009 16:47:34 GMT Standard Time, jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK writes: This just doesn't match my experience at all. There are a fvew hardliners in the Nik camp who won't go and see Dave, mainly it seems because Nik's gigs are cheaper or because they count themselves as Nik's friends. And there is just a size to Hawkwind gigs, with attendant postering and gig listings for the relevant venues, that mean people come out for them who don't for the smaller bands, perhaps because they just don't know. But mainly I see the same people at HW and SR and when I saw Gunslinger some of them were there too. The opposition is mainly the bands themselves, really. Yours, Well I'll be at the Gunslinger gig at the Rigger tonight. Steve. From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Fri Mar 27 15:10:31 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 15:10:31 -0400 Subject: HW: Gun-slung-it In-Reply-To: Message-ID: You guys really don't know how good you have it over there with so many cool bands within such small radius. In order to catch a Nektar show I have to go 4 hours, so I'm going to travel an extra 2, and catch 2 shows, thanks to friends from this forum who're letting me stay at there place. I'd have to choose between food and shows, if I lived over there. It seems you've got so many concerts going on. What I go through for a show! The Last time Nik played Boston, I just happened to hear about it that day. I wasn't on the net at the time, and my brother saw something in the Globe with Nik's picture and he called me. I freaked, and, of course made it. Since I don't have an IPOD I'll have to bring a lot of batteries and discs, ak! Ah well, if I could travel for 3 days home from LA what's 6 hours, right? -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 2:24 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: HW: Gun-slung-it In a message dated 26/03/2009 16:47:34 GMT Standard Time, jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK writes: This just doesn't match my experience at all. There are a fvew hardliners in the Nik camp who won't go and see Dave, mainly it seems because Nik's gigs are cheaper or because they count themselves as Nik's friends. And there is just a size to Hawkwind gigs, with attendant postering and gig listings for the relevant venues, that mean people come out for them who don't for the smaller bands, perhaps because they just don't know. But mainly I see the same people at HW and SR and when I saw Gunslinger some of them were there too. The opposition is mainly the bands themselves, really. Yours, Well I'll be at the Gunslinger gig at the Rigger tonight. Steve. From arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL Fri Mar 27 15:16:06 2009 From: arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL (Arjan Hulsebos) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 20:16:06 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000, trev wrote > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? I was asking that, myself. > lets end this flaming now Aw, Trev, if you call this flaming, you ain't seen nothing yet. Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Fri Mar 27 15:38:21 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 12:38:21 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <20090327191116.M82002@dehulst.nl> Message-ID: The Gini coefficient is a measure of statistical dispersion most prominently used as a measure of inequality of income distribution or inequality of wealth distribution. It is defined as a ratio with values between 0 and 1: the numerator is the area between the Lorenz curve of the distribution and the uniform distribution line; the denominator is the area under the uniform distribution line. ________________________________ From: Arjan Hulsebos To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 2:16:06 PM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000, trev wrote > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? I was asking that, myself. > lets end this flaming now Aw, Trev, if you call this flaming, you ain't seen nothing yet. Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: ? substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Fri Mar 27 15:40:45 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 15:40:45 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <20090327191116.M82002@dehulst.nl> Message-ID: This is all very interesting, and fun. Kaduflyer -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Arjan Hulsebos Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 3:16 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000, trev wrote > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? I was asking that, myself. > lets end this flaming now Aw, Trev, if you call this flaming, you ain't seen nothing yet. Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Fri Mar 27 15:50:49 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 15:50:49 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <844521.2162.qm@web36904.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Gary, I took statistics but never really got the hang of it. Of course, it was a requirement for psychology. I'd never have gone for that otherwise. too much for me, and it was too terms. AK! I tried. Kaduflyer -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of gary shindler Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 3:38 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! The Gini coefficient is a measure of statistical dispersion most prominently used as a measure of inequality of income distribution or inequality of wealth distribution. It is defined as a ratio with values between 0 and 1: the numerator is the area between the Lorenz curve of the distribution and the uniform distribution line; the denominator is the area under the uniform distribution line. ________________________________ From: Arjan Hulsebos To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 2:16:06 PM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000, trev wrote > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? I was asking that, myself. > lets end this flaming now Aw, Trev, if you call this flaming, you ain't seen nothing yet. Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: ? substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Fri Mar 27 16:14:14 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:14:14 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: __ Yahoo has links to certain topics, I take no?credit. ? ________________________________ From: mary To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 2:50:49 PM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Hi Gary, I took statistics but never really got the hang of it.? Of course, it was a requirement for psychology.? I'd never have gone for that otherwise.? too much for me, and it was too terms. AK! I tried. Kaduflyer -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of gary shindler Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 3:38 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! The Gini coefficient is a measure of statistical dispersion most prominently used as a measure of inequality of income distribution or inequality of wealth distribution. It is defined as a ratio with values between 0 and 1: the numerator is the area between the Lorenz curve of the distribution and the uniform distribution line; the denominator is the area under the uniform distribution line. ________________________________ From: Arjan Hulsebos To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 2:16:06 PM Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000, trev wrote > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? I was asking that, myself. > lets end this flaming now Aw, Trev, if you call this flaming, you ain't seen nothing yet. Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: ? substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From asg at MECREANT.ORG Fri Mar 27 16:39:30 2009 From: asg at MECREANT.ORG (Alex S. Garcia) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:39:30 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <5FF6DF45-831D-463A-AB08-180DEB58BA5A@cellsum.com> Message-ID: > The RIAA is a music industry group. They do not deal with movies or > things that come on dvd. True. There ARE music DVD's out there too, though. But regardless, if you add a new medium to the market (such as DVD's) it makes sense that sales on other mediums will drop, especially if that new medium becomes as popular as DVD's did. Just ignoring that doesn't make it less of a reality. The RIAA should at the very least acknowledge this. > I am a public high school teacher. I deal > with teenagers every day. 0% of my students own a CD player. Very few > ever go to live concerts. Most download music illegally. Is it still a > mystery why I'm standing on this soapbox? Don't they have CD players on their computers? Admittedly, though, that's a somewhat different crowd than the one I've dealt with. Those I've talked to all had CD players. Teenagers are a bit of a special case, though, since they tend to try and challenge authority to see how far they can go. Whether this tendency holds or not depends a great deal on how the challengers are dealt with ;-) > An argument could be made that illegal downloading is helping maintain > the popularity of music but I seriously doubt that if ISPs restricted > access to illegal downloading, that the music would be less popular. Of course not. But you wouldn't see an increase in sales either. The poor would simply no longer be able to listen to music at all (aside from radio) while others would just have a harder time deciding what to buy. > Maybe some of these more obscure artists would be encouraged to stay > together if they got some money for their efforts. Absolutely. I just don't think that blocking downloads would get them more money. > I also think that > if every artist was part time that the quality of the music would > suffer. Maybe it already has. Not necessarily. One of my favorite bands (Shadow Gallery) work part time. It just takes longer to finish an album (usually 3 to 4 years with them... and without ever touring.) But hey, if that's the price to pay for quality I don't mind, personally. > Think > about the billions of people who don't own CD players and want their > music. How are all the people who've worked hard to create that music > to get paid? But, Al, if these people don't own a CD player, how could they possibly buy a CD in the first place? Artists are not losing any money from these people since they would not be able to buy anything anyway! > I actually think that iTunes of something of that sort is > the future. On this point, I agree ;-) > I know this might be out of the imagination of most people but what we > have to get used to is that intellectual property is real. Just > because it doesn't take up a lot of physical space doesn't meant that > it is worthless. I never claimed otherwise. Though one could argue (and one did earlier in this thread, LOL) that what we buy when we buy a CD is the object, not the music on it, since we'd have to pay for it again if we lost the CD (or when the formats change, like when we switched from vinyls/tapes to CD's.) So technically downloading music is not stealing anyway since it's not a physical object, not to mention that the original remains with the artist. It doesn't affect the copyright in any way (downloaders don't claim ownership, for instance.) A real theft, on the other hand, would be going into an artist's house and stealing the only existing copy of a new song :-( Alex. From asg at MECREANT.ORG Fri Mar 27 16:46:28 2009 From: asg at MECREANT.ORG (Alex S. Garcia) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:46:28 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > I think this is one of the keys to downloading music, either legally > or illegally. People want music (evidently). And people want > getting that music to be easy. When it became easier to listen to > music on CD than on cassette or vinyl, people rushed to buy CDs. > When it became easier to download stuff than buy CDs, people started > doing it. The iTMS, whatever one thinks of it, proves that there is > a market for selling downloads -- however, it's clearly not easy > enough yet. But I think if one convinces people that it is > "easier" (and that's a concept that includes formats, and bit rates, > and price points, and everything) to buy the music than steal it, > then people will buy it. What the music industry has failed to do is > implement that easiness. Yes! I totally agree with this. I think you nailed it :-) > I will never cease to find it > bizarre how much time the music industry wrings its hands about > piracy in contrast to how little time they spend trying to offer a > functional alternative. Amen to that. I've always said that the industry should try to find a viable solution instead of wasting time (and money) trying to stop something that they cannot stop. Alex. From asg at MECREANT.ORG Fri Mar 27 17:09:06 2009 From: asg at MECREANT.ORG (Alex S. Garcia) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 15:09:06 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903271622.n2RGMcvf012628@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: > Yup, that's how I think it will go, with ISP's being charged something > like a Dollar per week per user to put funds into the pot. No doubt > there will somewhere be someone who never reads a book, listens to a > track, watches a movie or plays a game online and will whine that they > shouldn't have to pay, but they'll be ignored. For the rest of us, in > principle we'll be able to see any movie/track/game/book ever created > and I do think that will be an amazing thing. One way to avoid people whining would be to offer two different types of subscriptions, one with limited access (just email/web surfing for instance) and another with all the extravaganza ;-) Alex. From cea at CARLAZ.COM Fri Mar 27 15:24:06 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:24:06 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903271323.n2RDNCKc024775@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: On 27 Mar 2009, at 13:23, M Holmes wrote: > As I've said, if someone copies a file by downloading, then the artist > or producer still has their file and so nothing concrete has been > taken > from them. That some income has been removed is only the case if > society > agrees that copying files should cost anything. The problem is that a > substantial part of society is unconvinced that we should write the > rules (of morality or law) in such a way that income should accrue > from > such file copying. > The short version is that we haven't yet actually decided on the issue > either in terms of morality, or in terms of what the law will > finally be > on this issue. It's an interesting point, and it does seem to be the case that people generally feel that taking something concrete (e.g. a physical CD from a shop) is "more like stealing" that copying a bunch of 1s and 0s from the internet. Personally, I'm happy with the concept that those 1s and 0s, or that particular arrangement of 1s and 0s belongs to the artist -- that the arrangement of 1s and 0s constitutes, in effect, something concrete -- nd that you shouldn't be allowed to play with that arrangement unless you've purchased or otherwise been granted the right to do so. But, as you point out, society at large does not necessarily agree! I really don't _like_ the idea of a subscription model -- sometimes I listen to lots of music, sometimes I listen to none, and it's really hard to say how it would even out. For similar reasons, I don't like a TV/cable subscription either; I would much prefer to buy everything on demand, so I didn't have to pay for access to lots of stuff I don't want or worry about what time something I do want is accessible. Strangely, it seems to me like video-on-demand is moving towards becoming more of a thing, while people seem to think music is headed the other way, towards subscription! What I really want is the ability to rent or buy whatever content I want, when I want it, without a lot of fuss. I like the idea of having a local copy, since at least for the moment, the Internet is insufficiently pervasive that I can rely on getting a fresh copy of something at any moment. Maybe that will change. But the moment, I feel ... *offended* that I cannot go buy a CD-quality download of a remastered BOC or Hawkwind album to listen to this evening (but that, if I took a little look around, I might well be able to download a pirate copy!). That, surely, is just wrong. Or at least dumb. Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From cea at CARLAZ.COM Fri Mar 27 15:30:07 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:30:07 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 26 Mar 2009, at 20:08, trev wrote: > The internet was "free" > Festivals were "free" > The days of freedom are gone > As soon as the people come up with something original and good, and > that is accessible, the big boys take it over and make their huge > disproportionate fortunes out of it. I could not but help flash on Jack Black in _School of Rock_ when I read this. :) "Give up. Just quit. Because in this life, you can't win. Yeah, you can try, but in the end you're just gonna lose, big time, because the world is run by The Man. The Man -- oh, you don't know the Man? He's everywhere! In the White House, down the hall -- Ms. Mullens, she's The Man. And The Man ruined the ozone, he's burning down the Amazon, and he kidnapped Shamu and put her in a chlorine tank. And there used to be a way to stick it to The Man: it was called Rock and Roll. But guess what? Oh no! The Man ruined that, too, with a little thing called MTV! So don't waste your time trying to make anything cool or pure or awesome cause The Man is just gonna call you a fat, washed-up loser and crush your soul. So do yourselves a favor and just GIVE UP!" Raise your goblet of rock, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From asg at MECREANT.ORG Sat Mar 28 02:21:38 2009 From: asg at MECREANT.ORG (Alex S. Garcia) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 00:21:38 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <3BFCBE12-9956-4C62-803F-BE5D3BE7F7C1@carlaz.com> Message-ID: > Personally, I'm happy with the concept that those 1s and 0s, or that > particular arrangement of 1s and 0s belongs to the artist -- that the > arrangement of 1s and 0s constitutes, in effect, something concrete I would totally agree with this if THAT was what we were sold in stores. Meaning if I buy a CD and what I'm buying is actually the 1s and 0s (ie the music, not the CD itself) then if I lose it or it wears out or whatnot, I should be able to get another copy without paying for it. This, however, is not currently the case. So things need to change. Either make us buy the physical object (and stop bugging us about downloads) or make us buy the 1s and 0s regardless of the medium. Right now it seems to me like the labels are just being greedy bastards, wanting it both ways (surprise surprise). Alex. From arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL Sat Mar 28 05:03:57 2009 From: arjanh at WOLFPACK.NL (Arjan Hulsebos) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 10:03:57 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <53343.86.76.231.227.1238221298.squirrel@mail.mecreant.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Mar 2009 00:21:38 -0600, Alex S. Garcia wrote > I would totally agree with this if THAT was what we were sold in stores. > Meaning if I buy a CD and what I'm buying is actually the 1s and 0s (ie > the music, not the CD itself) then if I lose it or it wears out or > whatnot, I should be able to get another copy without paying for it. I'm not too sure about this. If my car wears out, I don't get a free replacement, either. > So things need to change. Either make us buy the physical object > (and stop bugging us about downloads) or make us buy the 1s and 0s > regardless of the medium. Right now it seems to me like the labels > are just being greedy bastards, wanting it both ways (surprise > surprise). Well, it's all a matter of trust. I've seen (and agreed to) software licenses where you were allowed to make as many copies as you liked, provided that at any given time no more than one copy may be running. Compared to this, the music industry is paranoid beyond belief. Gr, Arjan H -------------------------------- Rock in the 70ies: substance inhalation, hotel devastation, and amplifier obliteration From jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM Sat Mar 28 13:47:14 2009 From: jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM (Jerry Kranitz) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 13:47:14 -0400 Subject: Aural Innovations Radio: New Space Rock Show Message-ID: http://Aural-Innovations.com MARCH 28, 2009: NEW RADIO SHOW: AURAL INNOVATIONS SPACE ROCK RADIO (#214) I've uploaded a new show from Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio (show #214). See the playlist below. Aural Innovations broadcasts 24 hours a day in both streaming and download editions. You can go directly to the Radio shows page at: http://aural-innovations.com/radio/radio.html Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio (show #214) Spaceseed - "Architects of Twilight"/"River in the Sky" (from Architects of Twilight) Earthling Society - "EA1729" (from forthcoming Sci-Fi Hi-Fi) Novadrive - "Fast Than Light" (from forthcoming Made in Space) Jack In The Box - "The Martians Are Coming"/"Giving Up The Ghost" (from Do You Believe In Beetles?) OHead - "Desert Path" (from Gaia's Garden) River Cow Orchestra - "Chromatophore" (from Rawhide) Quarkspace - "Red Melt" (from Spacefolds 9) Goblin - "Suspiria" (from Suspiria) The Higher Craft - "Legends of Time" (from forthcoming new EP) Ebonillumini - "Wax Tribe" (from The Ebon Channel) Navel - "Tres Cosmique" (from Ambient 1: Music for Spaceports) Fractal - "A Fraction Of One" (from Sequitur) First Band From Outer Space - "Turn Left to the Mexican Barbeque" (from The Guitar Is Mightier Than The Gun) Vert:x - "Cube Abuse" (from Ggantija) The Rick Ray Band - "Sgt. Pepperspray" (from Violence Marred By Peace) The Setting Son - "Soulmate" (from Spring Of Hate) The Dolly Rocker Movement - "Our Brave World" (from Our Days Mind The Time) The Mojomatics - "Don't Believe Me When I'm High" (from Don't Believe Me When I'm High 7") Dragontears - "Sunrise" (from Tambourine Freak Machine) Serena-Maneesh - "Oxygen Please!" (from Montrose Cadaveric 7") http://Aural-Innovations.com From hawkfan at RATSAUCE.CO.UK Sun Mar 29 04:19:03 2009 From: hawkfan at RATSAUCE.CO.UK (John Rennie) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 09:19:03 +0100 Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), Message-ID: I've never met anyone with perfect pitch, in the sense that I could play a random note and they could tell me what note it was. Chords are different, because not all major chords sound the same, and I have friends who can tell what key music is in. It's something to do with the spacing between the notes in the scale I think. I must admit I can't tell what a chord is just by hearing it, and I can't tell what key music is in. I can tell major from minor chords and I can mostly recognise intervals, though not always. I guess I'd be unwise to try for a career in music :-) It's doesn't stop me enojing it though! JR -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On Behalf Of mary Sent: 27 March 2009 17:50 To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), Hi friends, I get very frustrated when I listen to music with someone and they can tell the chords automatically. I have a relatively good sense of pitch, and a little grounding in theory, I can pick an A note out of the air on key. Do you think perfect pitch is innate, or can be learned. I have 2 blind friends, and 1 is totally convinced that if I don't have it, I never will. Another, says it can be learned. Of course, I'm inclined to believe the latter. If I'm told that I can't do something, my Irish blood comes through and I'll do whatever I can to prove otherwise. I'd be very interested in what all you fine musicians, and other listeners like me, have to say. Many thanks, Mary From Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK Sun Mar 29 05:04:18 2009 From: Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK (Steve Pond) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 10:04:18 +0100 Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), In-Reply-To: <200903290819.n2T8JEwu017118@www.ispnetinc.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 29 Mar 2009 09:19:03 +0100, you sent through the ether: >I've never met anyone with perfect pitch, in the sense that I could >play a random note and they could tell me what note it was. Stand next to Dead Fred for 10 mins.. even if he get's the note wrong by the end of the conversation he'll have you believing it was right.. From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Sun Mar 29 11:45:49 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 11:45:49 -0400 Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), In-Reply-To: <200903290819.n2T8JEwu017118@www.ispnetinc.net> Message-ID: Hi JR, >From all that I've heard from my last posting, I'm inclined to think that relative pitch can be learned, with ear training and all that, and I guess one can get to a point of having nearly perfect pitch, however, my friend with perfect pitch is amazing. There's a story in her family that at the age of 2 she played "Happy Birthday" for her aunt. Since I listen to so much music I want to understand it better, and we're probably on the same level with our musical abilities. Me, in a band, ha! That's not going to happen. Thanks for your response. I have been away from the computer for a bit since the posting, so if I'm lax in responding to anyone, it's not for lack of interest, I still have to go all the way back to Friday. Time for the Way Back Machine, is the professor their? Mary Mary about -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of John Rennie Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 4:19 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), I've never met anyone with perfect pitch, in the sense that I could play a random note and they could tell me what note it was. Chords are different, because not all major chords sound the same, and I have friends who can tell what key music is in. It's something to do with the spacing between the notes in the scale I think. I must admit I can't tell what a chord is just by hearing it, and I can't tell what key music is in. I can tell major from minor chords and I can mostly recognise intervals, though not always. I guess I'd be unwise to try for a career in music :-) It's doesn't stop me enojing it though! JR -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On Behalf Of mary Sent: 27 March 2009 17:50 To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), Hi friends, I get very frustrated when I listen to music with someone and they can tell the chords automatically. I have a relatively good sense of pitch, and a little grounding in theory, I can pick an A note out of the air on key. Do you think perfect pitch is innate, or can be learned. I have 2 blind friends, and 1 is totally convinced that if I don't have it, I never will. Another, says it can be learned. Of course, I'm inclined to believe the latter. If I'm told that I can't do something, my Irish blood comes through and I'll do whatever I can to prove otherwise. I'd be very interested in what all you fine musicians, and other listeners like me, have to say. Many thanks, Mary From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Sun Mar 29 11:55:52 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 11:55:52 -0400 Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Steve, What, is Dead Fred into conversational hypnosis? (smile) Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Steve Pond Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 5:04 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), On Sun, 29 Mar 2009 09:19:03 +0100, you sent through the ether: >I've never met anyone with perfect pitch, in the sense that I could >play a random note and they could tell me what note it was. Stand next to Dead Fred for 10 mins.. even if he get's the note wrong by the end of the conversation he'll have you believing it was right.. From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Sun Mar 29 14:06:36 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 14:06:36 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <126A561607A76D4B90A6B67641C593E922C9808DFD@exdkmbx005.corp.novocorp.net> Message-ID: Hi Scott, I'm glad your music is getting out there, and you're having fun making it. Thanks for the link to the concerts, I'll definitely check it out. I remember from watching how things went down when Chris was working, adding in things like mechanical rights to the recording makes things well, interesting. I hope you're well. Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of SHLL (Scott Heller) Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 3:16 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! This is a tough subject. Now that I run my own band I can see this in a slightly different light. What we have been doing is giving away high quality MP3 versions of all our jam sessions for free on our web site. We also have all our live concerts recorded and put up on the internet at www.archive.org for free. We do not have any of the tracks from our CDs on our main web site and hope to encourage people to buy our cds and sonn vinyl records! We do put tracks from our cds on myspace, but I think myspace has not lead to a lot of new fans for us. Fans that buy our music. As for illegal downloading, it is something we have to live with as our music lives in a digital world. If you release stuff only on cassette and vinyl, you will have a lot less problems with this as it is more effort for some one to digitize your stuff and put it up. It will of course happen. Our new CD came out last week in Feb and just a week ago, there was already a site : www.omega-music.com (I think) and they had the whole thing up for free download... What can you do??? Our record label tries to write to these people but if they don't want to do anything, little can be done from a small label. Lucky we do not have to live off music. I am just happy that we can get the whole thing to more or less go around and we can still afford to put out 1-2 cds a year... As long as we release music in a digital format, we will live with the problem of people getting our work for free. Scott www.oresundspacecollective.com www.myspace.com/oresundspacecollective From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Mon Mar 30 06:34:52 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 11:34:52 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Mon Mar 30 06:47:41 2009 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 11:47:41 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Carl Edlund Anderson's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:24:06 -0500 Message-ID: An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available URL: From Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK Mon Mar 30 07:33:31 2009 From: Steve at DOREMI.CO.UK (Steve Pond) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 12:33:31 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903301047.n2UAlfuw003089@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: On Mon, 30 Mar 2009 11:47:41 +0100, you sent through the ether: >> I really don't _like_ the idea of a subscription model >I wonder if that's because of the different history? I think the subscription model exists because it's easier to administer, imagine how many people there are on the planet listening to media. Pay per listen/view is not practically possible on a large scale yet. (The yet is the scary bit, when they have that amount of personal control we're doomed) I think eventually we will have a tiered pay per listen/subscription model though, just like satellite TV now, you can choose to pay per film, or if you watch a lot of films subscribe to everything. There would still be nothing to stop bands selling "artifacts" direct to fans, but I think the days of raid fandom are over for anyone under the age of 25. They have too much media squirted at them & have no need to obsess like maybe we did... :o) -S. P.S. I know when trev is joking! From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Mon Mar 30 08:06:13 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 05:06:13 -0700 Subject: Perfect pitch? (better edited, sorry), Message-ID: I had a friend who couldn't read a note of muic, had no musical training, not even a guitar lesson. And yet I watched him the first time he heard some Yes tune and he just sat and "picked out" the riff experimentally on his guitar. It took him all of 10 minutes experimentation to work out the intro. I think that was when I decided I was never going to be a musician, just a fan. :) Steve -----Original Message----- From: mary Date: Friday, Mar 27, 2009 1:42 pm Subject: Perfect pitch? (better edited, sorry), To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Hi friends, I get very frustrated when I listen to music with someone and they can tell the chords automatically. I have a relatively good sense of pitch, and a little grounding in theory, I can pick an A note out of the air on key. Do you think perfect pitch is innate, or can be learned. I have 2 blind friends, and 1 is totally convinced that if I don't have it, I never will. Another, says it can be learned. Of course, I'm inclined to believe the latter. If I'm told that I can't do something, my Irish blood comes through and I'll do whatever I can to prove otherwise. I'd be very interested in what all you fine musicians, and other listeners like me, have to say on this. Many thanks, Mary From sloterdijk at MSN.COM Mon Mar 30 08:39:40 2009 From: sloterdijk at MSN.COM (Burro Mike) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 12:39:40 +0000 Subject: Mike Burro & Friends: FREE Birthday Show this Friday April 3rd Message-ID: Greetings friends, Please join us for my FREE birthday show.The gig is in my hometown of Columbus New Jersey, Friday April 3rd.. For all the details, directions and times, click on the press release link here: http://www.prlog.org/10201035.html ** Stewkey of NAZZ will be part of this show** Check out him out at: http://www.myspace.com/Nazzfeaturingstewkey additional information at: http://www.myspace.com/sloterdijk1 _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live? SkyDrive: Get 25 GB of free online storage. http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_skydrive_032009 From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Mon Mar 30 10:43:14 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 07:43:14 -0700 Subject: Steve Wilson of Porcupine Tree Message-ID: http://tinyurl.com/ct2wpq From StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Mon Mar 30 11:36:32 2009 From: StevePXR5 at AOL.COM (StevePXR5 at AOL.COM) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 11:36:32 EDT Subject: Steve Wilson of Porcupine Tree Message-ID: Thanks for the link. Can anyone tell me what a "shoe gazer anthem" is? Steve. In a message dated 30/03/2009 15:44:24 GMT Standard Time, bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM writes: http://tinyurl.com/ct2wpq From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Mon Mar 30 12:08:23 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 09:08:23 -0700 Subject: Steve Wilson of Porcupine Tree In-Reply-To: Message-ID: _ Something from My Bloody Valentine, Spiritualized, etc. ? ________________________________ From: "StevePXR5 at AOL.COM" To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 10:36:32 AM Subject: Re: Steve Wilson of Porcupine Tree Thanks for the link. Can anyone tell me what a "shoe gazer anthem" is? Steve. In a message dated 30/03/2009 15:44:24 GMT Standard Time,? bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM writes: http://tinyurl.com/ct2wpq From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Mon Mar 30 12:12:41 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 12:12:41 -0400 Subject: Perfect pitch? (better edited, sorry), In-Reply-To: <3321245171.47570549@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: Steve, In response to your story, thanks for the laugh, an audience is important to a band, and to be able to listen to something and make an intelligent comment is nice. That's probably why I want to know some of this information so I can tell someone I like that chord progression that has key changes I may find interesting. That's an example. Even if I never sing a note for anyone but my cat, I want to learn all this. My younger brother was the same as your friend. He started out figuring out the theme to The Jeffersons, and winged it from there and he was able to play The Entertainer by ear the first time he heard it. I'm tired of saying, "I wish I could ..." however, before I by an inexpensive guitar, I'll start with a simple pitch pipe. Thanks for your feedback, and have lots of fun while you keep rockin on that guitar. Many thanks, Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Steve Swann Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 8:06 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: Perfect pitch? (better edited, sorry), I had a friend who couldn't read a note of muic, had no musical training, not even a guitar lesson. And yet I watched him the first time he heard some Yes tune and he just sat and "picked out" the riff experimentally on his guitar. It took him all of 10 minutes experimentation to work out the intro. I think that was when I decided I was never going to be a musician, just a fan. :) Steve -----Original Message----- From: mary Date: Friday, Mar 27, 2009 1:42 pm Subject: Perfect pitch? (better edited, sorry), To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Hi friends, I get very frustrated when I listen to music with someone and they can tell the chords automatically. I have a relatively good sense of pitch, and a little grounding in theory, I can pick an A note out of the air on key. Do you think perfect pitch is innate, or can be learned. I have 2 blind friends, and 1 is totally convinced that if I don't have it, I never will. Another, says it can be learned. Of course, I'm inclined to believe the latter. If I'm told that I can't do something, my Irish blood comes through and I'll do whatever I can to prove otherwise. I'd be very interested in what all you fine musicians, and other listeners like me, have to say on this. Many thanks, Mary From StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Mon Mar 30 12:17:39 2009 From: StevePXR5 at AOL.COM (StevePXR5 at AOL.COM) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 12:17:39 EDT Subject: Steve Wilson of Porcupine Tree Message-ID: Hmmm. Thanks. Shoe gazer eh? Doesn't have quite the same ring to it a Stargazer. Steve. In a message dated 30/03/2009 17:09:17 GMT Standard Time, bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM writes: Something from My Bloody Valentine, Spiritualized, etc From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Mon Mar 30 13:02:57 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 13:02:57 -0400 Subject: Steve Wilson of Porcupine Tree In-Reply-To: <513889.34344.qm@web36907.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks for the link, I have always preferred vinyl too. Since it's hard to clean an album correctly with no sight, and I have a cat and all that hair in the air, I don't trust myself to play what I have. Chris didn't, and I don't wish to ruin my albums by getting stuff further in the groove with a Disk washer. I'd imagine the turn tables that have a brush attached to the stylus might make the weight too heavy. Chris was meticulous while handling the albums, and they're going to stay in the best shape I can keep them in. I'm NOT parting with the collection Chris and I built, even if I have to build A shelving unit MYSELF. I know I have a vinyl copy of "On The Sunday Of Life." From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Mon Mar 30 17:34:11 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:34:11 -0400 Subject: A computer question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks Al, I don't use mouses, strictly keyboard commands. The cat wouldn't like it, so no mouse for me, in this house. Of course, I do have 1 hooked up, so everyone else who uses the computer to help me can do it. I decided to blow up the computer, and it was great. Wow! What fun. Seriously, I used a butter knife to extract the disc. I was at it sawing for days. Actually, I pried it out in 5 minutes, but I don't know if the disc will ever play again. My brother said it looks all right, but won't play. I have the same type of drawer on my big stereo, and have never had trouble with it. I think in my case, an Ipod might not be such a bad idea. I want the real CD, but if I had the Ipod for casual use I wouldn't have to worry about losing track of a disc, or worse, smudging it up. Since they're quite affordable, I think I'll get 1 for my trip to shows while traveling from Boston to NJ. In the middle of the night there aren't often too many folks awake on the bus to talk with. I don't do playlists. Back in '91, I was talking to Alan after a Hawkwind show, about shuffle play, and I told him I listen to a disc in order, usually, because I feel the music is sequenced by the artist to make the album flow in a certain way. Thanks for getting back to me about the computer. I was told I had a response from you, it took me time to work back to last week. I don't know how to organize my mail so the Hawkwind items, for example, go into a Hawkwind file. I'll have to ask my other blind friend, who I call my computer guru. Many thanks, Mary (and Kosh) -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Albert Bouchard Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 7:54 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: A computer question On a mac the cd will spill its guts if you hold down the mouse button as it's starting up. That's my one trick. Al On Mar 25, 2009, at 1:40 PM, mary wrote: > Hi, friends, > I very carefully inserted a disc into the computer, and when I tried > to get > it out it wouldn't budge. I have tried the trick with the paper > clip, and > also leaning the tower forward, but the thing is jammed in there, > and the > computer doesn't acknowledge it as being there. Any other ideas? > Honest, > it wasn't me being clumsy. A friend was standing right there when it > happened, but he knows less about computers than I do, if you can > believe > that. I hope someone has a good idea for getting the disc out, so I > can get > the burner back. Now, the real question is why does this always > have to > happen to me? > I don't mean to be a pita with all these computer queries. > > Thanks, > > Mary > From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 09:34:46 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 09:34:46 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903301034.n2UAYqfd001955@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: I'm not a communist, but capitalism isn't all that great, the way it's being managed. Theoretically, I suppose both systems have their merits, as long as they're being managed by flawed humans no matter how good they seem the result is always going to be the same. Whether you have people working collectively for a state, or independently, some people are going to end up more equal than others, or there'll be fat rich cats at the top, and everyone else fights for what's left. I'm not saying anything new, obviously, the barter system would be nice to see put into action. We all need money to get by, unfortunately in this age of consumerism, it seems to be a false deity. I guess that golden calf was never really destroyed. Just a few thoughts I've been milling around since this thread started. Me, I don't have any answers, just questions. Treat people right, is what I believe and good things will come from that. Thanks for your indulgence, Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of M Holmes Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 6:35 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! trev writes: From: M Holmes Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! To: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000 Reply-To: M.Holmes at ed.ac.uk Cc: trev writes: > c minus...gobbledegook > > a. your answer is badly presented Then my apologies for that. Sometimes I'm pushed for time and just rattle them out on the keyboard. > b. you don't understand rhetoric Perhaps then you could teach me? > c. you haven't lived in africa like wot i have While I'm sure seeing poor countries firsthand can be useful in understanding a problem, I'm not sure that it's a requirement at the level at which we're discussing this problem. If it were, then most of the people in the G20 demonstration this week ought to be sent to live in Africa before they're permitted to protest. Would you advocate that? > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? A GINI coefficient is an economists way of actually measuring the relative wage differences between the rich and poor within a country. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient > e. i'm afraid you'll have to spend another year in the 6th form... May I assume then that you do in fact have a 6th form qualification in Economics? > lets end this flaming now Up until your reply, all posts had all been aimed at the argument and not the man. I'd be very happy if we'd return to that... FoFP -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336. From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 31 09:49:39 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 07:49:39 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: fIRST YOU HAVE TO DENOUNCE THE PAINT-HUFFING. eSCPECIALLY WHEN AT THE COMPUTER On 3/31/09, mary wrote: > > I'm not a communist, but capitalism isn't all that great, the way it's > being > managed. Theoretically, I suppose both systems have their merits, as long > as they're being managed by flawed humans no matter how good they seem the > result is always going to be the same. Whether you have people working > collectively for a state, or independently, some people are going to end up > more equal than others, or there'll be fat rich cats at the top, and > everyone else fights for what's left. > I'm not saying anything new, obviously, the barter system would be nice to > see put into action. We all need money to get by, unfortunately in this > age > of consumerism, it seems to be a false deity. I guess that golden calf was > never really destroyed. > Just a few thoughts I've been milling around since this thread > started. Me, > I don't have any answers, just questions. Treat people right, is what I > believe and good things will come from that. > > Thanks for your indulgence, > > Mary > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of M Holmes > Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 6:35 AM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > trev writes: > > From: M Holmes > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > To: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000 > Reply-To: M.Holmes at ed.ac.uk > Cc: > > trev writes: > > > c minus...gobbledegook > > > > a. your answer is badly presented > > Then my apologies for that. Sometimes I'm pushed for time and just > rattle them out on the keyboard. > > > b. you don't understand rhetoric > > Perhaps then you could teach me? > > > c. you haven't lived in africa like wot i have > > While I'm sure seeing poor countries firsthand can be useful in > understanding a problem, I'm not sure that it's a requirement at the > level at which we're discussing this problem. If it were, then most of > the people in the G20 demonstration this week ought to be sent to live > in Africa before they're permitted to protest. Would you advocate that? > > > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? > > A GINI coefficient is an economists way of actually measuring the > relative wage differences between the rich and poor within a country. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient > > > e. i'm afraid you'll have to spend another year in the 6th form... > > May I assume then that you do in fact have a 6th form qualification in > Economics? > > > lets end this flaming now > > Up until your reply, all posts had all been aimed at the argument and not > the man. I'd be very happy if we'd return to that... > > FoFP > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Tue Mar 31 10:01:39 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 15:01:39 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903301034.n2UAYqfd001955@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> <17d80c610903310649l233dbb26o4b6a740825979142@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: ALL CAPITALISTS ARE IDIOTS ALL COMMUNISTS ARE IDIOTS EXISTENCE IS A BALANCE FOLLOW THE PATH OF JUDGEMENT! REAL FESTIVAL MUSIC - RFM http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk Festival CD's, Festival Photo Reviews, Festival Listings, Video Downloads, News, Healers Trev and Kev MySpace http://www.myspace.com/trevandkev Judge Trev MySpace http://www.myspace.com/judgetrev Real Music Club MySpace http://www.myspace.com/realmusicclubbrighton1 Real Music Club website http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk/realmusicclub1.html Inner City Unit Myspace http://www.myspace.com/nikturnerinnercityunit Judge Trev: http://www.judgetrev.com AND THE BEAST WAS CAST ALIVE IN THE LAKE OF BURNING FIRE AND THE REST OF THEM WERE SLAIN BY THE ONE UPON THE WHITE HORSE AND HIS EYES WERE AS A FLAME OF FIRE HE WAS CROWNED WITH MANY CROWNS AND IN RIGHTEOUSNESS HE JUDGES AND IN RIGHTEOUSNESS HE WAGES WAR -------------------------------------------------- From: "mike coleman" Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 2:49 PM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > fIRST YOU HAVE TO DENOUNCE THE PAINT-HUFFING. eSCPECIALLY WHEN AT THE > COMPUTER > > On 3/31/09, mary wrote: >> >> I'm not a communist, but capitalism isn't all that great, the way it's >> being >> managed. Theoretically, I suppose both systems have their merits, as long >> as they're being managed by flawed humans no matter how good they seem the >> result is always going to be the same. Whether you have people working >> collectively for a state, or independently, some people are going to end up >> more equal than others, or there'll be fat rich cats at the top, and >> everyone else fights for what's left. >> I'm not saying anything new, obviously, the barter system would be nice to >> see put into action. We all need money to get by, unfortunately in this >> age >> of consumerism, it seems to be a false deity. I guess that golden calf was >> never really destroyed. >> Just a few thoughts I've been milling around since this thread >> started. Me, >> I don't have any answers, just questions. Treat people right, is what I >> believe and good things will come from that. >> >> Thanks for your indulgence, >> >> Mary >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List >> [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of M Holmes >> Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 6:35 AM >> To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET >> Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! >> >> >> trev writes: >> >> From: M Holmes >> Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! >> To: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List >> In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000 >> Reply-To: M.Holmes at ed.ac.uk >> Cc: >> >> trev writes: >> >> > c minus...gobbledegook >> > >> > a. your answer is badly presented >> >> Then my apologies for that. Sometimes I'm pushed for time and just >> rattle them out on the keyboard. >> >> > b. you don't understand rhetoric >> >> Perhaps then you could teach me? >> >> > c. you haven't lived in africa like wot i have >> >> While I'm sure seeing poor countries firsthand can be useful in >> understanding a problem, I'm not sure that it's a requirement at the >> level at which we're discussing this problem. If it were, then most of >> the people in the G20 demonstration this week ought to be sent to live >> in Africa before they're permitted to protest. Would you advocate that? >> >> > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? >> >> A GINI coefficient is an economists way of actually measuring the >> relative wage differences between the rich and poor within a country. >> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient >> >> > e. i'm afraid you'll have to spend another year in the 6th form... >> >> May I assume then that you do in fact have a 6th form qualification in >> Economics? >> >> > lets end this flaming now >> >> Up until your reply, all posts had all been aimed at the argument and not >> the man. I'd be very happy if we'd return to that... >> >> FoFP >> >> -- >> The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in >> Scotland, with registration number SC005336. >> > From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 31 10:11:41 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 08:11:41 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: i AGREE DON'T REALLY NEED A THING IN THIS WORLD OTHER THAN ONE-ANOTHER, AND HOPEFULLY A STUDIO 45 7INCH OF "TIME FOR SALE" POLISHING SILVER SHOULD SIMPLY BE FOR THOSe that enjoy it, and the rest of us can just admire it through the keepers safely open windows, and their doors should be safe unlocked as well.... Here's hoping there were more than one life forms left on mars when uncle sam squished one acccidentally and said "oh fu&k" On 3/31/09, trev wrote: > > ALL CAPITALISTS ARE IDIOTS > ALL COMMUNISTS ARE IDIOTS > > EXISTENCE IS A BALANCE > > FOLLOW THE PATH OF JUDGEMENT! > > > > > REAL FESTIVAL MUSIC - RFM http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk > Festival CD's, Festival Photo Reviews, Festival Listings, Video Downloads, > News, Healers > > Trev and Kev MySpace http://www.myspace.com/trevandkev > > Judge Trev MySpace http://www.myspace.com/judgetrev > > Real Music Club MySpace http://www.myspace.com/realmusicclubbrighton1 > > Real Music Club website > http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk/realmusicclub1.html > > Inner City Unit Myspace http://www.myspace.com/nikturnerinnercityunit > > Judge Trev: http://www.judgetrev.com > > AND THE BEAST WAS CAST ALIVE IN THE LAKE OF BURNING FIRE AND THE REST OF > THEM WERE SLAIN BY THE ONE UPON THE WHITE HORSE AND HIS EYES WERE AS A FLAME > OF FIRE HE WAS CROWNED WITH MANY CROWNS AND IN RIGHTEOUSNESS HE JUDGES AND > IN RIGHTEOUSNESS HE WAGES WAR > > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "mike coleman" > Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 2:49 PM > To: > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > fIRST YOU HAVE TO DENOUNCE THE PAINT-HUFFING. eSCPECIALLY WHEN AT THE > > COMPUTER > > > > On 3/31/09, mary wrote: > >> > >> I'm not a communist, but capitalism isn't all that great, the way it's > >> being > >> managed. Theoretically, I suppose both systems have their merits, as > long > >> as they're being managed by flawed humans no matter how good they seem > the > >> result is always going to be the same. Whether you have people working > >> collectively for a state, or independently, some people are going to end > up > >> more equal than others, or there'll be fat rich cats at the top, and > >> everyone else fights for what's left. > >> I'm not saying anything new, obviously, the barter system would be nice > to > >> see put into action. We all need money to get by, unfortunately in this > >> age > >> of consumerism, it seems to be a false deity. I guess that golden calf > was > >> never really destroyed. > >> Just a few thoughts I've been milling around since this thread > >> started. Me, > >> I don't have any answers, just questions. Treat people right, is what I > >> believe and good things will come from that. > >> > >> Thanks for your indulgence, > >> > >> Mary > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > >> [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of M Holmes > >> Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 6:35 AM > >> To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > >> Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > >> > >> > >> trev writes: > >> > >> From: M Holmes > >> Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > >> To: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > >> In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000 > >> Reply-To: M.Holmes at ed.ac.uk > >> Cc: > >> > >> trev writes: > >> > >> > c minus...gobbledegook > >> > > >> > a. your answer is badly presented > >> > >> Then my apologies for that. Sometimes I'm pushed for time and just > >> rattle them out on the keyboard. > >> > >> > b. you don't understand rhetoric > >> > >> Perhaps then you could teach me? > >> > >> > c. you haven't lived in africa like wot i have > >> > >> While I'm sure seeing poor countries firsthand can be useful in > >> understanding a problem, I'm not sure that it's a requirement at the > >> level at which we're discussing this problem. If it were, then most of > >> the people in the G20 demonstration this week ought to be sent to live > >> in Africa before they're permitted to protest. Would you advocate that? > >> > >> > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? > >> > >> A GINI coefficient is an economists way of actually measuring the > >> relative wage differences between the rich and poor within a country. > >> > >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient > >> > >> > e. i'm afraid you'll have to spend another year in the 6th form... > >> > >> May I assume then that you do in fact have a 6th form qualification in > >> Economics? > >> > >> > lets end this flaming now > >> > >> Up until your reply, all posts had all been aimed at the argument and > not > >> the man. I'd be very happy if we'd return to that... > >> > >> FoFP > >> > >> -- > >> The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > >> Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > >> > > > From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Tue Mar 31 11:01:32 2009 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:01:32 +0100 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <200903301034.n2UAYqfd001955@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> <17d80c610903310649l233dbb26o4b6a740825979142@mail.gmail.com> <17d80c610903310711x39f9ad0clfe41cf0aa065dd84@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials -------------------------------------------------- From: "mike coleman" Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 3:11 PM To: Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > i AGREE > DON'T REALLY NEED A THING IN THIS WORLD OTHER THAN ONE-ANOTHER, AND > HOPEFULLY A STUDIO 45 7INCH OF "TIME FOR SALE" > POLISHING SILVER SHOULD SIMPLY BE FOR THOSe that enjoy it, and the rest of > us can just admire it through the keepers safely open windows, and their > doors should be safe unlocked as well.... > Here's hoping there were more than one life forms left on mars when uncle > sam squished one acccidentally and said "oh fu&k" > > > On 3/31/09, trev wrote: >> >> ALL CAPITALISTS ARE IDIOTS >> ALL COMMUNISTS ARE IDIOTS >> >> EXISTENCE IS A BALANCE >> >> FOLLOW THE PATH OF JUDGEMENT! >> >> >> >> >> REAL FESTIVAL MUSIC - RFM http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk >> Festival CD's, Festival Photo Reviews, Festival Listings, Video >> Downloads, >> News, Healers >> >> Trev and Kev MySpace http://www.myspace.com/trevandkev >> >> Judge Trev MySpace http://www.myspace.com/judgetrev >> >> Real Music Club MySpace http://www.myspace.com/realmusicclubbrighton1 >> >> Real Music Club website >> http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk/realmusicclub1.html >> >> Inner City Unit Myspace http://www.myspace.com/nikturnerinnercityunit >> >> Judge Trev: http://www.judgetrev.com >> >> AND THE BEAST WAS CAST ALIVE IN THE LAKE OF BURNING FIRE AND THE REST OF >> THEM WERE SLAIN BY THE ONE UPON THE WHITE HORSE AND HIS EYES WERE AS A >> FLAME >> OF FIRE HE WAS CROWNED WITH MANY CROWNS AND IN RIGHTEOUSNESS HE JUDGES >> AND >> IN RIGHTEOUSNESS HE WAGES WAR >> >> >> -------------------------------------------------- >> From: "mike coleman" >> Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 2:49 PM >> To: >> Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! >> >> > fIRST YOU HAVE TO DENOUNCE THE PAINT-HUFFING. eSCPECIALLY WHEN AT THE >> > COMPUTER >> > >> > On 3/31/09, mary wrote: >> >> >> >> I'm not a communist, but capitalism isn't all that great, the way it's >> >> being >> >> managed. Theoretically, I suppose both systems have their merits, as >> long >> >> as they're being managed by flawed humans no matter how good they seem >> the >> >> result is always going to be the same. Whether you have people >> >> working >> >> collectively for a state, or independently, some people are going to >> >> end >> up >> >> more equal than others, or there'll be fat rich cats at the top, and >> >> everyone else fights for what's left. >> >> I'm not saying anything new, obviously, the barter system would be >> >> nice >> to >> >> see put into action. We all need money to get by, unfortunately in >> >> this >> >> age >> >> of consumerism, it seems to be a false deity. I guess that golden >> >> calf >> was >> >> never really destroyed. >> >> Just a few thoughts I've been milling around since this thread >> >> started. Me, >> >> I don't have any answers, just questions. Treat people right, is what >> >> I >> >> believe and good things will come from that. >> >> >> >> Thanks for your indulgence, >> >> >> >> Mary >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List >> >> [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of M Holmes >> >> Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 6:35 AM >> >> To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET >> >> Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! >> >> >> >> >> >> trev writes: >> >> >> >> From: M Holmes >> >> Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! >> >> To: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List >> >> In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000 >> >> Reply-To: M.Holmes at ed.ac.uk >> >> Cc: >> >> >> >> trev writes: >> >> >> >> > c minus...gobbledegook >> >> > >> >> > a. your answer is badly presented >> >> >> >> Then my apologies for that. Sometimes I'm pushed for time and just >> >> rattle them out on the keyboard. >> >> >> >> > b. you don't understand rhetoric >> >> >> >> Perhaps then you could teach me? >> >> >> >> > c. you haven't lived in africa like wot i have >> >> >> >> While I'm sure seeing poor countries firsthand can be useful in >> >> understanding a problem, I'm not sure that it's a requirement at the >> >> level at which we're discussing this problem. If it were, then most of >> >> the people in the G20 demonstration this week ought to be sent to live >> >> in Africa before they're permitted to protest. Would you advocate >> >> that? >> >> >> >> > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? >> >> >> >> A GINI coefficient is an economists way of actually measuring the >> >> relative wage differences between the rich and poor within a country. >> >> >> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient >> >> >> >> > e. i'm afraid you'll have to spend another year in the 6th form... >> >> >> >> May I assume then that you do in fact have a 6th form qualification in >> >> Economics? >> >> >> >> > lets end this flaming now >> >> >> >> Up until your reply, all posts had all been aimed at the argument and >> not >> >> the man. I'd be very happy if we'd return to that... >> >> >> >> FoFP >> >> >> >> -- >> >> The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in >> >> Scotland, with registration number SC005336. >> >> >> > >> > From StevePXR5 at AOL.COM Tue Mar 31 11:20:20 2009 From: StevePXR5 at AOL.COM (StevePXR5 at AOL.COM) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 11:20:20 EDT Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: Writing in capitols does the old tinnitus no good at all. Tone it down a tad old chap. Steve. In a message dated 31/03/2009 16:02:50 GMT Standard Time, judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM writes: ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 11:33:05 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 11:33:05 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903310649l233dbb26o4b6a740825979142@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: O.K. Mike, now what did I do now? Mike Coleman writes, fIRST YOU HAVE TO DENOUNCE THE PAINT-HUFFING. eSCPECIALLY WHEN AT THE COMPUTER." Never would try that kind of thing, besides, I couldn't inhale and type at the same time. Maybe when I can talk at the computer, (no, not even then). There's too much pollution in the air, and I can't stand the smells of all those chemicals. Oh, right, that doesn't begin to deal with what that does to brain cells. Gee, where's my bong? Just kidding, honest). I realize you're having a bit of fun picking on me, and if that makes you happy I guess I'm destined to a life of being picked on by M.C. Seriously, for those who don't already know, Mike is a dear friend who has spent weeks worth of time on the phone with me, if you add it all up helping me cope with my losing Chris. Look out, Mike, you know, I don't forget anything, What was I saying)? You never know when I'm going to hit you back. You really are bad, though, "Paint-huffing," ak! A lot of my typos are errors because my brain is working faster than my hands. I do edit, of course, unfortunately things slip by me, my reader, and spellchecker, concerning content, I know, sometimes I'll acknowledge a response but not have much else worthwhile to say. That's because I can get deluged with emails from various groups, so while I'm burning out on doing email, I want to get caught up, especially if I've been away from the computer for a few days. Just a bit of an explanation, because I don't want to appear to be a spaceshot when posting. When I was first reading in a forum I thought, "With all these intelligent people, what can I say." Fortunately, I got over that. The water's fine, I'm glad I jumped in a long time ago. I'll be there in spirit, for the 40th anniversary gig. I wish the band and all who go All the best, and more. I'm sure it will be a blast. Happy trails, Later, Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 9:50 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! fIRST YOU HAVE TO DENOUNCE THE PAINT-HUFFING. eSCPECIALLY WHEN AT THE COMPUTER On 3/31/09, mary wrote: > > I'm not a communist, but capitalism isn't all that great, the way it's > being > managed. Theoretically, I suppose both systems have their merits, as long > as they're being managed by flawed humans no matter how good they seem the > result is always going to be the same. Whether you have people working > collectively for a state, or independently, some people are going to end up > more equal than others, or there'll be fat rich cats at the top, and > everyone else fights for what's left. > I'm not saying anything new, obviously, the barter system would be nice to > see put into action. We all need money to get by, unfortunately in this > age > of consumerism, it seems to be a false deity. I guess that golden calf was > never really destroyed. > Just a few thoughts I've been milling around since this thread > started. Me, > I don't have any answers, just questions. Treat people right, is what I > believe and good things will come from that. > > Thanks for your indulgence, > > Mary > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of M Holmes > Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 6:35 AM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > trev writes: > > From: M Holmes > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > To: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000 > Reply-To: M.Holmes at ed.ac.uk > Cc: > > trev writes: > > > c minus...gobbledegook > > > > a. your answer is badly presented > > Then my apologies for that. Sometimes I'm pushed for time and just > rattle them out on the keyboard. > > > b. you don't understand rhetoric > > Perhaps then you could teach me? > > > c. you haven't lived in africa like wot i have > > While I'm sure seeing poor countries firsthand can be useful in > understanding a problem, I'm not sure that it's a requirement at the > level at which we're discussing this problem. If it were, then most of > the people in the G20 demonstration this week ought to be sent to live > in Africa before they're permitted to protest. Would you advocate that? > > > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? > > A GINI coefficient is an economists way of actually measuring the > relative wage differences between the rich and poor within a country. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient > > > e. i'm afraid you'll have to spend another year in the 6th form... > > May I assume then that you do in fact have a 6th form qualification in > Economics? > > > lets end this flaming now > > Up until your reply, all posts had all been aimed at the argument and not > the man. I'd be very happy if we'd return to that... > > FoFP > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 31 11:34:33 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 09:34:33 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: hehe must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, then milk, way too sweet, clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame On 3/31/09, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > > > Writing in capitols does the old tinnitus no good at all. > Tone it down a tad old chap. > > Steve. > > In a message dated 31/03/2009 16:02:50 GMT Standard Time, > judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM writes: > > ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials > From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 31 11:42:55 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 09:42:55 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: you replied to Steve Swann I found myself wondering if Perkins slapped you with an honors and bumped you along, but as I know you so well you earned your degree for sure despite the migraines they endured I do apologoize for my flame also 1) Chris was all about cleaning up vinyl and putting it to CDR, so were you 2) I told you about the carbon fibre brush 3) won't discuss the iPod, you ARE close 4) no Bill, d'ya hear? On 3/31/09, mary wrote: > > O.K. Mike, now what did I do now? Mike Coleman writes, fIRST YOU HAVE TO > DENOUNCE THE PAINT-HUFFING. eSCPECIALLY WHEN AT THE > COMPUTER." Never would try that kind of thing, besides, I couldn't inhale > and type at the same time. Maybe when I can talk at the computer, (no, > not > even then). There's too much pollution in the air, and I can't stand the > smells of all those chemicals. Oh, right, that doesn't begin to deal with > what that does to brain cells. Gee, where's my bong? Just kidding, > honest). I realize you're having a bit of fun picking on me, and if that > makes you happy I guess I'm destined to a life of being picked on by M.C. > Seriously, for those who don't already know, Mike is a dear friend who has > spent weeks worth of time on the phone with me, if you add it all up > helping > me cope with my losing Chris. Look out, Mike, you know, I don't forget > anything, What was I saying)? You never know when I'm going to hit you > back. You really are bad, though, "Paint-huffing," ak! > A lot of my typos are errors because my brain is working faster than my > hands. I do edit, of course, unfortunately things slip by me, my reader, > and spellchecker, concerning content, I know, sometimes I'll acknowledge a > response but not have much else worthwhile to say. That's because I can > get > deluged with emails from various groups, so while I'm burning out on doing > email, I want to get caught up, especially if I've been away from the > computer for a few days. > Just a bit of an explanation, because I don't want to appear to be a > spaceshot when posting. When I was first reading in a forum I thought, > "With all these intelligent people, what can I say." Fortunately, I got > over > that. The water's fine, I'm glad I jumped in a long time ago. > I'll be there in spirit, for the 40th anniversary gig. I wish the band and > all who go All the best, and more. I'm sure it will be a blast. > > Happy trails, > > Later, > > Mary > > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman > Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 9:50 AM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > fIRST YOU HAVE TO DENOUNCE THE PAINT-HUFFING. eSCPECIALLY WHEN AT THE > COMPUTER > > On 3/31/09, mary wrote: > > > > I'm not a communist, but capitalism isn't all that great, the way it's > > being > > managed. Theoretically, I suppose both systems have their merits, as > long > > as they're being managed by flawed humans no matter how good they seem > the > > result is always going to be the same. Whether you have people working > > collectively for a state, or independently, some people are going to end > up > > more equal than others, or there'll be fat rich cats at the top, and > > everyone else fights for what's left. > > I'm not saying anything new, obviously, the barter system would be nice > to > > see put into action. We all need money to get by, unfortunately in this > > age > > of consumerism, it seems to be a false deity. I guess that golden calf > was > > never really destroyed. > > Just a few thoughts I've been milling around since this thread > > started. Me, > > I don't have any answers, just questions. Treat people right, is what I > > believe and good things will come from that. > > > > Thanks for your indulgence, > > > > Mary > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of M Holmes > > Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 6:35 AM > > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > > > > trev writes: > > > > From: M Holmes > > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > To: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > > In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000 > > Reply-To: M.Holmes at ed.ac.uk > > Cc: > > > > trev writes: > > > > > c minus...gobbledegook > > > > > > a. your answer is badly presented > > > > Then my apologies for that. Sometimes I'm pushed for time and just > > rattle them out on the keyboard. > > > > > b. you don't understand rhetoric > > > > Perhaps then you could teach me? > > > > > c. you haven't lived in africa like wot i have > > > > While I'm sure seeing poor countries firsthand can be useful in > > understanding a problem, I'm not sure that it's a requirement at the > > level at which we're discussing this problem. If it were, then most of > > the people in the G20 demonstration this week ought to be sent to live > > in Africa before they're permitted to protest. Would you advocate that? > > > > > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? > > > > A GINI coefficient is an economists way of actually measuring the > > relative wage differences between the rich and poor within a country. > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient > > > > > e. i'm afraid you'll have to spend another year in the 6th form... > > > > May I assume then that you do in fact have a 6th form qualification in > > Economics? > > > > > lets end this flaming now > > > > Up until your reply, all posts had all been aimed at the argument and not > > the man. I'd be very happy if we'd return to that... > > > > FoFP > > > > -- > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 11:48:06 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 11:48:06 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903310834x6506258ay3c9f4fa57ef842fa@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I never said to ruin it with milk, apple sauce, otherwise, don't bother. You know what I think of milk. Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 11:35 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! hehe must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, then milk, way too sweet, clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame On 3/31/09, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > > > Writing in capitols does the old tinnitus no good at all. > Tone it down a tad old chap. > > Steve. > > In a message dated 31/03/2009 16:02:50 GMT Standard Time, > judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM writes: > > ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials > From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Tue Mar 31 11:57:10 2009 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jonathan Jarrett) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:57:10 +0100 Subject: Heavy metal band name flow chart In-Reply-To: <457991.26396.qm@web36908.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, Mar 03, 2009 at 08:18:34AM -0800, gary shindler typed out: > http://flowingdata.com/2009/01/23/heavy-metal-band-names-flow-chart/ That's really quite cute. Thanks for sharing, yours, Jon -- "When fortune wanes, of what assistance are quantities of elephants?" (Juvaini, Afghan Muslim chronicler, c. 1206) Jon Jarrett, Fitzwilliam Museum, jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 12:34:18 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 12:34:18 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903310834x6506258ay3c9f4fa57ef842fa@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, M.C. writes, then milk, way too sweet, clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame." Mike, that explains your previous posting, all that grain went to your brain. Besides I thought it was already clear everything is Steve Swan's fault. -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 11:35 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! hehe must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, then milk, way too sweet, clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame On 3/31/09, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > > > Writing in capitols does the old tinnitus no good at all. > Tone it down a tad old chap. > > Steve. > > In a message dated 31/03/2009 16:02:50 GMT Standard Time, > judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM writes: > > ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials > From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 13:04:27 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 13:04:27 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903310842s7c96d04bw2a0584d052638bd0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: With respect to the Ipod, I believe in my case it's a worthwhile expense. Rather than having to keep track of a ton of discs all the time, I'd rather download what I want for my trip, (for example), and not have to worry about losing them, it will make things so easy, especially since the Ipod talks. That doesn't negate what I said with respect to vinyl. If we had transferred our collection, we'd still keep it. When you're head is in the right place, there's nothing much better than a mint copy of an old buried treasure, like A King Crimson test pressing, or an OMR release. even with the flipping. The PT album is still virgin, I'm looking forward to hearing that. I'm not justifying my Ipod, because I don't have to, I do want to be clear about my preferences. If my postings seemed to be contradictory concerning the Ipod, you now know why. Later, Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 11:43 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! you replied to Steve Swann I found myself wondering if Perkins slapped you with an honors and bumped you along, but as I know you so well you earned your degree for sure despite the migraines they endured I do apologoize for my flame also 1) Chris was all about cleaning up vinyl and putting it to CDR, so were you 2) I told you about the carbon fibre brush 3) won't discuss the iPod, you ARE close 4) no Bill, d'ya hear? On 3/31/09, mary wrote: > > O.K. Mike, now what did I do now? Mike Coleman writes, fIRST YOU HAVE TO > DENOUNCE THE PAINT-HUFFING. eSCPECIALLY WHEN AT THE > COMPUTER." Never would try that kind of thing, besides, I couldn't inhale > and type at the same time. Maybe when I can talk at the computer, (no, > not > even then). There's too much pollution in the air, and I can't stand the > smells of all those chemicals. Oh, right, that doesn't begin to deal with > what that does to brain cells. Gee, where's my bong? Just kidding, > honest). I realize you're having a bit of fun picking on me, and if that > makes you happy I guess I'm destined to a life of being picked on by M.C. > Seriously, for those who don't already know, Mike is a dear friend who has > spent weeks worth of time on the phone with me, if you add it all up > helping > me cope with my losing Chris. Look out, Mike, you know, I don't forget > anything, What was I saying)? You never know when I'm going to hit you > back. You really are bad, though, "Paint-huffing," ak! > A lot of my typos are errors because my brain is working faster than my > hands. I do edit, of course, unfortunately things slip by me, my reader, > and spellchecker, concerning content, I know, sometimes I'll acknowledge a > response but not have much else worthwhile to say. That's because I can > get > deluged with emails from various groups, so while I'm burning out on doing > email, I want to get caught up, especially if I've been away from the > computer for a few days. > Just a bit of an explanation, because I don't want to appear to be a > spaceshot when posting. When I was first reading in a forum I thought, > "With all these intelligent people, what can I say." Fortunately, I got > over > that. The water's fine, I'm glad I jumped in a long time ago. > I'll be there in spirit, for the 40th anniversary gig. I wish the band and > all who go All the best, and more. I'm sure it will be a blast. > > Happy trails, > > Later, > > Mary > > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman > Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 9:50 AM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > fIRST YOU HAVE TO DENOUNCE THE PAINT-HUFFING. eSCPECIALLY WHEN AT THE > COMPUTER > > On 3/31/09, mary wrote: > > > > I'm not a communist, but capitalism isn't all that great, the way it's > > being > > managed. Theoretically, I suppose both systems have their merits, as > long > > as they're being managed by flawed humans no matter how good they seem > the > > result is always going to be the same. Whether you have people working > > collectively for a state, or independently, some people are going to end > up > > more equal than others, or there'll be fat rich cats at the top, and > > everyone else fights for what's left. > > I'm not saying anything new, obviously, the barter system would be nice > to > > see put into action. We all need money to get by, unfortunately in this > > age > > of consumerism, it seems to be a false deity. I guess that golden calf > was > > never really destroyed. > > Just a few thoughts I've been milling around since this thread > > started. Me, > > I don't have any answers, just questions. Treat people right, is what I > > believe and good things will come from that. > > > > Thanks for your indulgence, > > > > Mary > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of M Holmes > > Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 6:35 AM > > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > > > > trev writes: > > > > From: M Holmes > > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > To: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > > In-Reply-To: trev's message of Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:16:37 -0000 > > Reply-To: M.Holmes at ed.ac.uk > > Cc: > > > > trev writes: > > > > > c minus...gobbledegook > > > > > > a. your answer is badly presented > > > > Then my apologies for that. Sometimes I'm pushed for time and just > > rattle them out on the keyboard. > > > > > b. you don't understand rhetoric > > > > Perhaps then you could teach me? > > > > > c. you haven't lived in africa like wot i have > > > > While I'm sure seeing poor countries firsthand can be useful in > > understanding a problem, I'm not sure that it's a requirement at the > > level at which we're discussing this problem. If it were, then most of > > the people in the G20 demonstration this week ought to be sent to live > > in Africa before they're permitted to protest. Would you advocate that? > > > > > d. what the hell is a GINI coefficient? > > > > A GINI coefficient is an economists way of actually measuring the > > relative wage differences between the rich and poor within a country. > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient > > > > > e. i'm afraid you'll have to spend another year in the 6th form... > > > > May I assume then that you do in fact have a 6th form qualification in > > Economics? > > > > > lets end this flaming now > > > > Up until your reply, all posts had all been aimed at the argument and not > > the man. I'd be very happy if we'd return to that... > > > > FoFP > > > > -- > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > From swann1066 at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 31 14:13:21 2009 From: swann1066 at GMAIL.COM (Steve Swann) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 11:13:21 -0700 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: I'm not sure I should be blamed for Coleman powdering and snorting his Caps Lock key! Steve -----Original Message----- From: mary Date: Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 12:36 pm Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, M.C. writes, then milk, way too sweet, clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame." Mike, that explains your previous posting, all that grain went to your brain. Besides I thought it was already clear everything is Steve Swan's fault. -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 11:35 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! hehe must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, then milk, way too sweet, clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame On 3/31/09, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > Writing in capitols does the old tinnitus no good at all. Tone it down a tad old chap. > Steve. > In a message dated 31/03/2009 16:02:50 GMT Standard Time, judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM writes: > ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 31 14:57:51 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 12:57:51 -0600 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <3321353600.49620859@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: in fact you're not, she lifted that idea right straight off me brain as well now she's playing the iPod thing as a tech issue when she knows mine was having the inside knowledge that StevenProlific Terrific had nil to do with her getting one, suddenly, out of the blue God bless her mixed up world, when it came to doctors poking holes in dental dams I just had to excuse myself to go back to bed where I'm headed now love her but until my money comes in I need meat, the granola s at cks ps-as we yanks say, awesome about your newfound quoting mary, keep it up, good for you oh god, real player message box is popping up, I REALLY don't need this my bad karma made me scratch my new aluminum sink bye On 3/31/09, Steve Swann wrote: > > I'm not sure I should be blamed for Coleman powdering and snorting his Caps > Lock key! Steve > -----Original Message----- > From: mary > Date: Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 12:36 pm > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: > BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, M.C. writes, > then milk, way too sweet, clouded > the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame." Mike, that explains your > previous posting, all that grain went to your brain. Besides I thought it > was already clear everything is Steve Swan's fault. > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman > Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 11:35 AM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > hehe > must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, then milk, way too sweet, > clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame > > > > On 3/31/09, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > > > > Writing in capitols does the old tinnitus no good at all. > Tone it down a tad old chap. > > > Steve. > > > In a message dated 31/03/2009 16:02:50 GMT Standard Time, > judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM writes: > > > ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials > From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 15:15:21 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 15:15:21 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <3321353600.49620859@smtp.gmail.com> Message-ID: No, Steve, That's not your fault. Thanks for the laugh. Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Steve Swann Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 2:13 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! I'm not sure I should be blamed for Coleman powdering and snorting his Caps Lock key! Steve -----Original Message----- From: mary Date: Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 12:36 pm Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, M.C. writes, then milk, way too sweet, clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame." Mike, that explains your previous posting, all that grain went to your brain. Besides I thought it was already clear everything is Steve Swan's fault. -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 11:35 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! hehe must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, then milk, way too sweet, clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame On 3/31/09, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > Writing in capitols does the old tinnitus no good at all. Tone it down a tad old chap. > Steve. > In a message dated 31/03/2009 16:02:50 GMT Standard Time, judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM writes: > ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 15:35:29 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 15:35:29 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903311157u22fdbbaen34739d69a32b7cf6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: "dental dams," ak! Not in my reality thanks. I was telling you about cases of corrupt doctors. You need to chill. How 'bout damn dentists. That brings to mind the beginning to Valium Ten, that was a freak out when I heard that. That drill, sick. Sleep well, Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 2:58 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! in fact you're not, she lifted that idea right straight off me brain as well now she's playing the iPod thing as a tech issue when she knows mine was having the inside knowledge that StevenProlific Terrific had nil to do with her getting one, suddenly, out of the blue God bless her mixed up world, when it came to doctors poking holes in dental dams I just had to excuse myself to go back to bed where I'm headed now love her but until my money comes in I need meat, the granola s at cks ps-as we yanks say, awesome about your newfound quoting mary, keep it up, good for you oh god, real player message box is popping up, I REALLY don't need this my bad karma made me scratch my new aluminum sink bye On 3/31/09, Steve Swann wrote: > > I'm not sure I should be blamed for Coleman powdering and snorting his Caps > Lock key! Steve > -----Original Message----- > From: mary > Date: Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 12:36 pm > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List To: > BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, M.C. writes, > then milk, way too sweet, clouded > the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame." Mike, that explains your > previous posting, all that grain went to your brain. Besides I thought it > was already clear everything is Steve Swan's fault. > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman > Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 11:35 AM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > hehe > must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, then milk, way too sweet, > clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame > > > > On 3/31/09, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > > > > Writing in capitols does the old tinnitus no good at all. > Tone it down a tad old chap. > > > Steve. > > > In a message dated 31/03/2009 16:02:50 GMT Standard Time, > judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM writes: > > > ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials > From albert at CELLSUM.COM Tue Mar 31 17:14:09 2009 From: albert at CELLSUM.COM (Albert Bouchard) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:14:09 -0400 Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Mary: Anyone can figure out relative pitch by using do re me fa so la ti do. The two pitches outside of those scale tones have distinctive vibes: flatted second like many Metallica songs ie. Enter Sandman, which also has the other tone outside the regular scale - the ever popular flatted fifth, the devil's tone, the tritone, ie. the intro to the song Black Sabbath. Everything else is variations on the major and minor scales. Certain chord progressions are distinctive - the most common of all is simply 1 5 (do so) 1 6 4 5 Heart and Soul - 1 7 6 7 Reaper and you can learn to recognize these as well. Now you know everything you need to know about music theory. Al On Mar 29, 2009, at 11:45 AM, mary wrote: > Hi JR, > From all that I've heard from my last posting, I'm inclined to think > that > relative pitch can be learned, with ear training and all that, and I > guess > one can get to a point of having nearly perfect pitch, however, my > friend > with perfect pitch is amazing. There's a story in her family that > at the > age of 2 she played "Happy Birthday" for her aunt. Since I listen > to so > much music I want to understand it better, and we're probably on > the same > level with our musical abilities. Me, in a band, ha! That's not > going to > happen. Thanks for your response. I have been away from the > computer for a > bit since the posting, so if I'm lax in responding to anyone, it's > not for > lack of interest, I still have to go all the way back to Friday. > Time for > the Way Back Machine, is the professor their? > > Mary > > Mary about > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of John Rennie > Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 4:19 AM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), > > > I've never met anyone with perfect pitch, in the sense that I could > play a random note and they could tell me what note it was. Chords > are different, because not all major chords sound the same, and I > have friends who can tell what key music is in. It's something to do > with the spacing between the notes in the scale I think. > > I must admit I can't tell what a chord is just by hearing it, and I > can't tell what key music is in. I can tell major from minor chords > and I can mostly recognise intervals, though not always. I guess I'd > be unwise to try for a career in music :-) It's doesn't stop me > enojing it though! > > JR > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > ] On > Behalf Of mary > Sent: 27 March 2009 17:50 > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), > > Hi friends, > > I get very frustrated when I listen to music with someone and they can > tell the chords automatically. I have a relatively good sense of > pitch, and a little grounding in theory, I can pick an A note out of > the air on key. Do you think perfect pitch is innate, or can be > learned. I have 2 blind friends, and 1 is totally convinced that if I > don't have it, I never will. Another, says it can be learned. Of > course, I'm inclined to believe the latter. If I'm told that I can't > do something, my Irish blood comes through and I'll do whatever I can > to prove otherwise. I'd be very interested in what all you fine > musicians, and other listeners like me, have to say. > > Many thanks, > > Mary > From insect.brain at GMAIL.COM Tue Mar 31 17:19:03 2009 From: insect.brain at GMAIL.COM (mike coleman) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 15:19:03 -0600 Subject: (OFF) If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! Message-ID: hehe (responding to mary below) yes, it occured to me my flaming knew no end trying to be humorous at your expense done thought I had "perfect bitch" I was listneing to the "Oscillations" CD last night, and in keeping with things I've said before, the Space Ritual 2 tracks sounded more tinny or treble-ish than the other incarnations getting rotations lately, and I feel sure some parts were slightly different I love that drill (on valium ten), I love Nik's whistle on Zones or whoever's it is, and I still say Dangerous Vision is far and away the album highlight also, the granola wasn't that bad after the sugar shock of the first bowl, and the ever dreaded cloudy milk but I don't recommend shoveling 5 or so bowls in a night at least it was a clean gas Before reading the Steven Wilson article, I had just recommended to my friend that somebody put out an LP of purely "posed" instruments, where you may hear the noise of them being brought in and out and even accisdentally being bumped, but nothing actually getting played in the usual sense then lst all the equpiment, etc Hi-Art that was just female contraceptives then, sorry On 3/31/09, mary wrote: > > "dental > dams," ak! Not in my reality thanks. I was telling you about cases of > corrupt doctors. You need to chill. How 'bout damn dentists. That brings > to mind the beginning to Valium Ten, that was a freak out when I heard > that. > That drill, sick. > > Sleep well, > > Mary > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman > Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 2:58 PM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > in fact you're not, she lifted that idea right straight off me brain as > well > now she's playing the iPod thing as a tech issue when she knows mine was > having the inside knowledge that StevenProlific Terrific had nil to do with > her getting one, suddenly, out of the blue > God bless her mixed up world, when it came to doctors poking holes in > dental > dams I just had to excuse myself to go back to bed > where I'm headed now > love her but until my money comes in I need meat, the granola s at cks > ps-as we yanks say, awesome about your newfound quoting mary, keep it up, > good for you > oh god, real player message box is popping up, I REALLY don't need this > my bad karma made me scratch my new aluminum sink > bye > > > On 3/31/09, Steve Swann wrote: > > > > I'm not sure I should be blamed for Coleman powdering and snorting his > Caps > > Lock key! Steve > > -----Original Message----- > > From: mary > > Date: Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 12:36 pm > > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > To: > > BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > > > must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, M.C. writes, > > then milk, way too sweet, clouded > > the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame." Mike, that explains your > > previous posting, all that grain went to your brain. Besides I thought > it > > was already clear everything is Steve Swan's fault. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman > > Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 11:35 AM > > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > > > > hehe > > must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, then milk, way too sweet, > > clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame > > > > > > > > On 3/31/09, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > > > > > > > Writing in capitols does the old tinnitus no good at all. > > Tone it down a tad old chap. > > > > > Steve. > > > > > In a message dated 31/03/2009 16:02:50 GMT Standard Time, > > judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM writes: > > > > > ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials > > > From bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM Tue Mar 31 17:22:15 2009 From: bewlay68 at YAHOO.COM (gary shindler) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 14:22:15 -0700 Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ____________________ You and Joe are both music teachers, Al? ________________________________ From: Albert Bouchard To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 4:14:09 PM Subject: Re: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), Hi Mary: Anyone can figure out relative pitch by using do re me fa so la ti do. The two pitches outside of those scale tones have distinctive vibes: flatted second like many Metallica songs ie. Enter Sandman, which also has the other tone outside the regular scale - the ever popular flatted fifth, the devil's tone, the tritone, ie. the intro to the song Black Sabbath. Everything else is variations on the major and minor scales. Certain chord progressions are distinctive - the most common of all is simply 1 5 (do so) 1 6 4 5 Heart and Soul - 1 7 6 7 Reaper and you can learn to recognize these as well. Now you know everything you need to know about music theory. Al On Mar 29, 2009, at 11:45 AM, mary wrote: > Hi JR, > From all that I've heard from my last posting, I'm inclined to think that > relative pitch can be learned, with ear training and all that, and I guess > one can get to a point of having nearly perfect pitch, however, my friend > with perfect pitch is amazing.? There's a story in her family that at the > age of 2 she played "Happy Birthday" for her aunt.? Since I listen to so > much music I want to understand it better, and we're? probably on the same > level with our musical abilities.? Me, in a band, ha!? That's not going to > happen.? Thanks for your response.? I have been away from the computer for a > bit since the posting, so if I'm lax in responding to anyone, it's not for > lack of interest, I still have to go all the way back to Friday.? Time for > the Way Back Machine, is the professor their? > > Mary > > Mary about > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of John Rennie > Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 4:19 AM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), > > > I've never met anyone with perfect pitch, in the sense that I could > play a random note and they could tell me what note it was. Chords > are different, because not all major chords sound the same, and I > have friends who can tell what key music is in. It's something to do > with the spacing between the notes in the scale I think. > > I must admit I can't tell what a chord is just by hearing it, and I > can't tell what key music is in. I can tell major from minor chords > and I can mostly recognise intervals, though not always. I guess I'd > be unwise to try for a career in music :-) It's doesn't stop me > enojing it though! > > JR > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On > Behalf Of mary > Sent: 27 March 2009 17:50 > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), > > Hi friends, > > I get very frustrated when I listen to music with someone and they can > tell the chords automatically.? I have a relatively good sense of > pitch, and a little grounding in theory, I can pick an A note out of > the air on key.? Do you think perfect pitch is innate, or can be > learned. I have 2 blind friends, and 1 is totally convinced that if I > don't have it, I never will.? Another, says it can be learned.? Of > course, I'm inclined to believe the latter.? If I'm told that I can't > do something, my Irish blood comes through and I'll do whatever I can > to prove otherwise. I'd be very interested in what all you fine > musicians, and other listeners like me, have to say. > > Many thanks, > > Mary > From cea at CARLAZ.COM Tue Mar 31 11:18:24 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 10:18:24 -0500 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <20090328090321.M28983@dehulst.nl> Message-ID: On 28 Mar 2009, at 04:03, Arjan Hulsebos wrote: > On Sat, 28 Mar 2009 00:21:38 -0600, Alex S. Garcia wrote >> I would totally agree with this if THAT was what we were sold in >> stores. >> Meaning if I buy a CD and what I'm buying is actually the 1s and >> 0s (ie >> the music, not the CD itself) then if I lose it or it wears out or >> whatnot, I should be able to get another copy without paying for it. > > I'm not too sure about this. If my car wears out, I don't get a free > replacement, either. Yeah, my socks are always wearing out and nobody gives me free replacements or upgrades either! ;) BTW, still pretty much on this topic: Does anyone know any good online articles that deal with this controversy regarding downloading and the future of the music industry. I teach English at a university down here, and I'm always looking for interesting topics on current issues that I can take into the classroom to get people to read and argue about. :) The students are young, hip to the internet and the contemporary music scene at home and abroad, but many are also doing business-oriented degrees, so this is a great kind of topic to provoke discussion. Anyone got any favorite articles on the topic? Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From cea at CARLAZ.COM Tue Mar 31 19:06:59 2009 From: cea at CARLAZ.COM (Carl Edlund Anderson) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 18:06:59 -0500 Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 31 Mar 2009, at 16:14, Albert Bouchard wrote: > Anyone can figure out relative pitch by using do re me fa so la ti do. "... a very good place to start ...." :) Cheers, Carl, who must always remember not to confuse _The Sound of Music_ with _The Flying Nun_ -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 20:06:46 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 20:06:46 -0400 Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Al, Thanks, It's going to take me a bit of time to digest all you've told me, but I get the idea. I've got basic intervals down, now I'm starting to integrate the sharps and flats. I imagine I'll make my way through all that all right. I'm sure Indian music would be a lot more difficult, I am only dealing with 12 tones. A friend told me to check out ear training programs on-line. Learning some of the complex time changes like King Crimson or Zappa use is going to be interesting. A friend asked me why I'm bothering to learn all this, I just want to know, another way to expand my mind. Thanks for the feedback, I really appreciate the condensed theory course. All the best to you, Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Albert Bouchard Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 5:14 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), Hi Mary: Anyone can figure out relative pitch by using do re me fa so la ti do. The two pitches outside of those scale tones have distinctive vibes: flatted second like many Metallica songs ie. Enter Sandman, which also has the other tone outside the regular scale - the ever popular flatted fifth, the devil's tone, the tritone, ie. the intro to the song Black Sabbath. Everything else is variations on the major and minor scales. Certain chord progressions are distinctive - the most common of all is simply 1 5 (do so) 1 6 4 5 Heart and Soul - 1 7 6 7 Reaper and you can learn to recognize these as well. Now you know everything you need to know about music theory. Al On Mar 29, 2009, at 11:45 AM, mary wrote: > Hi JR, > From all that I've heard from my last posting, I'm inclined to think > that > relative pitch can be learned, with ear training and all that, and I > guess > one can get to a point of having nearly perfect pitch, however, my > friend > with perfect pitch is amazing. There's a story in her family that > at the > age of 2 she played "Happy Birthday" for her aunt. Since I listen > to so > much music I want to understand it better, and we're probably on > the same > level with our musical abilities. Me, in a band, ha! That's not > going to > happen. Thanks for your response. I have been away from the > computer for a > bit since the posting, so if I'm lax in responding to anyone, it's > not for > lack of interest, I still have to go all the way back to Friday. > Time for > the Way Back Machine, is the professor their? > > Mary > > Mary about > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of John Rennie > Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 4:19 AM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), > > > I've never met anyone with perfect pitch, in the sense that I could > play a random note and they could tell me what note it was. Chords > are different, because not all major chords sound the same, and I > have friends who can tell what key music is in. It's something to do > with the spacing between the notes in the scale I think. > > I must admit I can't tell what a chord is just by hearing it, and I > can't tell what key music is in. I can tell major from minor chords > and I can mostly recognise intervals, though not always. I guess I'd > be unwise to try for a career in music :-) It's doesn't stop me > enojing it though! > > JR > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > ] On > Behalf Of mary > Sent: 27 March 2009 17:50 > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), > > Hi friends, > > I get very frustrated when I listen to music with someone and they can > tell the chords automatically. I have a relatively good sense of > pitch, and a little grounding in theory, I can pick an A note out of > the air on key. Do you think perfect pitch is innate, or can be > learned. I have 2 blind friends, and 1 is totally convinced that if I > don't have it, I never will. Another, says it can be learned. Of > course, I'm inclined to believe the latter. If I'm told that I can't > do something, my Irish blood comes through and I'll do whatever I can > to prove otherwise. I'd be very interested in what all you fine > musicians, and other listeners like me, have to say. > > Many thanks, > > Mary > From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 21:07:03 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 21:07:03 -0400 Subject: (OFF) If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: <17d80c610903311419g144d46ar4d111057f393a0c0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Mike Coleman writes (with a typo, caught ya), I had just recommended to my friend that somebody put out an LP of purely "posed" instruments, where you may hear the noise of them being brought in and out and even accisdentally being bumped, but nothing actually getting played in the usual sense...", Chris went to see John Cage, and he did a musical performance art piece involving moving around a set of living room furniture. Since I had a migraine, I missed it. I did hear the recording, I'm sure it was better live. From my perspective, everything that's been said has been in fun, sure there maybe an edge in M.C.'s postings, it's probably because he spends a bunch of time worrying about offending me, (Ha). Relax, we're all friends. There are no flames to worry about that I'm aware of. Mike, we're dealing with 2 extremes, On 1 hand, a person who was raised in a Catholic family of 9. Due to money and the number of children I tell you of a person ignoring a headache because she thought everyone got bad ones like that and just carried on. If I'd been in a smaller family that may have been treated earlier, and never have got to the point it has. . Even though I've left the church it's left it's mark, even through stories I tell you, like the doctor who told my uninformed mother the rhythm method backward so he could deliver more babies. While you are on the other extreme, in a way, you were sort of an only child, since when you grew up your sisters were already away from home. Like for Chris, a get together at my family's place would be horrific for you for more than a few hours, at best. I don't mean to bring up things to disturb you. As you know, I believe most people would like to do the right thing in life. I had just had another roadblock put in my way to find out about my husband's death, and I was on a rant about how bad some people can be, like doctors who put money above the Hippocratic oath. She knowingly let Chris walk away from her office with the knowledge he needed antibiotics and refused to give them to him even though there was a waiting list for a dentist. The rich can afford private health care, everything else is subsidized, I've been fortunate with my own care, the so-called free care may be available, but you'll wait forever. It didn't help Chris. w We'll work on solving the world's problems off-list. I thank everyone for putting up with our banter. Mike, maybe you should keep drinking that milk, if that gas is so clean you may have your own free energy source, and 5 bowls is at least 3 too many, but, I know, you'll be all right. They're always making food products for those who want to eat, for folks like you who consider food a royal pain, they should make a food pill, or something. A hit a day, and you get all your nutrients, no, I'm not talking about speed. For me, that would be terrible, food with no taste, how depressing. I don't have "Oscillations" Concerning the SR Vol. 2, I thought the mix was too harsh when it first came out. With whatever subsequent remixes have gone on, the quality is much better. Although Levitation was an all digital recording, I didn't notice the same sort of harshness, that's the only way I can describe the early digital recordings. I remember at Dead shows they played some of the Beatles albums when they were first transferred to disc and they were awful. I played SR vol. 2 about a week ago, and it was real nice hearing it again. Hawkwind keep us on our toes with remixes, extra tracks and all that, and Mike, you have a lot of intelligent things to say about collecting, among other things and your postings are usually well thought out, and always a lot of fun. It would be nice if an album could be released compiling some of the rarities, I don't think that would make them any less collectible to those who are really into it. I've got a few cool singles stashed away that have been played once or twice to record on tape, ha! Finding that tape is going to be um, interesting. Later, Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 5:19 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: (OFF) If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! hehe (responding to mary below) yes, it occured to me my flaming knew no end trying to be humorous at your expense done thought I had "perfect bitch" I was listneing to the "Oscillations" CD last night, and in keeping with things I've said before, the Space Ritual 2 tracks sounded more tinny or treble-ish than the other incarnations getting rotations lately, and I feel sure some parts were slightly different I love that drill (on valium ten), I love Nik's whistle on Zones or whoever's it is, and I still say Dangerous Vision is far and away the album highlight also, the granola wasn't that bad after the sugar shock of the first bowl, and the ever dreaded cloudy milk but I don't recommend shoveling 5 or so bowls in a night at least it was a clean gas Before reading the Steven Wilson article, I had just recommended to my friend that somebody put out an LP of purely "posed" instruments, where you may hear the noise of them being brought in and out and even accisdentally being bumped, but nothing actually getting played in the usual sense then lst all the equpiment, etc Hi-Art that was just female contraceptives then, sorry On 3/31/09, mary wrote: > > "dental > dams," ak! Not in my reality thanks. I was telling you about cases of > corrupt doctors. You need to chill. How 'bout damn dentists. That brings > to mind the beginning to Valium Ten, that was a freak out when I heard > that. > That drill, sick. > > Sleep well, > > Mary > > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman > Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 2:58 PM > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > in fact you're not, she lifted that idea right straight off me brain as > well > now she's playing the iPod thing as a tech issue when she knows mine was > having the inside knowledge that StevenProlific Terrific had nil to do with > her getting one, suddenly, out of the blue > God bless her mixed up world, when it came to doctors poking holes in > dental > dams I just had to excuse myself to go back to bed > where I'm headed now > love her but until my money comes in I need meat, the granola s at cks > ps-as we yanks say, awesome about your newfound quoting mary, keep it up, > good for you > oh god, real player message box is popping up, I REALLY don't need this > my bad karma made me scratch my new aluminum sink > bye > > > On 3/31/09, Steve Swann wrote: > > > > I'm not sure I should be blamed for Coleman powdering and snorting his > Caps > > Lock key! Steve > > -----Original Message----- > > From: mary > > Date: Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 12:36 pm > > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > To: Reply- BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > To: > > BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > > > must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, M.C. writes, > > then milk, way too sweet, clouded > > the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame." Mike, that explains your > > previous posting, all that grain went to your brain. Besides I thought > it > > was already clear everything is Steve Swan's fault. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of mike coleman > > Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 11:35 AM > > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > > Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! > > > > > > hehe > > must be the damned granola....$4.49 a box, then milk, way too sweet, > > clouded the milk, gave me gas, and mary is to blame > > > > > > > > On 3/31/09, StevePXR5 at aol.com wrote: > > > > > > > Writing in capitols does the old tinnitus no good at all. > > Tone it down a tad old chap. > > > > > Steve. > > > > > In a message dated 31/03/2009 16:02:50 GMT Standard Time, > > judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM writes: > > > > > ...and i really wish you'd stop shouting tex...demned colonials > > > From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 21:17:06 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 21:17:06 -0400 Subject: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Carl, Having known you, I'm sure your classes are very informative and enjoyable. I've learned a lot from this thread. Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Carl Edlund Anderson Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 11:18 AM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: If you pirate music, you're downloading communism! On 28 Mar 2009, at 04:03, Arjan Hulsebos wrote: > On Sat, 28 Mar 2009 00:21:38 -0600, Alex S. Garcia wrote >> I would totally agree with this if THAT was what we were sold in >> stores. >> Meaning if I buy a CD and what I'm buying is actually the 1s and >> 0s (ie >> the music, not the CD itself) then if I lose it or it wears out or >> whatnot, I should be able to get another copy without paying for it. > > I'm not too sure about this. If my car wears out, I don't get a free > replacement, either. Yeah, my socks are always wearing out and nobody gives me free replacements or upgrades either! ;) BTW, still pretty much on this topic: Does anyone know any good online articles that deal with this controversy regarding downloading and the future of the music industry. I teach English at a university down here, and I'm always looking for interesting topics on current issues that I can take into the classroom to get people to read and argue about. :) The students are young, hip to the internet and the contemporary music scene at home and abroad, but many are also doing business-oriented degrees, so this is a great kind of topic to provoke discussion. Anyone got any favorite articles on the topic? Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/ From maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET Tue Mar 31 21:37:14 2009 From: maryann.sullivan1 at VERIZON.NET (mary) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 21:37:14 -0400 Subject: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), In-Reply-To: <9757C902-0528-4008-873C-815B5EEEBF97@carlaz.com> Message-ID: "Anyone can figure out relative pitch by using do re me fa so la ti do," I can do that, often I lose the actual A note if I have other distractions. I try to equate songs with chords, "Golden Void," starts on E for example so if I want that note I hit the first note from the song. My friend can always hit an A at whatever frequency that is. I really wish blind people were taught physics when I went to high school. Chris tried to teach me some partial physics, but I don't know my neutrons from protons, and when you throw in the weak and strong forces, and all that, it's too much information too fast. For him, it was nothing. Anyone who knew Chris probably remembers, you could ask him a simple question and he'd give you an answer, but often you'd get a lot more information than expected. The correlation between math. physics, and music is fascinating to me. "Carl, who must always remember not to confuse _The Sound of Music_ with _The Flying Nun," Now, now, Carl, none of that. Your friend, Mary -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET]On Behalf Of Carl Edlund Anderson Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 7:07 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: Re: Perfect Pitch, (better edited, (my apologies), On 31 Mar 2009, at 16:14, Albert Bouchard wrote: > Anyone can figure out relative pitch by using do re me fa so la ti do. "... a very good place to start ...." :) Cheers, Carl, who must always remember not to confuse _The Sound of Music_ with _The Flying Nun_ -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/