From michael_1968 at OZEMAIL.COM.AU Tue Jun 1 00:58:47 2004 From: michael_1968 at OZEMAIL.COM.AU (MiChAeL "aLiEn DrEaM" bLaCkMaN) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 14:28:47 +0930 Subject: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows Message-ID: because the yanks think their format is da shit and so do we and no one will change lol and I'd say if anyones gonna make a change it will have to be "us" pal format to ntsc cause I doubt very much that "they" will budge - make that 100% sure "they" won't...... ----- Original Message ----- From: "deadearnest" To: Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 2004 6:21 AM Subject: Re: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows > Just a quick one on this - I spoke to the label before the DVD came out and > they said that because it's region free or region 0 that it will play on > anything - "great" I thought - "we can send out all the American ones". Then > I had a conversation with Lars from the label about the possibility of > putting it out as an NTSC version but apparently the economics of the > situation didn't add up. But then I thought "if it's supposed to play on > anything, why's he worrying about an NTSC edition?" I then spoke with Dave > who owns CDS and is a good deal more technically convesant on these things > than I am, and he said that, region 0 or not, if it's region0 PAL, it won't > play on DVD's set up for region 0 NTSC!!! It's at this pointmy head > exploded. > All I can say is that, for the supposed global economy we are supposed to > inhabit, for the supposed technological age in which we live, why the > sodding hell we STILL have this stupid intercontinental format thing going > on, is beyond me. The manufacturers of the whole shooting match > want.......errrrrrr........shooting!! > Andy G. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Monday, May 31, 2004 11:25 AM > Subject: Re: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows > > > > I thank the two people who replied saying that the PAL "Out of the > > Shadows" should play on my NTSC player. Unfortunately it doesn't; nor > > does it on my sister-in-law's or her son's - on mine it says (when the > > disc is placed in): "This type of disc cannot be played. Please insert a > > different one." , on my wife's sister's it reads: "Disc error" and on > > her son's it reads the same as mine. These displays are exactly the same > > on all three for another concert DVD I have when the PAL side is entered > > (the other side is NTSC and plays just fine - this would have been a > > nice idea for the Hawkwind disc). > > > > I hope he does not mind me mentioning this but when I bought the disc > > from Phil at CDS it was he who said that many North Americans were > > getting a friendly computer savvy friend to make an NTSC disc for them. > > My disability severely limits my ability to socialize, so I thought I'd > > take Phil's suggestion and see if I could find a "friend" on this list > > would be kind enough to help me with this. > > > > Thank you for your patience and it would be most appreciated if *anyone* > > could help. > > Thanks again, > > Jonathan > > (Vancouver, B.C.) > From colin at CALLEN18.FREESERVE.CO.UK Tue Jun 1 05:20:45 2004 From: colin at CALLEN18.FREESERVE.CO.UK (Colin J Allen) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 05:20:45 -0400 Subject: Galactic Patrol Alert! CDR's on Ebay! Message-ID: Target destroyed On Mon, 31 May 2004 16:08:51 +0100, M Holmes wrote: >Enforcer Colin to Bridge. Phasers on Kill: > > >http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&category=307&item=4015902933&rd=1 > >http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&category=307&item=4015900032&rd=1 > >http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&category=307&item=4015898975&rd=1 > >FoFP From keith.henderson at PSI.CH Tue Jun 1 05:27:31 2004 From: keith.henderson at PSI.CH (Henderson Keith) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 11:27:31 +0200 Subject: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows Message-ID: Andy G. ?rgert sich ?ber das Folgende... >All I can say is that, for the supposed global economy we are supposed to >inhabit, for the supposed technological age in which we live, why the >sodding hell we STILL have this stupid intercontinental format thing going >on, is beyond me. The manufacturers of the whole shooting match >want.......errrrrrr........shooting!! As Paul alluded to...I believe the problem stems fundamentally from the power difference between the US and Europe. Not so much the voltage, but rather the frequency. Again, I'm speaking as a half-wit layperson, but I've understood it to be the case that the scan rate of a PAL TV matches in some way the 50 Hz frequency of the AC power.* And likewise 60 Hz for NTSC TVs. And I think maybe even the total number of pixel lines is different between PAL and NTSC TVs. So, as it's an inherited problem that will only disappear once the world has left analogue in the dust (those vinyl nuts notwithstanding) :) there's not many folks alive that I (or we) can blame. *does this give a sharper picture, or eliminate 'resonance' patterns, if the frequency matches? I would *guess* this must be the case... This was why I didn't believe my nephew could 'magically' hack his DVD player to play PAL, at least without distortion due to the scan rate problem. But that was before I learned that these 'one-size-fits-all' chips were found in many American DVD players, and that they *do* have the format-conversion capability in place, if you just know how to activate it. One question I have though...why don't they have *all* the features of these chips activated for every model? My guess is that it would be harder for them to sell more expensive models, if the cheaper ones had all the same features. Which means the companies are basically making their products "inferior" intentionally, so that you will pay more for something that isn't really any more advanced, but just has been 'turned' on. OK, I'm a professional cynic when it comes to mega-corporations, but what other answer is there? Grakkl (FAA) From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Tue Jun 1 06:23:23 2004 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 11:23:23 +0100 Subject: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows In-Reply-To: Paul Mather's message of Mon, 31 May 2004 17:27:18 -0400 Message-ID: Paul Mather writes: > I guess when analogue TV broadcasts are phased out, this will no > longer be an issue, as those that want to watch TV will be forced to > upgrade. ;-) I presume that my VCR's and my imminently new DVD/HD recordeer (with PAL TV tuner) will then have problems because the broadcasts will be digital. Presumably to make each device useful again, I'll have to buy a digital tuner for each which converts the signal for Auxiliary input to these devices, and I'll then need to increase the numbers of remote controls from 12 to 17. I can see a few folks being cross about this. FoFP From paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU Tue Jun 1 09:51:54 2004 From: paul at GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU (Paul Mather) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 09:51:54 -0400 Subject: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, Jun 01, 2004 at 11:27:31AM +0200, Henderson Keith wrote: => As Paul alluded to...I believe the problem stems fundamentally from => the power difference between the US and Europe. Not so much the voltage, => but rather the frequency. Again, I'm speaking as a half-wit layperson, => but I've understood it to be the case that the scan rate of a PAL TV => matches in some way the 50 Hz frequency of the AC power.* And likewise => 60 Hz for NTSC TVs. And I think maybe even the total number of pixel => lines is different between PAL and NTSC TVs. Yes, the number of scan lines differs too between NTSC and PAL: 525 lines for NTSC and 625 for PAL. (This means you get greater spatial resolution with PAL, but greater temporal resolution with NTSC due to its higher field rate. Given that film is shot at 24 fps, I'd take the increased spatial resolution of PAL, personally...) But, not only that, the way the picture is encoded is different between the two systems (leading some to say NTSC = "Never Twice the Same Colour" and PAL = "Perfection At Last!":). And, amongst other things, PAL allocates more signal bandwidth to luminance than chrominance, which, given the human eye is more sensitive to luminance than chrominance differences, can yield perceptually better picture quality with PAL. This different encoding of the analogue TV signal is a big reason why you can't take analogue programme material on a common carrier like a VHS tape and play it on the "other" format VCR. Even though the tape is physically the same, the way the picture is encoded is different (and gibberish). The same goes for DVDs. If the DVD is modulating the output analogue picture for a PAL TV, this will be "gibberish" to the demodulation circuitry of a NTSC TV (and vice versa). The analogue output of the DVD player has to be speaking a compatible "language" that the viewing TV understands. (Some DVD players are smart enough to be "multi-lingual" in this respect.) => *does this give a sharper picture, or eliminate 'resonance' patterns, => if the frequency matches? I would *guess* this must be the case... Not that I'm an expert, but I believe it does eliminate resonance patterns (rolling hum bars) and gets rid of flicker problems with TV cameras in the studio. => One question I have though...why don't they have *all* the features of => these chips activated for every model? My guess is that it would be => harder for them to sell more expensive models, if the cheaper ones had => all the same features. Which means the companies are basically making => their products "inferior" intentionally, so that you will pay more for => something that isn't really any more advanced, but just has been 'turned' => on. OK, I'm a professional cynic when it comes to mega-corporations, => but what other answer is there? The reason the cheaper models have all the functionality built in (but selectively enabled) is because it's cheaper for, say, a Far-East DVD player manufacturer to design and build a single unit they can mass-produce out the wazoo and sell in all the world markets (Europe, North America, Asia, etc.) than to have several specialised units that can only be sold in a particular geographic area. It's a matter of economies of scale. I believe there are several reasons they don't enable all the features. One reason is legal compliance. For example, it may be legal to disable macrovision in some countries but not others, so obviously they'd have to enable macrovision in those countries that had it as a legal requirement. Big corporations may also be more afraid of being sued if they make it easier for the end-user to defeat said legal requirements, e.g., changing the region code, etc., so they may "lock down" that kind of feature in hardware rather than making it programmable (mutable) via software. The other main reason would be to cut down on pilot error. If it were easy to, say, switch to PAL-encoded output, then there'd be lots more people messing up their units and losing picture on their NTSC TVs by playing around with the settings. I believe that's why a lot of the features are accessible only via these hidden "engineer" codes. They're ostensibly "for experts only." Cheers, Paul. e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." --- Frank Vincent Zappa From maxine.wesley at PORT.AC.UK Tue Jun 1 11:07:01 2004 From: maxine.wesley at PORT.AC.UK (Maxine Wesley) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 16:07:01 +0100 Subject: off: One eyed Bishops & Daevid Allen.. Message-ID: Tuesday 15th June Mike Bishop, from the American psychedelic band The One Eyed Bishops pays a rare visit to these shores, stopping off at The R.M.A. to play a gig accompanied by some special guests, including Kev Ellis from Magick Khat and also bass player for Top Topham's present band. (ex- Yardbirds). Expect an eclectic and strangely euphoric evening. also tonight - 1st June there is Daevid Allen and Dan Reev Baker at the same venue: The RMA club, Cromwell road, Southsea Portsmouth - admission free i believe. regards Maxine From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Tue Jun 1 11:14:07 2004 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 16:14:07 +0100 Subject: Glasters Message-ID: I see Space Ritual are lined up for the Avalon Field. Also "Six By Seven". Could this be another Hawkwind cover band? FoFP From keith.henderson at PSI.CH Tue Jun 1 12:05:57 2004 From: keith.henderson at PSI.CH (Henderson Keith) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 18:05:57 +0200 Subject: Glasters Message-ID: Mike asked... >I see Space Ritual are lined up for the Avalon Field. Also "Six By >Seven". Could this be another Hawkwind cover band? I just looked them up on the internet. The short answer is 'no.' They have a 5-year (plus) history of original works, that I guess are in the neighborhood of psychedelic music, but not really Hawkwind-like. e.g. Mogwai, Radiohead, gybe!, etc. are listed as 'similarities.' www.sixbyseven.co.uk gets you to their homepage, via direct link. But I imagine the band's name possibly *has* come from '7x7' as I also discovered a 'spinoff' band called 'Earth the Californian Love Dream' that features the same guitarist as '6x7' (Sam Hempton), and in a long list of artists that EtCLD claim (effectively) as influences, Hawkwind is mentioned. And indeed, in this online biography, they are described as "sound(ing) like Motorhead meets Pink Floyd...like Motorhead meets the Beach Boys...like Motorhead meets the Carpenters...it's all about sweetness and noise." So, if Hempton was responsible for the other band's name, it's certainly possible that it is derived from '7x7'. Though why "6" exactly? (There were five members in the original band, not six.) BTW, both bands hail from Nottingham. Grakkl (FAA) P.S. Anybody heard any of this stuff? Any good? P.P.S. Apparently, the 6x7 lead singer (Chris Olley) grew up in the Ruhr Valley, and so a few of their songs are in German. From deadearnest at BTOPENWORLD.COM Tue Jun 1 18:43:17 2004 From: deadearnest at BTOPENWORLD.COM (deadearnest) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 23:43:17 +0100 Subject: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows Message-ID: analogue TV?????I am more in the dark than I thought - I may be displaying a lamentable grasp of technology here, but I didn;t think theTV had anything to do with it - after all I get analogue and digital on my TV -sorry, but a lot of this loses me!!! Andy G ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Mather To: Sent: Monday, May 31, 2004 10:27 PM Subject: Re: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows > On Mon, May 31, 2004 at 09:51:40PM +0100, deadearnest wrote: > > => All I can say is that, for the supposed global economy we are supposed to > => inhabit, for the supposed technological age in which we live, why the > => sodding hell we STILL have this stupid intercontinental format thing going > => on, is beyond me. The manufacturers of the whole shooting match > => want.......errrrrrr........shooting!! > > The problem only occurs when trying to play digital media (DVDs) on > analogue output devices (e.g., analogue televisions). This problem > does not manifest itself when playing a DVD to a digital output device > (e.g., a multisync computer monitor). > > Don't blame the manufacturers of DVDs---blame the "golden handcuffs" > of all those old analogue TVs people still want to use on which to > show their shiny DVDs! > > It is the analogue TVs that are being finicky, and that's why DVDs are > "formatted" for a particular broadcast standard (NTSC or PAL/SECAM). > More modern analogue TVs may be less finicky (e.g., PAL TVs that can > also do a 60 Hz pseudo-PAL for showing NTSC), and some DVD players may > be more accommodating when it comes to the two TV standards, but, in > the end, some people may fall between the cracks and be left with a > DVD they can't view on their TV. > > I guess when analogue TV broadcasts are phased out, this will no > longer be an issue, as those that want to watch TV will be forced to > upgrade. ;-) > > Cheers, > > Paul. > > e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu > > "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production > deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." > --- Frank Vincent Zappa From deadearnest at BTOPENWORLD.COM Tue Jun 1 18:44:36 2004 From: deadearnest at BTOPENWORLD.COM (deadearnest) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 23:44:36 +0100 Subject: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows Message-ID: ahhhhhh............now I become a little clearer - what a weird state of affairs - and as u say (or whoever) noone's gonna budge just yet - what a state!! Andy G. ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Mather To: Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 2004 2:51 PM Subject: Re: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows > On Tue, Jun 01, 2004 at 11:27:31AM +0200, Henderson Keith wrote: > > => As Paul alluded to...I believe the problem stems fundamentally from > => the power difference between the US and Europe. Not so much the voltage, > => but rather the frequency. Again, I'm speaking as a half-wit layperson, > => but I've understood it to be the case that the scan rate of a PAL TV > => matches in some way the 50 Hz frequency of the AC power.* And likewise > => 60 Hz for NTSC TVs. And I think maybe even the total number of pixel > => lines is different between PAL and NTSC TVs. > > Yes, the number of scan lines differs too between NTSC and PAL: 525 > lines for NTSC and 625 for PAL. (This means you get greater spatial > resolution with PAL, but greater temporal resolution with NTSC due to > its higher field rate. Given that film is shot at 24 fps, I'd take > the increased spatial resolution of PAL, personally...) But, not only > that, the way the picture is encoded is different between the two > systems (leading some to say NTSC = "Never Twice the Same Colour" and > PAL = "Perfection At Last!":). And, amongst other things, PAL > allocates more signal bandwidth to luminance than chrominance, which, > given the human eye is more sensitive to luminance than chrominance > differences, can yield perceptually better picture quality with PAL. > > This different encoding of the analogue TV signal is a big reason why > you can't take analogue programme material on a common carrier like a > VHS tape and play it on the "other" format VCR. Even though the tape > is physically the same, the way the picture is encoded is different > (and gibberish). The same goes for DVDs. If the DVD is modulating > the output analogue picture for a PAL TV, this will be "gibberish" to > the demodulation circuitry of a NTSC TV (and vice versa). The > analogue output of the DVD player has to be speaking a compatible > "language" that the viewing TV understands. (Some DVD players are > smart enough to be "multi-lingual" in this respect.) > > => *does this give a sharper picture, or eliminate 'resonance' patterns, > => if the frequency matches? I would *guess* this must be the case... > > Not that I'm an expert, but I believe it does eliminate resonance > patterns (rolling hum bars) and gets rid of flicker problems with TV > cameras in the studio. > > => One question I have though...why don't they have *all* the features of > => these chips activated for every model? My guess is that it would be > => harder for them to sell more expensive models, if the cheaper ones had > => all the same features. Which means the companies are basically making > => their products "inferior" intentionally, so that you will pay more for > => something that isn't really any more advanced, but just has been 'turned' > => on. OK, I'm a professional cynic when it comes to mega-corporations, > => but what other answer is there? > > The reason the cheaper models have all the functionality built in (but > selectively enabled) is because it's cheaper for, say, a Far-East DVD > player manufacturer to design and build a single unit they can > mass-produce out the wazoo and sell in all the world markets (Europe, > North America, Asia, etc.) than to have several specialised units that > can only be sold in a particular geographic area. It's a matter of > economies of scale. > > I believe there are several reasons they don't enable all the > features. One reason is legal compliance. For example, it may be > legal to disable macrovision in some countries but not others, so > obviously they'd have to enable macrovision in those countries that > had it as a legal requirement. Big corporations may also be more > afraid of being sued if they make it easier for the end-user to defeat > said legal requirements, e.g., changing the region code, etc., so they > may "lock down" that kind of feature in hardware rather than making it > programmable (mutable) via software. > > The other main reason would be to cut down on pilot error. If it were > easy to, say, switch to PAL-encoded output, then there'd be lots more > people messing up their units and losing picture on their NTSC TVs by > playing around with the settings. I believe that's why a lot of the > features are accessible only via these hidden "engineer" codes. > They're ostensibly "for experts only." > > Cheers, > > Paul. > > e-mail: paul at gromit.dlib.vt.edu > > "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production > deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." > --- Frank Vincent Zappa From erics at TELEPRES.COM Tue Jun 1 20:56:52 2004 From: erics at TELEPRES.COM (Eric Siegerman) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 20:56:52 -0400 Subject: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows In-Reply-To: <20040601135154.GA47814@gromit.dlib.vt.edu>; from paul@GROMIT.DLIB.VT.EDU on Tue, Jun 01, 2004 at 09:51:54AM -0400 Message-ID: (I'm not an expert on this stuff either; I just pretend to be one on the Net :-) On Tue, Jun 01, 2004 at 09:51:54AM -0400, Paul Mather wrote: > On Tue, Jun 01, 2004 at 11:27:31AM +0200, Henderson Keith wrote: > => *does this give a sharper picture, or eliminate 'resonance' patterns, > => if the frequency matches? I would *guess* this must be the case... > > Not that I'm an expert, but I believe it does eliminate resonance > patterns (rolling hum bars) and gets rid of flicker problems with TV > cameras in the studio. As well, by taking the vertical-sync timing from the line frequency rather than generating it, they could save the extra components that a clock circuit would have required. Don't forget how old these standards are: the NTSC frequency and number-of-scan-line parameters were set in March 1941 (gotta like the Net!); I assume roughly the same time frame for PAL. In those days, circuitry was a *lot* more expensive than it is now -- think what the first computers looked like in the mid-40s, and extrapolate back a few years. So I don't know, but it's possible that that stupid 50- or 60-Hz clock circuit represented significant cost savings in those days. That said, I've seen what 50/60 interference looks like. It ain't pretty. A company I once worked for took our (Canadian, so NTSC-based) computer-music system (McLeyvier, in case anyone's interested in lunatic-fringe synth arcana -- http://www.synthmuseum.com/mcleyvier/mcleyvier01.html) to the Musik Messe (huge, monster, truly astounding music trade show) in Frankfurt. The McLeyviers ran fine through a step-down transformer, but the screens were basically unreadable. As I recall, it looked rather like trying to see a reflection in a still pond that someone's just heaved a rock into, but the waves were linear, not circular, and rolled slowly up the screen. (If you brought a similarly crappy PAL monitor over here, would the waves roll the other way? :-) Lars, the hardware guy who was along for the ride, pulled the power supplies out of the monitors' bases, spliced in extension cables between them and the monitors themselves, and put the supplies down on the floor. The idea was to put some distance between the A/C circuitry of the power supplies (whose output was D/C) and the monitors' video circuitry. It worked; though there was still a small amount of ripple, that extra meter of separation was enough to make the displays more than readable enough to demonstrate. (Ob-HW-Reference: I took personal time after that trip (I wasn't about to waste free airfare to Europe!), and used it to go to England in search of Hawkwind. I was stupendously lucky -- they were touring just when I was there. So that's how I got to my first two HW gigs. Winter '84 tour; Slough & Manchester.) > => One question I have though...why don't they have *all* the features of > => these chips activated for every model? My guess is that it would be > => harder for them to sell more expensive models, if the cheaper ones had > => all the same features. Which means the companies are basically making > => their products "inferior" intentionally, so that you will pay more for > => something that isn't really any more advanced, but just has been 'turned' > => on. OK, I'm a professional cynic when it comes to mega-corporations, > => but what other answer is there? > The reason the cheaper models have all the functionality built in (but > selectively enabled) is because it's cheaper for, say, a Far-East DVD > player manufacturer to design and build a single unit they can > mass-produce out the wazoo and sell in all the world markets (Europe, > North America, Asia, etc.) than to have several specialised units that > can only be sold in a particular geographic area. It's a matter of > economies of scale. Yup; standard procedure. Making two million of one chip costs a lot less than a million each of two similar, but not quite identical, chips -- specifically, the very significant design, testing, debugging, and manufacturing-setup costs of the second chip. That doesn't make it any less infuriating to us end-users, though :-( > The other main reason would be to cut down on pilot error. If it were > easy to, say, switch to PAL-encoded output, then there'd be lots more > people messing up their units and losing picture on their NTSC TVs by > playing around with the settings. I believe that's why a lot of the > features are accessible only via these hidden "engineer" codes. > They're ostensibly "for experts only." Also, perhaps this again saves them from hardware differences. (Here I'm completely guessing. It sounds plausible enough, but I really don't know much about the ins and outs of consumer-electronics manufacturing, so this paragraph is pure supposition.) To lock down the region code, you'd have to add custom circuitry like a ROM or PAL (uh, that's a different "PAL", nothing to do with the video standard) that end users can't easily mess with. But for differences like PAL/NTSC that aren't backed by legal requirements, the "engineer code" might let them manufacture absolutely identical units, then customize them for different markets after they've come off the assembly line. -- | | /\ |-_|/ > Eric Siegerman, Toronto, Ont. erics at telepres.com | | / It must be said that they would have sounded better if the singer wouldn't throw his fellow band members to the ground and toss the drum kit around during songs. - Patrick Lenneau From erics at TELEPRES.COM Tue Jun 1 21:48:22 2004 From: erics at TELEPRES.COM (Eric Siegerman) Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 21:48:22 -0400 Subject: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows In-Reply-To: <00b501c44829$d59fdfa0$8b897ad5@andy>; from deadearnest@BTOPENWORLD.COM on Tue, Jun 01, 2004 at 11:43:17PM +0100 Message-ID: On Tue, Jun 01, 2004 at 11:43:17PM +0100, deadearnest wrote: > analogue TV?????I am more in the dark than I thought - I may be displaying > a lamentable grasp of technology here, but I didn;t think theTV had anything > to do with it - after all I get analogue and digital on my TV -sorry, but a > lot of this loses me!!! You've got a set-top box for pulling in the digital, right? It probably generates a PAL (i.e. analogue) signal that your TV can understand -- the same as (so I gather from what Paul says) a DVD player does. I say "probably" because I presume that they now make TV sets that can take a digital signal directly, and you might in fact have one of those. In that case, I suppose the set-top box's main function is to decrypt the signal to make sure you can't see it unless you've paid for it. But even if your TV accepts both, most peoples' don't (i.e. any set more than a few years old), so their set-top boxes do the D-to-A conversion. Part of what makes this all so confusing is the ambiguous use of terminology. Strictly speaking, NTSC (I'll leave PAL well alone, and so limit myself to stuff I'm only half-ignorant of :-) is a standard for the analogue encoding of a television signal. I presume it includes all sorts of stuff about how the beginning of a new scan line, or of a new vertical scan, is signalled (the horizontal and vertical sync, resp.); how colour information is piggybacked onto the B&W signal in such a way that B&W TVs can ignore it; and a hundred other details. Two of those many details are that the signal to be encoded shall have 525 scan lines and 60 vertical scans per second. But people also use "NTSC" to refer to "video that's suitable for encoding into an NTSC signal" i.e. which has 525 lines and 30 frames per second (60 divided by two -- don't ask, but if you insist on asking, the short answer is "interlace") and perhaps a few other requirements. One might call such data "NTSC" even when it's still digital, and so the rest of the NTSC standard simply doesn't (yet) apply to it. Somebody who knows this stuff cold can understand immediately from context which meaning is intended. Anybody else just gets confused. Similarly "DVD" is used to refer to either the media or the player, as well as to the standard(s?) documents involved. We all do that -- "my new Hawkwind DVD" vs. "your new Panasonic DVD". But when the topic of discussion gets more technical, I for one have to read between the lines to dope out which sense is meant (and I might well guess wrong), and I'm sure a lot of people are completely lost. -- | | /\ |-_|/ > Eric Siegerman, Toronto, Ont. erics at telepres.com | | / It must be said that they would have sounded better if the singer wouldn't throw his fellow band members to the ground and toss the drum kit around during songs. - Patrick Lenneau From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Wed Jun 2 16:59:15 2004 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jon Jarrett) Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 21:59:15 +0100 Subject: HW: New album In-Reply-To: <001b01c42cae$b9cfee00$42776051@IRONDREAM> Message-ID: On Wed, 28 Apr 2004, colm mcwilliams wrote: > i knew spirit of the age was going to be on the cd but silver machine? When > did that happen? Some terrible fear that people won't buy it if there's nothing they recognise on it perhaps? I am slightly less likely to in fact, though still fairly close to 90% (though on the other hand I don't yet have Canterbury or Spaced Out and I was at both gigs... There just hasn't been money). I want new stuff, not retread live stuff, even really good retread live stuff. I kep hoping for something some other band couldn't or wouldn't have done, not just from HW but from any band I'm a fan of. Otherwise you could just follow the tribute acts. Anyway... > > I know there are lots of folks out there who won't get to see HW on the > > latest tour & who might be curious about the track listing for Take Me To > > Your Leader as quoted in the tour programme. So, here it is: > > > > Spirit Of The Age Y'see, I don't think that needs to be there either. If it's going to be the single, they can get that out first and then use the b-sides tio hook people into buying the album. Make the exclsuive track the A-side for once, rather than hide quality material away as B-sides and as a result have to clog the album with filler. Or is this just so that the fans do buy both discs whereas otherwise they might not? They still have a way to go to match Steven Wilson's marketing skills but perhaps someone is getting the idea... > > Take Me To Your Leader > > Digital Nation > > Out Here We Are > > Sunray > > String Theory > > The Reality Of Poverty > > Cyber Space > > Letter To Robert > > Silver Machine > > > > Presumably, Angela Android will still make an appearance on the SotA > single. Well, let's hope so. > > Also worth pointing out that the album cover is great. Guests are: Arthur > > Brown, Lene Lovich, Matthew Wright & Lemmy. That last name there completely slipped me by. My guess is therefore that the `Silver Machine' is that from the Wembley Arena and that therefore it will be nudging that one that kicks around on the pirate best-ofs and the _Choose Your Masques_ versions as the worst on record, Lemster not withstanding. It wasn't great and the sound was awful. But I bet that's how come Lemmy and `Silver Machine' have suddenly appeared in the planning. > > But by my reckoning, there's a whole bunch of tracks that the band > > supposedly recorded that haven't made the final track listing. These would > > be: > > > > Land Of Dreams > > Sparkles & Slide > > Population Overload That at least was on _Distant Horizons_ so I for one hope it has been let drop. > > Techno Land > > The Molecular Family > > Asylum Island > > One World Future > > Trip And forgive me, but that just sounds pretty bad. On a par with `Fantasy' from _In Your Area_. So we can hope that taste was responsible for some of these excisions maybe. > > Of course, some of these may have been retitled & *are* featured on the > > album, but I suspect most are not. Can anyone in the Hawk camp shed some > > light on these tracks & if/when/where they might appear? On Dave's next solo album I'd expect. Call me a cynic. Yours, Jon ObCD: Breitband - _Fadu und der Unterschied_ -- Jonathan Jarrett, Birkbeck College, London jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk/ejarr01 at students.bbk.ac.uk "As much as the vision of the blind man improves with the rising sun, So too does the intelligence of the fool after good advice." (Bishop Theodulf of Orleans, late-eight/early-ninth century) From iainferguson at AOL.COM Thu Jun 3 04:47:38 2004 From: iainferguson at AOL.COM (Iain Ferguson) Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 09:47:38 +0100 Subject: Glasters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: if you get the chance to se 6x7 do they are absolutely full on Bhlanga ( or however its spelt). Very Very loud, thundering Bass , strobe tastic music Henderson Keith wrote: > Mike asked... > > >I see Space Ritual are lined up for the Avalon Field. Also "Six By > >Seven". Could this be another Hawkwind cover band? > > I just looked them up on the internet. The short answer is 'no.' > They have a 5-year (plus) history of original works, that I guess are > in the neighborhood of psychedelic music, but not really Hawkwind-like. > e.g. Mogwai, Radiohead, gybe!, etc. are listed as 'similarities.' > www.sixbyseven.co.uk gets you to their homepage, via direct link. > > But I imagine the band's name possibly *has* come from '7x7' as I also > discovered a 'spinoff' band called 'Earth the Californian Love Dream' > that features the same guitarist as '6x7' (Sam Hempton), and in a long > list of artists that EtCLD claim (effectively) as influences, Hawkwind > is mentioned. And indeed, in this online biography, they are > described as > "sound(ing) like Motorhead meets Pink Floyd...like Motorhead meets the > Beach Boys...like Motorhead meets the Carpenters...it's all about > sweetness and noise." > > So, if Hempton was responsible for the other band's name, it's certainly > possible that it is derived from '7x7'. Though why "6" exactly? > (There were five members in the original band, not six.) > > BTW, both bands hail from Nottingham. > > Grakkl (FAA) > > P.S. Anybody heard any of this stuff? Any good? > > P.P.S. Apparently, the 6x7 lead singer (Chris Olley) grew up in the Ruhr > Valley, and so a few of their songs are in German. > -- Iain Ferguson Senior Technical Engineer, Networks, AOL UK AOL (UK) Ltd. 80 Hammersmith Road, London W14 8UD United Kingdom email: iainferguson at aol.com URL: www.aol.co.uk Tel: +44 (0) 117 927 8071 Fax: +44 (0) 20 7348 8007 Mobile: 44 (0) 771 266 1993 AOL UK's recommended destination for online giving: givenow.org This email, its contents and any files transmitted with it are confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee(s) only. If you are not the intended recipient, you must not copy, distribute, or take any action in reliance upon it. If you have received this email in error, please notify us immediately via telephone or fax and delete the material from your computer system. AOL (UK) Ltd is registered in England under number 03462696, with its registered office at 80 Hammersmith Road, London W14 8UD. From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Thu Jun 3 09:48:58 2004 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 14:48:58 +0100 Subject: Privateers in Space! Message-ID: An historic solstice this year? Seems like the first private spacecraft is due to go into space on June 21st. Cool looking spacecraft too! They call him Sputnik Stan. Well "Ballistic Burt" perhaps. http://www.scaled.com/projects/tierone/ Now if they could just get the price down a bit... FoFP From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Thu Jun 3 14:37:21 2004 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 19:37:21 +0100 Subject: Sing along with Judge Trev - notorious and politically dangerous rebel performer Message-ID: Glastonbury Festival 25 - 27 june Judge Trev, the notorious rebel Pagan, will be performing twice in the pedal-powered Mandala marquee in the Green Fields. Acoustic set with friends (Nik Turner etc maybe) - original material, old favourites, sixties retro etc - no rehearsals of course - he he On stage at 8pm sat and 6pm sun ..Also electric jamming with Nik Turner's Fantastic All-Stars at Lost Vagueness (Green Fields) - fri 7pm Find out more about Judge Trev and his discography at www.judgetrev.com REAL FESTIVAL MUSIC - RFM http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk Festival Listings, Festival Reviews, CDs, Video Downloads, News, Forum, Chat, Healers From erics at TELEPRES.COM Fri Jun 4 01:12:12 2004 From: erics at TELEPRES.COM (Eric Siegerman) Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2004 01:12:12 -0400 Subject: Privateers in Space! In-Reply-To: <200406031348.i53DmwJH015387@holyrood.ed.ac.uk>; from fofp@HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK on Thu, Jun 03, 2004 at 02:48:58PM +0100 Message-ID: On Thu, Jun 03, 2004 at 02:48:58PM +0100, M Holmes wrote: > An historic solstice this year? Seems like the first private spacecraft > is due to go into space on June 21st. Very cool! (And it's great to see some of that filthy M$ lucre being put to a good purpose...) The thing that inspired this project (and at least 25 others) is the Ansari X Prize -- a US$10-million prize for the first privately funded space flight (some conditions apply :-). From the X Prize web site (www.xprize.org): > Fly your name aboard the winning X PRIZE Rocket!! > [...] > Support X PRIZE with a donation of $20 or more today and you will: > > 1. Join the team that is making private spaceflight happen now > 2. Fly your name aboard the winning ANSARI X PRIZE vehicle > 3. Gain access to a special live web cast of the first ANSARI X PRIZE flight > 4. Receive our monthly electronic newsletter announcing the latest achievements and news > 5. Receive a beautiful, framable certificate via email verifying your name has flown into space I especially like #5. D. D. Harriman, eat your heart out. -- | | /\ |-_|/ > Eric Siegerman, Toronto, Ont. erics at telepres.com | | / It must be said that they would have sounded better if the singer wouldn't throw his fellow band members to the ground and toss the drum kit around during songs. - Patrick Lenneau From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Fri Jun 4 06:48:23 2004 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2004 11:48:23 +0100 Subject: Sing along with Judge Trev - notorious and politically dangerous rebel performer In-Reply-To: trev's message of Thu, 3 Jun 2004 19:37:21 +0100 Message-ID: trev writes: > Glastonbury Festival 25 - 27 june > Judge Trev, the notorious rebel Pagan, will be performing twice in the > pedal-powered Mandala marquee in the Green Fields. This has on occasion even been fofp-powered... FoFP From jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK Fri Jun 4 18:51:39 2004 From: jjarrett at CHIARK.GREENEND.ORG.UK (Jon Jarrett) Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2004 23:51:39 +0100 Subject: OFF/BOC: Nektar US/Can/London dates In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 7 May 2004, Henderson Keith wrote: > now listed online at: > http://www.nektarmusic.co.uk > > more to come (hopefully)... > > Grakkl (FAA) > > P.S. Hawkwind-related point...Tony Hill's Fiction will > open in London (if Robert Calvert's appearance on "Down to > Earth" wasn't already enough*)...BTW, really Ian A.?, you > haven't heard this, and you call yourself a Hawkwind > historian?! :) Just kidding...the "Journey..." is (finally) > in the mail...hope you like it. > > *of course, why I bothered checking out Nektar at all, > some twenty-? years ago. And of course I now realise that with the fates' characteristic inevitability, the London is the same night as the BOC gig. Now, I told both the promoter and Dean from Fiction I'd make this one, and I've never seen Nektar, though I did nearly go into a cancelled gig rebooked for someone else once by mistake, and the last time I went to see BOC instead of a space-rock rarity that was a mistake on two grounds, one being the it was Litmus and any missed Litmus gig is a terrible error, but the other being thet BOC played the worst gig I've seen them do. So I think this time I might heed the fates and head for the Underworld and not the Astoria... Yours all, Jon ObCD: Daevid Allen's Univrsity of Errors - _Ugly Music for Monica_ -- Jonathan Jarrett, Birkbeck College, London jjarrett at chiark.greenend.org.uk/ejarr01 at students.bbk.ac.uk "As much as the vision of the blind man improves with the rising sun, So too does the intelligence of the fool after good advice." (Bishop Theodulf of Orleans, late-eight/early-ninth century) From nick.lee2 at VIRGIN.NET Sun Jun 6 09:07:30 2004 From: nick.lee2 at VIRGIN.NET (Nick Lee) Date: Sun, 6 Jun 2004 14:07:30 +0100 Subject: OFF: Viv Stanshall Documentary Message-ID: Next Friday on BBC4 there's a documentary about ex-Bonzo Dog Doo Da Band man and Calvert collaborator Viv Stanshall. Apparently with lots of archive footage, promises to be interesting. Nick From wjbell at MAIL2.GIS.NET Sun Jun 6 20:23:05 2004 From: wjbell at MAIL2.GIS.NET (Warrick Bell) Date: Sun, 6 Jun 2004 20:23:05 -0400 Subject: BOC: Reaper guitar solo is 32nd coolest music moment of all time Message-ID: Hello BOC-L, The website retroCRUSH has ranked the 50 "coolest music moments of all time" (http://www.retrocrush.com/archive2004/coolsongs/index.html) and Reaper's guitar solo makes the cut at #32. There are some quite odd things on the list but it's still fairly interesting. -- Best, Warrick wjbell at mail2.gis.net http://techno.king.net/~wbell From erics at TELEPRES.COM Mon Jun 7 14:40:03 2004 From: erics at TELEPRES.COM (Eric Siegerman) Date: Mon, 7 Jun 2004 14:40:03 -0400 Subject: OFF: Viv Stanshall Documentary In-Reply-To: <003d01c44bc7$3941df90$25550352@yourpnqspyopyu>; from nick.lee2@VIRGIN.NET on Sun, Jun 06, 2004 at 02:07:30PM +0100 Message-ID: On Sun, Jun 06, 2004 at 02:07:30PM +0100, Nick Lee wrote: > [...] ex-Bonzo Dog Doo Da Band > man and Calvert collaborator Viv Stanshall. And Mike Oldfield. -- | | /\ |-_|/ > Eric Siegerman, Toronto, Ont. erics at telepres.com | | / It must be said that they would have sounded better if the singer wouldn't throw his fellow band members to the ground and toss the drum kit around during songs. - Patrick Lenneau From ma-paharper at IOPENER.NET Mon Jun 7 23:13:01 2004 From: ma-paharper at IOPENER.NET (Tim) Date: Mon, 7 Jun 2004 23:13:01 -0400 Subject: Off:Stanley Cup!! Message-ID: ...And after 12 long years uphill battle...the Tampa Bay Lightning WIN THE STANLEY CUP!!! WHOOO-HOO! tim (sorry-couldn't resist) --------- End Original Message --------- From christian.eric_mumford at CHELLO.NO Tue Jun 8 20:51:35 2004 From: christian.eric_mumford at CHELLO.NO (Christian) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 17:51:35 -0700 Subject: BOC/HW: The Oyster Band and The Cult In-Reply-To: Message-ID: That would be "Some Enchanted Evening" with mein mutter und aunt Conny of Tiamat... mrs Renate K. "Speak The Queen's English" -ZzzYaaazzDddckkum Zee Amon Duul Turkey Big Mo Jimbo From christian.eric_mumford at CHELLO.NO Tue Jun 8 21:16:27 2004 From: christian.eric_mumford at CHELLO.NO (Christian) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 18:16:27 -0700 Subject: OFF: Black Sabbath: Born Again Message-ID: I just bought this at half price, Sabbaths remnewal after the Dio/Ozzy era Sabs, though Gillan's effort beats both of them. Fine cyberpunk/metal and it is the start of TOPY and even god, namely Voi'vod, just look at how the lyrics are handwritten... awesome CD (Yes the it is the remaster) Highlights: Trashed, Stonehenge, Zero The Hero, Digital Bitch. -Elghunden, Mein Herr "Oyster", & Co. (Frou Frou in China & The Soviet Union Inheritance) From christian.eric_mumford at CHELLO.NO Tue Jun 8 21:21:44 2004 From: christian.eric_mumford at CHELLO.NO (Christian) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 18:21:44 -0700 Subject: OFF: I also want a grey stone marijuana bowl In-Reply-To: <4.2.0.58.20040608174816.009ad250@mail.chello.no> Message-ID: So I can be a Star Wars kid. Frank Weill's website is awesome and he will backstab me out of office. -Elghunden's metal rubba deck hash bowl no. 1-2-3 From michael_1968 at OZEMAIL.COM.AU Tue Jun 8 12:38:15 2004 From: michael_1968 at OZEMAIL.COM.AU (MiChAeL "aLiEn DrEaM" bLaCkMaN) Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 02:08:15 +0930 Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again Message-ID: I bought it on cassette when it was released in 19eightysomething. I liked it then at the time but back then I was living in south carolina and it was fun to upset the nervous teachers and parents of my friends with my so called heathen devil worshipping musical tastes... I guess I was about 14 or 15 at the time. If only I'd had some hawkwind then :- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christian" To: Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2004 10:46 AM Subject: OFF: Black Sabbath: Born Again > I just bought this at half price, Sabbaths remnewal after the Dio/Ozzy era > Sabs, though Gillan's effort beats both of them. Fine cyberpunk/metal and > it is the start of TOPY and even god, namely Voi'vod, just look at how the > lyrics are handwritten... awesome CD (Yes the it is the remaster) > Highlights: Trashed, Stonehenge, Zero The Hero, Digital Bitch. > > -Elghunden, Mein Herr "Oyster", & Co. (Frou Frou in China & The Soviet > Union Inheritance) > From christian.eric_mumford at CHELLO.NO Tue Jun 8 21:53:17 2004 From: christian.eric_mumford at CHELLO.NO (Christian) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 18:53:17 -0700 Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again In-Reply-To: <004b01c44d77$01496250$4cc98890@DrSBlackman> Message-ID: At 02:08 09.06.04 +0930, you wrote: >I bought it on cassette when it was released in 19eightysomething. It says 1983, so it is. > I liked >it then at the time but back then I was living in south carolina and it was >fun to upset the nervous teachers and parents of my friends with my so >called heathen devil worshipping musical tastes... I guess I was about 14 >or 15 at the time. If only I'd had some hawkwind then :- I was 11!!! Disturbing The Priest: Auntie: Nyahahwahahaaaaaa!!!! Hobbit: "aarrggh... Oh no, It's Auntie... argh, yes yes just a Hobbit" -White Loser to Marijuana >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Christian" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2004 10:46 AM >Subject: OFF: Black Sabbath: Born Again > > > > I just bought this at half price, Sabbaths remnewal after the Dio/Ozzy era > > Sabs, though Gillan's effort beats both of them. Fine cyberpunk/metal and > > it is the start of TOPY and even god, namely Voi'vod, just look at how the > > lyrics are handwritten... awesome CD (Yes the it is the remaster) > > Highlights: Trashed, Stonehenge, Zero The Hero, Digital Bitch. > > > > -Elghunden, Mein Herr "Oyster", & Co. (Frou Frou in China & The Soviet > > Union Inheritance) > > From michael_1968 at OZEMAIL.COM.AU Tue Jun 8 13:14:57 2004 From: michael_1968 at OZEMAIL.COM.AU (MiChAeL "aLiEn DrEaM" bLaCkMaN) Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 02:44:57 +0930 Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again Message-ID: 1983, so I was 15. I recall "Trashed" possibly was my favourite track. Those cool Iommi guitar rifs. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christian" To: Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2004 11:23 AM Subject: Re: Black Sabbath: Born Again > At 02:08 09.06.04 +0930, you wrote: > >I bought it on cassette when it was released in 19eightysomething. > > > It says 1983, so it is. > > > > > I liked > >it then at the time but back then I was living in south carolina and it was > >fun to upset the nervous teachers and parents of my friends with my so > >called heathen devil worshipping musical tastes... I guess I was about 14 > >or 15 at the time. If only I'd had some hawkwind then :- > > I was 11!!! > > Disturbing The Priest: > > Auntie: Nyahahwahahaaaaaa!!!! > > Hobbit: "aarrggh... Oh no, It's Auntie... argh, yes yes just a Hobbit" > > > -White Loser to Marijuana > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Christian" > >To: > >Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2004 10:46 AM > >Subject: OFF: Black Sabbath: Born Again > > > > > > > I just bought this at half price, Sabbaths remnewal after the Dio/Ozzy era > > > Sabs, though Gillan's effort beats both of them. Fine cyberpunk/metal and > > > it is the start of TOPY and even god, namely Voi'vod, just look at how the > > > lyrics are handwritten... awesome CD (Yes the it is the remaster) > > > Highlights: Trashed, Stonehenge, Zero The Hero, Digital Bitch. > > > > > > -Elghunden, Mein Herr "Oyster", & Co. (Frou Frou in China & The Soviet > > > Union Inheritance) > > > > From nexus at PANIX.COM Tue Jun 8 13:50:32 2004 From: nexus at PANIX.COM (Jeff Berry) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 13:50:32 -0400 Subject: OFF: Viv Stanshall Documentary In-Reply-To: <003d01c44bc7$3941df90$25550352@yourpnqspyopyu> from "Nick Lee" at Jun 06, 2004 02:07:30 PM Message-ID: >Next Friday on BBC4 there's a documentary about ex-Bonzo Dog Doo Da Band >man and Calvert collaborator Viv Stanshall. Apparently with lots of >archive footage, promises to be interesting. >Nick Any idea if it's going to show up on BBC America? And/or do you have a name on it so I can go searching for it? JB From nick at THECOMPLETESHEET.COM Tue Jun 8 15:56:35 2004 From: nick at THECOMPLETESHEET.COM (nick at THECOMPLETESHEET.COM) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 15:56:35 -0400 Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again Message-ID: I've long been a defender of Born Again, where so many others have not. I bought it when it came out myself. . . I was 13 or 14 at the time. And I loved it instantly. Over time, the flaws became obvious. . . especially the production, which is probably the worst I've ever heard on a major label release. And, of course, there was the outrage among both the Sabbath and Purple camps, neither of whom could accept this union. And let's not mention the whole "Stonehenge" debacle. . . although without it, "This Is Spinal Tap" would have been without one of its funniest and most enduring bits. I enjoy this album anyway. And I was reminded of "Trashed" just the other day, while reading a news item that Gillan had lost his license for driving under the influence. Oh well. Somebody actually has a fan site dedicated to the brief Gillan-Sabbath era. It's here. . . home.swipnet.se/sabbath83/ --Nick >----- ------- Original Message ------- ----- >From: "MiChAeL \"aLiEn DrEaM\" bLaCkMaN" > >To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET >Sent: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 02:44:57 > >1983, so I was 15. I recall "Trashed" possibly was >my favourite track. >Those cool Iommi guitar rifs. > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Christian" > >To: >Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2004 11:23 AM >Subject: Re: Black Sabbath: Born Again > > >> At 02:08 09.06.04 +0930, you wrote: >> >I bought it on cassette when it was released in >19eightysomething. >> >> >> It says 1983, so it is. >> >> >> >> > I liked >> >it then at the time but back then I was living >in south carolina and it >was >> >fun to upset the nervous teachers and parents of >my friends with my so >> >called heathen devil worshipping musical >tastes... I guess I was about >14 >> >or 15 at the time. If only I'd had some >hawkwind then :- >> >> I was 11!!! >> >> Disturbing The Priest: >> >> Auntie: Nyahahwahahaaaaaa!!!! >> >> Hobbit: "aarrggh... Oh no, It's Auntie... argh, >yes yes just a Hobbit" >> >> >> -White Loser to Marijuana >> >> >----- Original Message ----- >> >From: "Christian" > >> >To: >> >Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2004 10:46 AM >> >Subject: OFF: Black Sabbath: Born Again >> > >> > >> > > I just bought this at half price, Sabbaths >remnewal after the Dio/Ozzy >era >> > > Sabs, though Gillan's effort beats both of >them. Fine cyberpunk/metal >and >> > > it is the start of TOPY and even god, namely >Voi'vod, just look at how >the >> > > lyrics are handwritten... awesome CD (Yes the >it is the remaster) >> > > Highlights: Trashed, Stonehenge, Zero The >Hero, Digital Bitch. >> > > >> > > -Elghunden, Mein Herr "Oyster", & Co. (Frou >Frou in China & The Soviet >> > > Union Inheritance) >> > > >> From nick at THECOMPLETESHEET.COM Tue Jun 8 16:02:20 2004 From: nick at THECOMPLETESHEET.COM (nick at THECOMPLETESHEET.COM) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 16:02:20 -0400 Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again Message-ID: http://home.swipnet.se/sabbath83/ I forgot to mention that in the Miscellaneous section of this website, they actually have audio samples of live performances from the tour. . . including Gillan singing Children of the Grave, Black Sabbath, War Pigs and Heaven and Hell. Love it or hate it, it's pretty interesting stuff. --Nick >----- ------- Original Message ------- ----- >From: "MiChAeL \"aLiEn DrEaM\" bLaCkMaN" > >To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET >Sent: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 02:44:57 > >1983, so I was 15. I recall "Trashed" possibly was >my favourite track. >Those cool Iommi guitar rifs. > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Christian" > >To: >Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2004 11:23 AM >Subject: Re: Black Sabbath: Born Again > > >> At 02:08 09.06.04 +0930, you wrote: >> >I bought it on cassette when it was released in >19eightysomething. >> >> >> It says 1983, so it is. >> >> >> >> > I liked >> >it then at the time but back then I was living >in south carolina and it >was >> >fun to upset the nervous teachers and parents of >my friends with my so >> >called heathen devil worshipping musical >tastes... I guess I was about >14 >> >or 15 at the time. If only I'd had some >hawkwind then :- >> >> I was 11!!! >> >> Disturbing The Priest: >> >> Auntie: Nyahahwahahaaaaaa!!!! >> >> Hobbit: "aarrggh... Oh no, It's Auntie... argh, >yes yes just a Hobbit" >> >> >> -White Loser to Marijuana >> >> >----- Original Message ----- >> >From: "Christian" > >> >To: >> >Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2004 10:46 AM >> >Subject: OFF: Black Sabbath: Born Again >> > >> > >> > > I just bought this at half price, Sabbaths >remnewal after the Dio/Ozzy >era >> > > Sabs, though Gillan's effort beats both of >them. Fine cyberpunk/metal >and >> > > it is the start of TOPY and even god, namely >Voi'vod, just look at how >the >> > > lyrics are handwritten... awesome CD (Yes the >it is the remaster) >> > > Highlights: Trashed, Stonehenge, Zero The >Hero, Digital Bitch. >> > > >> > > -Elghunden, Mein Herr "Oyster", & Co. (Frou >Frou in China & The Soviet >> > > Union Inheritance) >> > > >> From RMayo19761 at AOL.COM Tue Jun 8 16:51:13 2004 From: RMayo19761 at AOL.COM (RMayo19761 at AOL.COM) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 16:51:13 EDT Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again Message-ID: In a message dated 6/8/2004 3:57:15 PM Eastern Standard Time, nick at THECOMPLETESHEET.COM writes: > And, of course, there was the outrage among both the Sabbath and Purple > camps, neither of whom could accept this union. i was waiting overnight in line for tickets to some big arena show when someone some ways behind me was playing an advance cassette copy from a boombox. it was a few days before it came out officially. the crowd surrounding that guy (myself included) was quiet during the tunes and cheered/applauded loudly between every song. in that context it sounded killer; every bit as good as the whole idea sounded 'on paper'. after buying it, i felt that, yes, the production was bad, but what i was most bothered by were the 2 long "instrumentals", which were in reality just boring bass effects experiments, pure filler, instead of one or two more actual songs. even just one more strong song would have made this a 'great album'. as it stands, it's a seriously flawed, but interesting footnote in Sabbath/Purple history. (what really infuriated me was their insistence on playing 'smoke on the water' on the tour; it sounded horrible...ugh.) (and====Bev Bevan? was no one else available?) bobm From RMayo19761 at AOL.COM Tue Jun 8 16:52:17 2004 From: RMayo19761 at AOL.COM (RMayo19761 at AOL.COM) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 16:52:17 EDT Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again Message-ID: In a message dated 6/8/2004 4:02:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, nick at THECOMPLETESHEET.COM writes: > Love it or hate it, it's pretty interesting stuff. > yes, i have an mp3 from the worcester ma show of gillan singing 'supernaut'; it's excellent!! bobm From nick.lee2 at VIRGIN.NET Tue Jun 8 17:02:05 2004 From: nick.lee2 at VIRGIN.NET (Nick Lee) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 22:02:05 +0100 Subject: OFF: Viv Stanshall Documentary In-Reply-To: <200406081750.i58HoWW18083@panix5.panix.com> Message-ID: Its entitled: "Vivian Stanshall: the Canyons of His Mind"; 10.00pm BBC4 Friday 11 June. Not a lot of the stuff on BBC4 makes it to terrestrial BBC channels (unlike BBC3), so I've no idea what the likelihood of BBC USA getting it are. Nick As an aside its followed by the first two epsiodes in a welcome re-run of 'The Prisoner'. > -----Original Message----- > From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List > [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On Behalf Of Jeff Berry > Sent: 08 June 2004 18:51 > To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET > Subject: Re: OFF: Viv Stanshall Documentary > > > >Next Friday on BBC4 there's a documentary about ex-Bonzo Dog > Doo Da Band > >man and Calvert collaborator Viv Stanshall. Apparently with lots of > >archive footage, promises to be interesting. > >Nick > > Any idea if it's going to show up on BBC America? And/or do you have > a name on it so I can go searching for it? > > JB > From jasret at MINDSPRING.COM Tue Jun 8 21:25:29 2004 From: jasret at MINDSPRING.COM (Doug Pearson) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 21:25:29 -0400 Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again Message-ID: On Tue, 8 Jun 2004 16:51:13 EDT, RMayo19761 at AOL.COM wrote: >(and====Bev Bevan? was no one else available?) Hmmmm ... I was about to launch an impassioned defense of mr. Bevan (I absolutely love his 1960s work with The Move), but after listening to the version of "Children Of The Grave" (a song by which any drummer's ability to play tom fills can be judged, since he/she needs to play them all the way through the song) on the website Nick mentioned, I have to agree that he was absolutely wrong for Black Sabbath. Still, you gotta credit a guy who can sing one of a five-part harmony while pouding out a beat (Mick Tucker being about the only other one I can think of, and his band was only a four-piece). Incidentally, there's a book out on post-Ozzy Sabbath that's a pretty interesting read (I got to thumb through a bunch of it last week while killing time at the Virgin store in SF), despite name-dropping tons of 80s hair bands that I never heard of (and never wanted to). But looks to me like a must-have for hardcore Iommi fans. -Doug jasret at mindspring.com From RMayo19761 at AOL.COM Tue Jun 8 21:40:42 2004 From: RMayo19761 at AOL.COM (RMayo19761 at AOL.COM) Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 21:40:42 EDT Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again/drummers&harmony Message-ID: In a message dated 6/8/2004 9:26:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, jasret at MINDSPRING.COM writes: > Still, you gotta credit a guy > who can sing one of a five-part harmony while pouding out a beat (Mick > Tucker being about the only other one I can think of, and his band was > only a four-piece). > check Roger Taylor -bobm From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Wed Jun 9 07:04:26 2004 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 12:04:26 +0100 Subject: Advice on DVD media Message-ID: As y'all will have gathered, I'm new to all this DVD stuff. So after a weekend of struggle behind the cabinets I have the DVD/HDD recorder all plumbed in to the other kit. Naturally, despite my having near 50 leads in the cupboard, the one I needed wasn't there and couldn't be found on a Sunday, but it's all done. So I've produced my first DVD-R from a couple of films on the hard drive. I do however have questions: 1) When I put the DVD-R in my old DVD player, it will jam up if I try to go faster that 2x fast forward. I recorded it on LP (4 hours on 4.7Gb). Is this affected by the DVD-R media? Should I avoid the cheaper media blanks? Which ones are worth buying? 2) Can I construct playlists and write them to DVD-R so that I can jump to scenes in a movie? Thanks for any help from you experts out there.. FoFP From des at SUPERLINK.NET Wed Jun 9 09:10:33 2004 From: des at SUPERLINK.NET (E F) Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 09:10:33 -0400 Subject: Advice on DVD media In-Reply-To: <200406091104.i59B4QdB024374@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: These two websites offer invaluable informtation on anything regarding home DVD making: http://www.videohelp.com/ http://www.doom9.org/ There are many articles and tutorials for the home DVD maker, plus info regarding stand alone set top units and and discussions in the forums. Videohelp.com is general very 'search' friendly. Good luck. --Eric Wednesday, June 9, 2004, 7:04:26 AM, you wrote: MH> As y'all will have gathered, I'm new to all this DVD stuff. So after a MH> weekend of struggle behind the cabinets I have the DVD/HDD recorder all MH> plumbed in to the other kit. Naturally, despite my having near 50 leads MH> in the cupboard, the one I needed wasn't there and couldn't be found on MH> a Sunday, but it's all done. MH> So I've produced my first DVD-R from a couple of films on the hard MH> drive. I do however have questions: MH> 1) When I put the DVD-R in my old DVD player, it will jam up if I try to MH> go faster that 2x fast forward. I recorded it on LP (4 hours on 4.7Gb). MH> Is this affected by the DVD-R media? Should I avoid the cheaper media MH> blanks? Which ones are worth buying? MH> 2) Can I construct playlists and write them to DVD-R so that I can jump MH> to scenes in a movie? MH> Thanks for any help from you experts out there.. MH> FoFP From MLee at GROUPWISE.LINNEY.COM Wed Jun 9 11:24:33 2004 From: MLee at GROUPWISE.LINNEY.COM (Mark Lee) Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 16:24:33 +0100 Subject: OFF: Sab's Message-ID: >Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2004 18:16:27 -0700 >From: Christian >Subject: OFF: Black Sabbath: Born Again >I just bought this at half price, Sabbaths remnewal after the Dio/Ozzy era >Sabs, though Gillan's effort beats both of them. Fine cyberpunk/metal and >it is the start of TOPY and even god, namely Voi'vod, just look at how the >lyrics are handwritten... awesome CD (Yes the it is the remaster) >Highlights: Trashed, Stonehenge, Zero The Hero, Digital Bitch. Ye gods, there ain't no accounting for taste, I remember buying the album when it came out. After I listened I gave it to my mate and never bought any Sabbath again. Still... Mark (Hasbeen) DISCLAIMER: Information contained in this email or any attachment may be of a confidential nature which should not be disclosed to, copied or used by anyone other than the addressee. If you receive this email in error, please delete the email from your computer. Internet communications are not secure and therefore W & J Linney Limited and/or its associated companies does not accept legal responsibility for the contents of this message. Although the W & J Linney Group operates anti-virus programmes, it does not accept responsibility for any damage whatsoever that is caused by viruses being passed. Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the W & J Linney Group. Replies to this email may be monitored by the W & J Linney Group for operational or business reasons. From ir004728 at MINDSPRING.COM Wed Jun 9 17:26:33 2004 From: ir004728 at MINDSPRING.COM (Albert Bouchard) Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 17:26:33 -0400 Subject: Advice on DVD media In-Reply-To: <200406091104.i59B4QdB024374@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: On Jun 9, 2004, at 7:04 AM, M Holmes wrote: > 1) When I put the DVD-R in my old DVD player, it will jam up if I try > to > go faster that 2x fast forward. I recorded it on LP (4 hours on 4.7Gb). > Is this affected by the DVD-R media? Should I avoid the cheaper media > blanks? Which ones are worth buying? > Yes. Consumer DVDs hold 1 hour at the best quality, 90 min. or two hours at OK quality. Yes. Any reputable brand (TDK, Maxell, Verbatum etc.) > 2) Can I construct playlists and write them to DVD-R so that I can jump > to scenes in a movie? Piece of cake with Apple's iMovie. Good luck, Al From jswartz at MITRE.ORG Thu Jun 10 10:48:53 2004 From: jswartz at MITRE.ORG (John Swartz) Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 10:48:53 -0400 Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again In-Reply-To: <200406090900.i59903j7027867@www.ispnetinc.net> Message-ID: > > I just bought this at half price, Sabbaths remnewal after the Dio/Ozzy era > Sabs, though Gillan's effort beats both of them. Fine cyberpunk/metal and > it is the start of TOPY and even god, namely Voi'vod, just look at how the > lyrics are handwritten... awesome CD (Yes the it is the remaster) > Highlights: Trashed, Stonehenge, Zero The Hero, Digital Bitch. I recall this album fondly from my heavy-metal youth... >> >> Disturbing The Priest: My favorite track! >>>>>>>(what really infuriated me was their insistence on playing 'smoke on the >>>>>>>water' on the tour; it sounded horrible...ugh.) Personally, I didn't mind it - a little nod to Ian Gillan - I saw them do it in 1983. >>>>>>>yes, i have an mp3 from the worcester ma show of gillan singing 'supernaut'; >>>>>>>it's excellent!! That's the show I was at! John From dplaw at IC24.NET Thu Jun 10 11:24:14 2004 From: dplaw at IC24.NET (Dave Law) Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 11:24:14 -0400 Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again Message-ID: On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 10:48:53 -0400, John Swartz wrote: >> >I recall this album fondly from my heavy-metal youth... on this note may i also recommend the book i'm reading right now - "Hell bent for leather - confessions of a heavy-metal addict" by Seb Hunter has just been published by 4th estate, i'm about half way through it and have to say i could have wrote it myself, not saying for one moment that i'm capable of such things but there's just so much i can relate to and i'm sure i'm not the only one on the list who that applies too, so far Hawkwind have been mentioned twice but it must be stressed just in passing. anyway the Guardian recently published a snippet from the book which can be accessed at http://www.guardian.co.uk/weekend/story/0,3605,1225960,00.html for anybody who just wants a light hearted read this is ideal and is a nice appetizer for what promises to be the literary highlight of the year for hawkwind fans the world over, Ian Abrahams book! all the best dave From michael_1968 at OZEMAIL.COM.AU Thu Jun 10 11:48:04 2004 From: michael_1968 at OZEMAIL.COM.AU (MiChAeL "aLiEn DrEaM" bLaCkMaN) Date: Fri, 11 Jun 2004 01:18:04 +0930 Subject: Black Sabbath: Born Again Message-ID: You could have "wrote it"? "wrote it!!" you're an Englishman, man! Squeak ploper english man! :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Law" To: Sent: Friday, June 11, 2004 12:54 AM Subject: Re: Black Sabbath: Born Again > On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 10:48:53 -0400, John Swartz wrote: > > >> > >I recall this album fondly from my heavy-metal youth... > > on this note may i also recommend the book i'm reading right now - > "Hell bent for leather - confessions of a heavy-metal addict" by Seb > Hunter has just been published by 4th estate, i'm about half way through > it and have to say i could have wrote it myself, not saying for one moment > that i'm capable of such things but there's just so much i can relate to > and i'm sure i'm not the only one on the list who that applies too, so far > Hawkwind have been mentioned twice but it must be stressed just in passing. > > anyway the Guardian recently published a snippet from the book which can > be accessed at > http://www.guardian.co.uk/weekend/story/0,3605,1225960,00.html > for anybody who just wants a light hearted read this is ideal and is a > nice appetizer for what promises to be the literary highlight of the year > for hawkwind fans the world over, Ian Abrahams book! > all the best > dave > From jill at THETA-ORIONIS.FREESERVE.CO.UK Fri Jun 11 15:55:34 2004 From: jill at THETA-ORIONIS.FREESERVE.CO.UK (Jill Strobridge) Date: Fri, 11 Jun 2004 20:55:34 +0100 Subject: OFF: misc Stonehenge and the Prisoner Message-ID: The Ordnance Survey website has a rather splendid view of Stonehenge available as a free wallpaper-cum-calender this month at the following address: http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/oswebsite/freefun/wallpaper/ And for anyone who missed it first (or second) time around if you have access to BBC4 they are showing the first of the series of The Prisoner at 11.00pm tonight. I'll be seeing you jill ----------------------------------------------------------------- Jill Strobridge ----------------------------------------------------------------- From jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM Sun Jun 13 06:24:35 2004 From: jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM (Jerry Kranitz) Date: Sun, 13 Jun 2004 06:24:35 -0400 Subject: OFF: Aural Innovations: New REVIEWS & INTERVIEW Message-ID: http://Aural-Innovations.com Announcements (June 13, 2004): NEW REVIEWS & INTERVIEW. We've just uploaded a batch of new reviews and an interview. Thanks to Scott Heller, Charles van de Kree, Brian Faulkner, Jeff Fitzgerald, Chuck Rosenberg, Keith Henderson and Joshua Charles for their contributions. You can find all this by going directly to our What's New page at http://aural-innovations.com/main/whatsnew.html Stay tuned next week when the Radio Shows kick into high gear again! We've got a review of Stephen Palmer's new festie sci-fi novel Hallucinating and an interview with Palmer. Palmer is also a musician and many of you will know him from his work with the bands Mooch and Blue Lily Commission. We've also got coverage of the Copenhagen Fuzzfest and a bunch of other live show accounts. CD and album reviews include Fireclan, Acid Mother's Temple, F/i, Weltraumstaunen, Astro Can Caravan, Vibravoid, Brain Ballet, Blueprint Human Being, QOPH, Scott Mosher, George W. Self, Greg Segal, Jugalbandi, Monno, Blackloud, Peter Belli & Baby Woodrose, a Tom Rapp tribute, Steffen Basho-Junghans, Tristen Shields, Alexei Borisov, Anatoly Pereslegin, Artemiy Artemiev, Alexander Volodin, Antanas Jasenka, Roderik de Man, Yney, Shovelhead, Magyar Posse, Colour Haze, Johnson Noise, Precious Bodyfluid, Apes of Glory, Black Label Society, Daytona Motel, The Great Escape, Kreisor, Mannhai, No Life Orchestra, The Weed, Outrage, Rosetta West, Majestic Scene, Unsane, Dave Tucker West Coast Project, Marina Lazzara, Miba, Ernesto Diaz-Infante & Chris Forsyth, Ernesto Diaz-Infante & Matt Hannafin, Packi, and Robert Ziino. http://Aural-Innovations.com From nick.lee2 at VIRGIN.NET Sun Jun 13 15:50:52 2004 From: nick.lee2 at VIRGIN.NET (Nick Lee) Date: Sun, 13 Jun 2004 20:50:52 +0100 Subject: HW: Celebration Fest Message-ID: Lovely little festival yesterday at Bicester. We arrived in time to catch the last couple of songs of Adensum's set. Seen 'em couple of times before supporting the Assassins, suffice to say they're improving. Bruce's Spider were up next and provided a pretty entertaining set (though not necessarily for the right reasons!), it was very much unreconstructed Prog, musically pretty good but vocally fairly awful. Somewhat Spinal Tap, complete with cape-wearing keyboard player. Didn't hear too much of Anomie as I'd popped off for some supplies. Dr Brown played a very nice, laid-back, bluesy set, the first time I'd heard them for some years, the last being at Glastonbury (2000?). The One-Eyed Bishops carried on in a similar vein with some great blues standards. Huw's set was a blinder, easily better than any of his performances on the last hawktour. He seemed very relaxed and put on a great show and was joined by the Assassins for his last number, Hurry On Sundown which segued into their set. A bit tight on time the Assassins played a very tight set. Joined by Ben, as at Hawkfest last year on wind and violin, they ploughed through Utopia, Brainstorm, Uncle Sam's On Mars amongst others finishing off with a wonderful version of High Rise (complete with some lovely violin) followed by Motorway City. All in all a lovely day out. Great weather, good crowd and a very sociable day. A big thanks to Dave (and a belated happy birthday) and everyone else who put the effort in to make this work. Nick PS got a roll full of pictures waiting to be developed. From wrightm at BRE.CO.UK Mon Jun 14 04:25:53 2004 From: wrightm at BRE.CO.UK (Wright, Mike) Date: Mon, 14 Jun 2004 09:25:53 +0100 Subject: HW: Dave on Radio 4! Message-ID: Dear folks, imagine my joy on Saturday as I turned on the radio at aboput 10:45am to hear a program, which eventually turned out to be about the roundhouse, as it was discussing the uses it was put to in the early 70s. The first clip I heard was with Nick Mason, and then the DJ from UFO, and then it turned to discussing Greasy Truckers party, played a clip of Master, and had a bit from Dave about playing on acid, seeing skeletons in the audience and thinking his red sweat soaked hankerchief was filled with blood. Truely a wonderful thing to hear. They also had a quote from Leemy about going to see the bands at the roundhouse, but seeing very few of them due to being amused elsewhere. There was a bit from Fast Eddie about when Motorhead and the Damned played a double header, and the fact that spitting on the head did not happen. And then last night there was a repeat of "when X ruled the world" and last night it was heavy rock, and it finished with a clip of the lemster summing up rock very nicely. I forget the exact quote, but it was along the lines of "Rock has given me a great life, and don't forget all the women" Mike w resource04 - The low carbon technology showcase A major conference and exhibition at BRE 7-10 June. Visit http://www.resource04.com Privileged and confidential information and/or copyright material may be contained in this e-mail. The information and material is intended for the use of the intended addressee only. If you are not the intended addressee you may not copy or deliver it to anyone else or use it in any unauthorised manner. To do so is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you receive this e-mail by mistake, please advise the sender immediately by return e-mail and destroy all copies. Thank you. Foundation for the Built Environment, Registered under number 3282856 in England and Wales. Building Research Establishment Ltd, Registered under number 3319324 in England and Wales. BRE Certification Limited, Registered under number 3548352 in England and Wales. Registered Offices: Bucknalls Lane, Garston, Watford, Hertfordshire WD25 9XX From zim594j at TNINET.SE Mon Jun 14 05:10:01 2004 From: zim594j at TNINET.SE (Kenneth Magnusson) Date: Mon, 14 Jun 2004 11:10:01 +0200 Subject: HW: Sweden Rock sensation In-Reply-To: <539D43F00153574B8DA4C5B01D8961F931C0FF@OPHELIA.bre.co.uk> Message-ID: I have learned that Hawkwind was joined by Dave Wyndorf of Monster Magnet on Sweden Rock Festival. From gerald.whitworth at CEVA-DSP.COM Mon Jun 14 11:57:10 2004 From: gerald.whitworth at CEVA-DSP.COM (Gerald Whitworth) Date: Mon, 14 Jun 2004 16:57:10 +0100 Subject: Celebration Fest Message-ID: I totally agree, with everything Nick says. A great day out. However, the size of the crowd was a little disappointing and some of the latter sets seemed a little shy on volume. I also understand that the Assassins had planned extra numbers that they had to cut out being tight on time. -----Original Message----- From: Nick Lee [mailto:nick.lee2 at VIRGIN.NET] Sent: 13 June 2004 20:51 To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: HW: Celebration Fest Lovely little festival yesterday at Bicester. We arrived in time to catch the last couple of songs of Adensum's set. Seen 'em couple of times before supporting the Assassins, suffice to say they're improving. Bruce's Spider were up next and provided a pretty entertaining set (though not necessarily for the right reasons!), it was very much unreconstructed Prog, musically pretty good but vocally fairly awful. Somewhat Spinal Tap, complete with cape-wearing keyboard player. Didn't hear too much of Anomie as I'd popped off for some supplies. Dr Brown played a very nice, laid-back, bluesy set, the first time I'd heard them for some years, the last being at Glastonbury (2000?). The One-Eyed Bishops carried on in a similar vein with some great blues standards. Huw's set was a blinder, easily better than any of his performances on the last hawktour. He seemed very relaxed and put on a great show and was joined by the Assassins for his last number, Hurry On Sundown which segued into their set. A bit tight on time the Assassins played a very tight set. Joined by Ben, as at Hawkfest last year on wind and violin, they ploughed through Utopia, Brainstorm, Uncle Sam's On Mars amongst others finishing off with a wonderful version of High Rise (complete with some lovely violin) followed by Motorway City. All in all a lovely day out. Great weather, good crowd and a very sociable day. A big thanks to Dave (and a belated happy birthday) and everyone else who put the effort in to make this work. Nick PS got a roll full of pictures waiting to be developed. From judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM Mon Jun 14 15:40:41 2004 From: judge48 at HOTMAIL.COM (trev) Date: Mon, 14 Jun 2004 20:40:41 +0100 Subject: Pink Fairies tribute, Turner, and Cannabis Rally Message-ID: New festival review :- Legalise Cannabis Rally at Brockwell Park London http://www.rfm.mercurymoon.co.uk/images-cannabis-festival-04.html New gig review :- Pink F A (Pink Fairies tribute) and 46000 fibres gig with Nik Turner at the Bull and gate, London http://www.rfm.mercurymoon.co.uk/images-pink-fa.html All with pics and vid downloads REAL FESTIVAL MUSIC - RFM http://www.realfestivalmusic.co.uk Festival Listings, Festival Reviews, CDs, Video Downloads, News, Forum, Chat, Healers From zim594j at TNINET.SE Tue Jun 15 08:54:03 2004 From: zim594j at TNINET.SE (Kenneth Magnusson) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2004 14:54:03 +0200 Subject: HW: Forwarded from Scott Heller: Sweden Rock In-Reply-To: <9DE3202A-BDE2-11D8-AECA-0050E450F316@tninet.se> Message-ID: The Set was: Assault and Battery>Golden Void>Where are we Now? new instrumental piece Sword of the East The Right Stuff (With singer and one guitar player (Phil) from Monster Magnet. Long Jam! Wings Angelia Android Spirit of the Age Hassan I Sabha Encore: Brain Box Pollution Ejection The band was in good spirits and played well but they were a bit mixed up at the beginning of the show but really got it together. IT was a long and cool jam with the monster magnet guys. As ususal, Daves guitar was too low in the mix! I spoke to Dave the Spirit of the Age single is released Aug 27th and the CD in Sept. He was quite positive of this. Dibs said that he had only heard three songs and not even the whole CD. That really surprised me... It was really fun to seem them again! Cool show.. scott From M.R.Godwin at BATH.AC.UK Tue Jun 15 09:55:37 2004 From: M.R.Godwin at BATH.AC.UK (Michael R Godwin) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2004 14:55:37 +0100 Subject: BOC: Southampton Message-ID: Fine BOC set at the tiny Brook in Southampton yesterday: RU Ready to Rock Harvester of Eyes Burning for You O'D'd on Life Itself Extra Terrestrial Intelligence The Vigil Joan Crawford has risen from the Grave Cities on Flame Astronomy Godzilla DFtR ---- Perfect Water I Ain't Got You We Gotta Get Out of This Place ---- In 19 years of BOC gigs I've never seen them play Astronomy before, though they seem to have played it occasionally on most tours. I Ain't Got You was stunning, and apart from Astronomy, Harvester of Eyes is my favourite BOC song. So all in all, a very satisfactory night out and worth driving 60 miles. Thanks, Alex! Did anyone see them at the festival in Holland which they have just played? - Mike Godwin PS I did see them play that hip-hop version of Astronomy on the Imaginos tour, but I don't count that... From Andreas.Stuewe at T-ONLINE.DE Tue Jun 15 11:52:04 2004 From: Andreas.Stuewe at T-ONLINE.DE (Andreas Stuewe) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2004 17:52:04 +0200 Subject: BOC: Setlist Lichtenvoorde/NL 12.06.04 Message-ID: RU Ready to Rock Cities on flame Burning for You E.T.I. Shooting Shark Harvester of Eyes Godzilla Reaper A short 55 min set from 8.05 pm til 9.00 pm. Mot?rhead hadn?t even finished their set on the main stage though... And Allen Lanier wasn?t with them! Andreas From Tjackson at SYR.EDU Tue Jun 15 12:33:47 2004 From: Tjackson at SYR.EDU (Ted Jackson) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2004 12:33:47 -0400 Subject: BOC: Setlist Lichtenvoorde/NL 12.06.04 Message-ID: >>> Andreas.Stuewe at T-ONLINE.DE 06/15/04 11:52AM >>> RU Ready to Rock Cities on flame Burning for You E.T.I. Shooting Shark Harvester of Eyes Godzilla Reaper A short 55 min set from 8.05 pm til 9.00 pm. Mot?rhead hadn t even finished their set on the main stage though... And Allen Lanier wasn t with them! Wow, glad I didn't pay to see that! No Allen? WTF? The health code inspectors wouldn't let him in the country? theo From youless at COX.NET Tue Jun 15 15:08:23 2004 From: youless at COX.NET (Steve Youles) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2004 15:08:23 -0400 Subject: Off: Pyramids at Glasto Message-ID: Look for Terry Ollis, Mick Slattery and possibly Nik Turner to guest with the Pyramids of SNAFU during their 2 sets at Glasto (2pm Friday 25/6/04 and 4pm Saturday 26/6/04) in the "pedal-powered Mandala marquee in the Green Fields" that Judge Trev mentioned t'other day... Steve From dave at PARMA29.FREESERVE.CO.UK Wed Jun 16 15:42:02 2004 From: dave at PARMA29.FREESERVE.CO.UK (dave hall) Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2004 20:42:02 +0100 Subject: OFF: Magazine clear out Message-ID: Clearing out the house last week,finally. I have a stack of music mags from over the years, mainly Q and Mojo. Before I part with them either to the local magazine dealer or charity shop do any of you have any particular "wants" [Hawkwind Mojo not included]. If you're looking for any bands let me know and I'll set them aside for you. Costs? A couple of quid + p and p. I'll dig through them to find any HW and related stuff. More stuff to follow including Frendz, 70's/80's mags with HW etc Dave From CWarburton at OAG.COM Thu Jun 17 08:21:58 2004 From: CWarburton at OAG.COM (CWarburton at OAG.COM) Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2004 13:21:58 +0100 Subject: BOC: Southampton Message-ID: Since this is the only UK report so far, do I preume that NOBODY from the list went to the Astoria this time?? I confess that I followed the same line of reasoning as M'sieu' Jarrett and went to The Underworld for Nektar - who were mighty, with the exception of a shortish 3 song section in mid-set with acoutic guitar; one of which I can only describe as a "power ballad" yeuch! (Though better than most of that ilk). I shall however curse a little if I find that the boys from Long Island did Ain't Got You/We gotta... All in all, last week rocked as a belated b'day celebration... The Nektar show had been preceded by Ozric Tentacles steaming through a set at The Pitz in Milton Keynes on the Wednesday, and at The Astoria on Thursday, Queensr?che gave us the complete "Operation Mindcrime". Seems like QRs political sensibilities ae still awake - when we finally saw the back of Geoff Tate's denim jacket during "Eyes Of A Stranger" it had on the back a VERY unflattering screen print of Dubya captioned "LIAR" Ah well, just waiting for Jeff Beck now, then it'll probably be hibernation until DKT Cheers ChrisW ********** > Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2004 14:55:37 +0100 > From: Michael R Godwin > Subject: BOC: Southampton >--snip--< > > Perfect Water > I Ain't Got You > We Gotta Get Out of This Place > > ---- > > In 19 years of BOC gigs I've never seen them play Astronomy > before, though they seem to have played it occasionally on > most tours. I Ain't Got You was stunning, and apart from > Astronomy, Harvester of Eyes is my favourite BOC song. So all > in all, a very satisfactory night out and worth driving 60 > miles. Thanks, Alex! > From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Thu Jun 17 12:50:58 2004 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2004 17:50:58 +0100 Subject: Looking a free CD collection in the mouth? Message-ID: http://www.thestate.com/mld/thestate/news/local/8937851.htm Precis: Record companies settle a lawsuit by giving away 75 million bucks worth of CD's to schools. Bureaucrats take it upon themselves to censor 'em... FoFP From imaginos at PAVILION.CO.UK Thu Jun 17 18:01:04 2004 From: imaginos at PAVILION.CO.UK (Jason Gool) Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2004 23:01:04 +0100 Subject: BOC: Southampton In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The set list for the Mean Fiddler (moved from The Astoria) was: R U Ready 2 Rock E.T.I Lips In The Hills Born To Rock Burning For You Career Of Evil Shooting Shark Cities On Flame Last Days Of May Godzilla Reaper Intro Reaper Encore: Golden Age Of Leather Black Blade The set lust for Southampton was: R U Ready To Rock Harvester of Eyes Burnin' For You Od'd On Life Itself ETI The Vigil Joan Crawford Cities On Flame Astronomy Godzilla Reaper intro DFTR Encore: Perfect Water Maserati GT We Gotta Get Out Of This Place Didn't make it to Bilston. Jas. > Since this is the only UK report so far, do I preume that NOBODY from the list went to the Astoria this time?? > I confess that I followed the same line of reasoning as M'sieu' Jarrett and went to The Underworld for Nektar - who were mighty, with the exception of a shortish 3 song section in mid-set with acoutic guitar; one of which I can only describe as a "power ballad" yeuch! (Though better than most of that ilk). > I shall however curse a little if I find that the boys from Long Island did Ain't Got You/We gotta... > > All in all, last week rocked as a belated b'day celebration... The Nektar show had been preceded by Ozric Tentacles steaming through a set at The Pitz in Milton Keynes on the Wednesday, and at The Astoria on Thursday, Queensr?che gave us the complete "Operation Mindcrime". Seems like QRs political sensibilities ae still awake - when we finally saw the back of Geoff Tate's denim jacket during "Eyes Of A Stranger" it had on the back a VERY unflattering screen print of Dubya captioned "LIAR" > > Ah well, just waiting for Jeff Beck now, then it'll probably be hibernation until DKT > > Cheers > ChrisW > > > ********** > > Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2004 14:55:37 +0100 > > From: Michael R Godwin > > Subject: BOC: Southampton > >--snip--< > > > > Perfect Water > > I Ain't Got You > > We Gotta Get Out of This Place > > > > ---- > > > > In 19 years of BOC gigs I've never seen them play Astronomy > > before, though they seem to have played it occasionally on > > most tours. I Ain't Got You was stunning, and apart from > > Astronomy, Harvester of Eyes is my favourite BOC song. So all > > in all, a very satisfactory night out and worth driving 60 > > miles. Thanks, Alex! > > > From hw at CY-B.ORG Thu Jun 17 19:21:59 2004 From: hw at CY-B.ORG (Rik Rx) Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2004 19:21:59 -0400 Subject: HW: Finland News Message-ID: + ++ ++ + STAR WARRIORS + + + Latest news for the FINLAND GIG: Dave Wyndorf and Phil Caivano from Monster Magnet will be joining us for our set ! Saturday July 10th Ruisrock Festival (10th-11th July) Turku Finland INFOLINE Call: 0600-070 809 (In Finland) Weekdays from 9 to 5 Please send email to info at tiketti.fi for purchasing tickets from abroad. + + ++ + MESSAGE ENDS + + + + + + + From kruch7 at COX.NET Thu Jun 17 18:14:45 2004 From: kruch7 at COX.NET (Joseph Elric Smith Mormon Minion of Arioch) Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2004 18:14:45 -0400 Subject: Snl sketch Message-ID: http://mknx.com/v/cowbell.wmv Gygax is to Gaming what Kirby was to comics Alas poor Elric I was a thousand times more evil than you Slice N Dice: Game and Pizza Parlour WWBYD What would Brigham Young do ? http://www.geocities.com/J_Elric_Smith/Index.html From CWarburton at OAG.COM Fri Jun 18 05:22:16 2004 From: CWarburton at OAG.COM (CWarburton at OAG.COM) Date: Fri, 18 Jun 2004 10:22:16 +0100 Subject: BOC: Mean Fiddler Message-ID: Moved downstairs - musta bin a big fall off in ticket sales this time! Maybe Jon & I weren't the only ones put off by last years poor show. Paging Rich Lockwood... Did you go? Cheers, ChrisW > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2004 23:01:04 +0100 > From: Jason Gool > Subject: Re: BOC: Southampton > > The set list for the Mean Fiddler (moved from The Astoria) was: > From IainFerguson at AOL.COM Fri Jun 18 05:48:44 2004 From: IainFerguson at AOL.COM (IainFerguson at AOL.COM) Date: Fri, 18 Jun 2004 05:48:44 EDT Subject: Roundhouse program now available for listening to. Message-ID: Hi folks, I get very few mails from this list these days, so either I have a problem with e-mail or its quiet on here. So i appologuise if you've been informed already. The Roundhouse program is now available to listen to. If you select R from the A-Z listings from the following hyperlink www.bbc.co.uk/radio4 From paul at IMRRYR.KAROO.CO.UK Sat Jun 19 05:41:48 2004 From: paul at IMRRYR.KAROO.CO.UK (Paul Eaton-Jones) Date: Sat, 19 Jun 2004 10:41:48 +0100 Subject: Snl sketch In-Reply-To: <007301c454b8$7f5db5e0$1108a8c0@kenneith93j41k> Message-ID: "The cow-bell as a sign of unbridled passion" - Frank Zappa. On Thursday, Jun 17, 2004, at 23:14 Europe/London, Joseph Elric Smith Mormon Minion of Arioch wrote: > http://mknx.com/v/cowbell.wmv > Gygax is to Gaming what Kirby was to comics > Alas poor Elric I was a thousand times more evil than you > > Slice N Dice: Game and Pizza Parlour > > WWBYD What would Brigham Young do ? > http://www.geocities.com/J_Elric_Smith/Index.html > From jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM Sun Jun 20 04:37:55 2004 From: jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM (Jerry Kranitz) Date: Sun, 20 Jun 2004 04:37:55 -0400 Subject: OFF: Aural Innovations Radio: New Space Rock, Alchemical Radio, and Magic Cat Radio shows Message-ID: http://Aural-Innovations.com Announcements (June 20, 2004):We've just uploaded new shows from Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio (show #105), Alchemical Radio (show #60), and Magic Cat Radio (show #6). See the playlists below. You can go directly to the Radio shows page at: http://aural-innovations.com/radio/radio.html NEW in stock at the Aural Innovations CD MAIL ORDER CATALOG: ST 37 - "The Insect Hospital"... The latest from the veteran Texan space-punk monsters is on the Black Widow label and in addition to some trademark ST 37 songs we also get 45 minutes of the live soundtrack the band performed to accompany a showing of the silent film classic Metropolis. For more information you can visit our mail order catalog at: http://aural-innovations.com/mailord/mailord.html Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio (show #105) Purple Overdose - "Her Arms Embraced The Sun" (from Reborn) ST 37 - "Model Had" (from The Insect Hospital) David Unlimbo - "Fat Planet" (yet to be released) Ultraterrestrials with David Unlimbo, Lyndon & Ian - "Session One" (yet to be released) Lord Sterling - "Hidden Flame" (from Today's Song For Tomorrow) Saturnia - "Kozmische parts 1 & 2" (from Hydrophonic Gardening) Blackloud - "Search Light" (from Mysterious Waves) Octopus Syng - "Frail Elephant" (from Beyond the Karmadelic Coldness, There's The Lovedelic Warmth) Jugalbandi - "Defeat Garbanzo Medallion" (from Night Crazy) Moon Trotskij - "I Fell But Andromeda Rose To The Stars (part 2)" (from I Fell But Andromeda Rose To The Stars) Magic Cat Radio (show #6) Magic Cat Radio comes to us from Kev Ellis of Dr Brown and Majic Cat, and features special live performances from Majic Cat, related bands, and anything else that Kev cares to share. This show is a retrospective of music Kev has been involved with from 1990-2004. Dr Brown - "Magic Cat" (from "Live In The Minds Eye" CD, w/Dave Shah - guitar) Dr Brown - "Unrelenting Sky" (from "Dreamscape" CD w/Huw Lloyd-Langton & Mik Stanger - guitars) Dr Frond - "Icy Waters" (from Dr Frond LP w/Dr Brown & Nick Saloman) Magic Cat - "Take It Easy" Sonic Arcana - "Dreamscape" (from Dr Brown Dreamscape CD) Sonic Arcana - "Faithless" (from Dr Brown "In The World Of Dreams" LP) Bubbledubble - "The Skys Over Baghdad" Acousticat - "Save Me" The Mushroom men - "The Wizard" Dr Brown - "Celebrate The World Of Dreams" (from In The World Of Dreams LP w/Caroline Driscoll - violin) Alchemical Radio (show #60) Alchemical Radio is produced by our friends Terri~B and The Reverend Rabbit from the Stone Premonitions label and features some of the best Psychedelia, Progressive Rock, Metal, and adventurous Pop that the underground has to offer. Visit the Stone Premonitions web site at http://aural-innovations.com/stonepremonitions Introduction by a man of war with musical backing from a man of peace Pax Americana - This Is Not America Laura Veirs - Song My Friends Taught Me The Electric Riders - The Great Bonfire Josda Dan - Touch The Sky Brainticket - A Dreamer's Reflection Lamp Of The Universe - Freedom In Your Mind Arthur's Dream - Long Day's Flight Till Tomorrow DTR - Lifetime Skid Row - Down From Underground Steam Angel - Day That Will Yaya Diallo - Gifono Hamfatter - My Name The Ceramic Hobs - AE Trip Thing http://Aural-Innovations.com From colin at CALLEN18.FREESERVE.CO.UK Mon Jun 21 06:13:06 2004 From: colin at CALLEN18.FREESERVE.CO.UK (Colin J Allen) Date: Mon, 21 Jun 2004 06:13:06 -0400 Subject: HW: Litmus - The Cartoon, Croydon - June 22nd Message-ID: Hello all, Litmus are headlining at the Cartoon in Croydon tomorrow night (Tuesday 22nd June). Come along for a slab of space rock to make your ears rattle (the Cartoon has a 10K rig!!!!). The Cartoon 179/183 London Road Croydon Surrey CR0 2RJ Tel: 020 8239 1616 http://www.litmusmusic.co.uk http://www.spacemusic.biz http://www.thecartoon.co.uk From neil.shilladay at MICROLISE.COM Tue Jun 22 03:42:54 2004 From: neil.shilladay at MICROLISE.COM (Neil Shilladay) Date: Tue, 22 Jun 2004 08:42:54 +0100 Subject: HW: Do Not Panic Message-ID: I was listening to 'Do not Panic' to salute the solstice yesterday, and I had forgotten just how much I liked this album. I used to play it all the time late 80s / early 90s as a backdrop to some weird & wonderful times. Congrats to Ali Davey on making it to his third decade with HW (on and off). Is Huw rejoining HW ? I love his playing in HW, when he solos he just soars away. Get well Huw, would love to see you back on board the mothership again. Neil. From blackblade at BHALLIGAN.COM Tue Jun 22 11:35:04 2004 From: blackblade at BHALLIGAN.COM (blackblade at BHALLIGAN.COM) Date: Tue, 22 Jun 2004 11:35:04 -0400 Subject: Cellsum Summer 2004 Message-ID: Al wrote: > Saturday July 10th > the Brain Surgeons > The Bug Jar Rochester NY They say good things come in threes. Saturday I got married. Earlier today I heard from an old friend I thought I had lost contact with forever. And now the Surgeons are playing the coolest club in town! I don't think this week could possibly get any better. Thanks Al & Deb! Brian From deadearnest at BTOPENWORLD.COM Tue Jun 22 19:43:52 2004 From: deadearnest at BTOPENWORLD.COM (deadearnest) Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 00:43:52 +0100 Subject: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows Message-ID: Boot's on the other foot here - somone's just given me a region 1 (USA) Cheap Trick DVD so if anone out there can do me a pal region 2 copy then let me know and they can have the original for free. Andy G. deadearnest at btopenworld.com ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, May 31, 2004 11:25 AM Subject: Re: BOC-L Digest / Still in the Shadows > I thank the two people who replied saying that the PAL "Out of the > Shadows" should play on my NTSC player. Unfortunately it doesn't; nor > does it on my sister-in-law's or her son's - on mine it says (when the > disc is placed in): "This type of disc cannot be played. Please insert a > different one." , on my wife's sister's it reads: "Disc error" and on > her son's it reads the same as mine. These displays are exactly the same > on all three for another concert DVD I have when the PAL side is entered > (the other side is NTSC and plays just fine - this would have been a > nice idea for the Hawkwind disc). > > I hope he does not mind me mentioning this but when I bought the disc > from Phil at CDS it was he who said that many North Americans were > getting a friendly computer savvy friend to make an NTSC disc for them. > My disability severely limits my ability to socialize, so I thought I'd > take Phil's suggestion and see if I could find a "friend" on this list > would be kind enough to help me with this. > > Thank you for your patience and it would be most appreciated if *anyone* > could help. > Thanks again, > Jonathan > (Vancouver, B.C.) From kg at THING.ORG Fri Jun 25 19:57:42 2004 From: kg at THING.ORG (kgerwers) Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2004 01:57:42 +0200 Subject: Calvert - CHRIS GIBBS, are you around? Message-ID: hi there, I am looking for a current email address of Chris Gibbs - Chris, if you're reading this, please send a beep...thanks, k. From jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM Sat Jun 26 22:15:00 2004 From: jkranitz at AURAL-INNOVATIONS.COM (Jerry Kranitz) Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2004 22:15:00 -0400 Subject: OFF: Aural Innovations Radio: New Space Rock, Alchemical Radio, and Drool Trough shows Message-ID: http://Aural-Innovations.com Announcements (June 27, 2004):We've just uploaded new shows from Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio (show #106), Alchemical Radio (show #61), and Drool Trough (show #12). See the playlists below. You can go directly to the Radio shows page at: http://aural-innovations.com/radio/radio.html Aural Innovations Space Rock Radio (show #106) Richard Franecki & Hadley Kahn - "Licorice & Lime" (from Eemn) Eat Static remix of Ozric Tentacles "Chewier" (from promo single, original track from Spirals In Hyperspace) Yakuzi - "Agur" (from Ibai Lehorretan Itota) The Pins - "Rhein Geld" (from The Young Machines) Null_Objct - "Karma Kamikaze" (from The Blind Clockmaker) Solar Project - "Thunderstorm (excerpt)" (from Force Majeure) Ultra Fuckers - "Docking Terminal" (from Hyper Dimension) Verdure - "Graveyard Porchlight" (from The Telescope Dreampatterns) Valles - "Ignition" (from The Valles Brothers II) Ra Can Row - "Things Beyond Our Control" (from Ra Can Row) Alchemical Radio (show #61: Non-Stop Jukebox) Alchemical Radio is produced by our friends Terri~B and The Reverend Rabbit from the Stone Premonitions label and features some of the best Psychedelia, Progressive Rock, Metal, and adventurous Pop that the underground has to offer. Visit the Stone Premonitions web site at http://aural-innovations.com/stonepremonitions Nick Toone - From Floating Invisible Jen Gloeckner - Otherside Jonah - Radio Murders Kathy Compton - Optisong Arms Of Kismet - Kuckold Of Titan Syrinx - Emanescence Basement 3 - Mercy Sonus Umbra - Fascinoma Keven Brennan's Revival Tent - Voices Travel Faster Force Of Evil - Mindbreaker Nhojj - Free Space Mirrors - Black Dragon Greg Segal - Human In Sleep Sweater Girl Drool Trough (show #12) Drool Trough is an all genres show featuring cool music from the underground. We created Drool Trough for two reasons. First, we receive far more submissions at Aural Innovations than we can reasonably have time to review. And, second, we get a lot of cool music that doesn't fit neatly into our more theme oriented radio shows. Anything is game for Drool Trough, and from one track to the next you will hear completely different sounds and styles, all from homemade musicians and teeny weeny but ultra fiesty labels. The Electric Prunes - "Makin' Some Noise" (from California) The Ronis Brothers - "PPV" (from The Ronis Brothers Sampler) Valles - "Aeroplane" (from The Valles Brothers II) C. Goff III - "Chocolate Moose" (from Bacterial Culture) Concentric - "Hit The Ground Recovering" (from Concentric) Verdure - "Into The Blacktrees" (from The Telescope Dreampatterns) Marina Lazzara - "Flowers Falling From Your Back" (from Wind On The Firecracker Of The Building Next Door, the songs) Bluetoxin - "Zeros and Ones" (from Written In Code) prpGROUP - "Spag/Spaguette" (from Soil Pipe) Rancid Poultry - track 3 (from The Politics of Monotony) P.G. Six - "The Weeping Willow" (from The Well of Memory) The Buzzrats - "Cool Papa Bell" (from Wondering Where You Are) Lust Murder Box - "MPH" (from Lust Murder Box) a.P.A.t.T - "dOor tHEmE" (from E.P.) Null_Objct - "Blind Clockmaker" (from The Blind Clockmaker) Basement 3 - "Mercy" (from Fuzzyland) Blackloud - "Suicide Saint" (from Mysterious Waves) Octopus Syng - "Intuition Waltz" (from Beyond The Karmadelic Coldness, There's The Lovedelic Warmth) Strangers On A Train - "Was It The Way" (from 3 song sampler) Aaron Acosta - "Traffic" (from Frequency, Amplitude and Time) Medium - "Red Door" (from Otherworld) http://Aural-Innovations.com From deadearnest at BTOPENWORLD.COM Mon Jun 28 14:01:50 2004 From: deadearnest at BTOPENWORLD.COM (deadearnest) Date: Mon, 28 Jun 2004 19:01:50 +0100 Subject: (Hawkwind/Space Mirrors) German Magazine Message-ID: Just to let everyone know that has access to it, that the new edition (number 64) pf the German "Eclipsed" magazine has a three page colour feature on Hawkwind and their forthcoming appearance at the Burg Herzberg Festival, complete with photos, etc. In the same issue, there is an interview, complete with photos, with Alisa of Space Mirrors, a review of the Space Mirrors CD, an ad for the Space Mirrors CD and a track from the Space Mirrors album on the free CD that is with the magazine!!!! The magazine's in German and if you want to find out how to get it, then go to www.eclipsed.de Shameless Hawkwind and self-promotion time over Andy G. (Dead Earnest) From keith.henderson at PSI.CH Tue Jun 29 13:31:24 2004 From: keith.henderson at PSI.CH (Henderson Keith) Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 19:31:24 +0200 Subject: OT: HW: Various Message-ID: Hi Folks... Very quiet here...suppose that everyone in the US has been waiting in line to see F9/11, and everyone in Europe has been watching football every night, yeah? Anyway, those who have really felt like talking have mostly been posting over at Yahoo, but I still have enough 'loyalty' to this list to mainly post here. I've seen quite a few good concerts in the last several weeks, and am looking forward big time to another Burg Herzberg event, this time with maximal space rock percentage, with Hawkwind, MQB, Guru Guru, et al. And the weather in central Europe so far this summer has been really wonderful, that is, if you prefer a bit cooler temperatures as opposed to last year's oppressive heat (such that the grass died and the dirt went airborne into eyes/ears/nose/throat). It took me a long time to realize that Herzberg is *not* at Wilhelmsthal this year, but rather back to where I think it was in 2002 (and some number of years before, I believe), but neither back to the very original site, that being Burg Herzberg itself (hence the name). But the location has always been somewhere in the same region of Germany, that being essentially the Fulda Gap, of some importance to Cold War historians. Anyway, as I haven't actually been to this particular site, I can't add much to the discussion about how to get there, etc. But the site is pretty informative (if mostly in German), and has both a map of the grounds and an overhead photo, and so that should be helpful. Looks like a better place than Wilhelmsthal actually! The confusion I've had (I guess) is related to the fact that 1) Burg Herzberg is under 'new management' this year (otherwise it would have died after last year), but 2) the old crew (Think Progressive, under Kalle Becker) seems to still be planning to have a festival at the Wilhelmsthal site the weekend *after* the "true" Herzberg, but called something like "Herzberg goes Wilhelmstal" (which is really the renamed (Kloster) Cornberg Festival, which was held just once (in 2001?), and then cancelled both in 2002 and 2003, when Kalle was trying to run both simultaneously). He's got a great lineup for that one planned, including Tull, Amon Duul II, Outskirts Of Infinity, Bevis Frond, On Trial, and others. But I hesitate to make serious plans for it, because of recent history. So I might make a 'game time' decision about staying in central Germany over the four days in between the two fests, based on what I hear at Herzberg. Well, hope to see a few of you there...I know some folx are planning to make it. (Doug P.? Is it going to happen for you? Schade, wenn nicht.) The Finland one might have been fun though, with Dave W. and Lemmy both guesting. Any idea what the "complete" lineup at Herzberg will be? So, lately I've seen... Judas Priest...Rob Halford back on stage with the Priest. Can still sing the old tunes decent enough, and they had him mic'ed up so well, that he wouldn't have been able to hide it if he couldn't hack it. The set was pretty much standard material, nothing new, and so Painkiller songs were the most recent stuff. Beyond the Realms of Death and Victim of Changes both were highlights, and they did an acoustic Diamonds and Rust oddly enough. Strangest thing was that it was over at about 10 PM, and it was still just twilight. The show was indoors (a sporthall with a few skylight windows in the roof) so it was awhile before it even got 'dark' inside. Nearly sold out (Frauenfeld is a *small* town, maybe 10,000) with about 4,000 punters or so, mostly coming from Zuerich and nearby towns I guess. Marillion...well, I gave up on them years ago after that awful Radiation album...but they were coming to Winterthur (also close to Zuerich) and so I thought I'd see if they were still worthwhile. I picked up the new (single CD version of) "Marbles," and I quite liked the first long track and a few other pieces. Which I thought was promising. But the show was very boring...they played a 65-minute first set *all* of "Marbles" material, and although it started out OK, there isn't much energy in the album to translate well to a live setting, so a little bit of that goes a long way. And then after a short break, they came back to play a bunch more laid-back rubbish that I didn't know (so it must have come from Anoraknophobia and the .com albums that I don't own). Finally they played at least "Easter" at the end, which is still the best H-era song, and then started into something else I didn't know for an encore, at which point I had to leave to catch the last train. I suppose they did at least "Market Square Heroes" (or something old) as a second encore, but that wouldn't have done much to save this terrible show. I mean, the band is *all* Hogarth now, with the others just providing atmospheric accompaniment. I saw Fish a couple months ago, and although he hasn't kept up the level of his music to the quality of "Sunsets on Empire" at least he had a nice sampling of not only his solo material through the years, but also a few "original" Marillion songs. Anyway, time to give up on Marillion once and for all now...they're done. Circle...the next night I went down to a small town near Fribourg to see the first night of a three day 'punk/alternative rock' festival. It was called Kilbi-Bad Bonn, and they had both an outdoor tent stage, and an indoor club stage, and the bands alternated such that there was music non-stop from about 7 PM to 2 AM. Circle (from Finland, if you didn't already know) played in the evening on the tent stage. Mostly new material that they had just recorded at a studio in Germany a few days beforehand...only one piece I recognized, but then I think they only did three (or perhaps four) separate pieces during their one hour of stage time. So this was much like typical Circle, and not really very much like the weird stuff all through the middle of their newest album "Guillotine" that must be considered some sort of temporary departure from their normal hypno-rock routine. They still have just the four-piece going, so Jyrki Laiho has not rejoined since last year. So just one guitarist now. Enjoyable set, looking forward to yet more discs from these guys. The other bands were also sometimes interesting. Beautiful Leopard were a decent Mogwai-ish post-rock band, and Unhold were a SG-playing, Orange-amped stoner rock band (good heavy sound, lousy vocals though). And there were another couple weird 'progressive hardcore' (for lack of a better word) bands. The so-called headliner were the Distillers (who I'd never heard of), who seemed to me to be Australia's answer to Hole. They drew almost all the 800-1000 people into the tent for a spell, but I don't think the fans were so crazy about them. Rather ordinary IMHO. Ah, Queensryche in Basel was next (following Monday)...they were opposite to Marillion! A really well-designed set of material featuring both the best songs from the new album Tribe (not so terribly bad IMHO!), which are all the odd-numbered ones (opposite to the Star Trek movie phenomenon), and then old material including most of the Mindcrime 'rock-opera.' And they had a *real* Mary, which is cool, as opposed to the video version that they used on occasion when I saw them in the '90s. Chris DeGarmo is not touring with them, so he's only 'half-returned' to the band, but instead had some ugly guy in a terrible shiny-faux-leather outfit who they never introduced. The worst thing was that I thought the sound was terrible...and having seen 10 concerts (or so) in this club already (maybe 1,200 capacity, 800-1,000 there?), I know that this place is not so challenging to get "right." It's *not* echoey like some places I know (eg., Columbus' Newport). But Rockenfield's snare sounded awful...really loud but without any "depth" to it...just featureless thudding. And the bass was a bit too bassy while the guitars a bit too blaring, and so they were too "separated" with a huge gap in the midrange. I moved around a few times to find where it might be better, but it was never good. Plus, the lighting guy kept flooding the front of the stage with blinding bright white lights *all* the damn time, and that was really annoying. I noticed that *he* couldn't see them in his face where the 'island' was farther back, so I bet if he was 10 m farther forward, he wouldn't have been doing it so much! Anyway, I enjoyed it mainly because they played such a good set of material, and themselves put on a nice performance, their crew notwithstanding. Tate was able to sing just about everything still, but he doesn't project the high parts quite so much like he used to, but rather gets lost in the mix rather easily. Then this past weekend I went to Luzern to see a triple bill of Witchcraft, Grand Magus, and Orange Goblin in the Boa Kulturzentrum. These places are always nice 'clubs' to see gigs in. Like Gaswerk in Winterthur, they have both a small intimate room and also a larger floor for maybe 400. Since only about 80 showed, we were in the smaller room, so it suited just fine. I think either/both the first two bands were Swedish, the show didn't start until the EM2004 quarterfinal match between Sweden and Holland was finished (11:40). And as some probably know, it was 0-0 after 120 min., and went (like England-Portugal, and STOP blaming Urs Meier for your own failures! :) BTW, he's from the area of CH just near me, and a friend of mine knows him.) to penalty shootout. So, not only was the show getting started late, but the bandmembers were in a bad mood (Holland won 5-4). Which is ok, if you play loud, angry music! The first two bands were not bad, but I went to see Orange Goblin (aus Liverpool?) primarily. They played most of the new album, and I think one or two from Big Black, but then also "Blue Snow" and "Solarisphere" (from Time-Travelling Blues) at the end of the set, which are both awesome songs. Live they are much more balls-to-the-wall than psychedelic, but I can handle that. The singer isn't as good live as on album, and he overdoes it a little I think, just to be heard. The show ended about 2:30 AM (crazy late for CH!), but I had come earlier in the day and set up a tent at a nearby campground and so I didn't have to stay up all night to wait for the morning train home. Luzern is a really nice city, and so you can't beat going there, especially if there's good music to boot. So, that brings us up to date. But a few other things...has anybody caught these guys (also from Sweden) in the US yet? I've heard their first album from 35 years ago, but not their reunion stuff. They have a few more dates before they go home, so here they are... Trad, Gras och Stenar... 29/6 Neumo's, Seattle, with Kinski among others 1/7 Talking Head, Baltimore with Mighty Flashlight, Big Huge, Entrance 2/7 Tonic, New York, with Bardo Pond and Mighty Flashlight 3/7 TT the Bear, Boston, with Sunburned Hand of the Man and Major Stars ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ And I don't know if everyone here heard (it was posted on Yahoo) that... Note from Jonny Greene (Gong-GAS): "Apparently Tim [Blake] has been involved in a bad car accident and has spent some time in hospital. A speedy recovery to him." Later post from Mr. Blake himself... "Ok Guys ! 1/ Yes, alive.. 2/ Not permanently maimed (yet) 3/ But thoroughly 'shook up' 4/ Connected in Hospital - now that's neat ... merci the French Health service !!! All activity halted 'till September though ... Now what was this about nurses ... ... ? Sacre Bleu!" ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ And then that there's this event planned... THE GONG FAMILY CONVENTION OCTOBER 23rd-24th GLASTONBURY ASSEMBLY ROOMS Basil (Zorch) Here & Now House of Thandoy (with Mike Howlett) Invisible Opera Company of Tibet Joie Hinton (DJ set) Thom the World Poet ...though this lineup is not fully confirmed, so keep checking GAS... and OZIT has released a double Steve Hillage CD of a concert at Deeply Vale 1978, which is worth having IMHO. Although I think I could do without the addition of extra music of Hewitt's own band Tractor, added (I guess) in order to promote himself. Though there was space for it, so maybe it's not such a big deal...you can turn it off when you want. That's all I guess...see (some of you) soon... Grakkl (FAA) From keith.henderson at PSI.CH Tue Jun 29 13:40:46 2004 From: keith.henderson at PSI.CH (Henderson Keith) Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 19:40:46 +0200 Subject: HW: Various Message-ID: Oh, wait, I meant to forward the final tourdate list/info for the following, which everyone nearby should make an effort to see! -more at www.nektarmusic.co.uk Nektar/Caravan No.Amer. tour 2004: 7th Sept - Club Tundra-Syracuse (NY) 8th Sept - The Egg-Albany (NY) 10th Sept - Regent Theatre (Arlington, near Boston) MA 11th Sept - BB Kings, NY 12th Sept - The Birchmere, Alexandria (VA) 15th Sept - Variety Playhouse , Atlanta (GA) 17th Sept - Headliners, Louisville, (KY) 18th Sept - Pops, St Louis (MO) 19th Sept - Martyrs, Chicago (IL) 21st Sept - Toronto Opera House , Toronto, Canada 22nd Sept - Odeon Concert Club, Cleveland (OH) 23rd Sept - Rex Theatre, Pittsburgh (PA) 24th Sept - Keswick Theatre, Glenside, Philadelphia (PA) you will note that we will not now be doing the 14th in Charlotte(will be doing some radio promo instead) and that the St louis date has been changed to Pops. Tix for Regent, BB Kings, Birchmere, Pops are currently available from the venues. Variety will be available from this Friday All other dates will be available in around 10-14 days If anyone still wants direct tickets for the Keswick, Toronto, Cleveland, Chicago or Albany dates, I can still take these via the website at a discounted price with a free programme and no booking fee but only till Sunday 27th -after that, they will need to be bought via the venues Live in NY and more Live in NY will be brought together for a September release and first 1500 will be a special digipack. Pre-sales will start for these in around 2 weeks. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Grakkl (FAA) P.S. Oh, yeah, and Amon Duul II are playing at ProgDay in North Carolina this year. Which is Labor Day weekend usually. I don't know if they will play anywhere else in US though. From nexus at PANIX.COM Tue Jun 29 14:19:04 2004 From: nexus at PANIX.COM (Jeff Berry) Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 14:19:04 -0400 Subject: BRAIN etc In-Reply-To: from "Henderson Keith" at Jun 29, 2004 07:31:24 PM Message-ID: So did anyone make it to the Cellsum show this last weekend? (It was this last weekend, right?) I wanted to go but was out of town. How was it? JB From bernhard.pospiech at T-ONLINE.DE Wed Jun 30 10:41:16 2004 From: bernhard.pospiech at T-ONLINE.DE (bernhard.pospiech) Date: Wed, 30 Jun 2004 16:41:16 +0200 Subject: HW: Various In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi OK, who else for the UK is comming ? Would be great to meet many of you there Contact me offlist if you want to arrange a meeting We can exchange our Handy numbers.... Cheers Bernhard -----Original Message----- From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] On Behalf Of Henderson Keith Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2004 7:31 PM To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET Subject: OT: HW: Various Hi Folks... Very quiet here...suppose that everyone in the US has been waiting in line to see F9/11, and everyone in Europe has been watching football every night, yeah? Anyway, those who have really felt like talking have mostly been posting over at Yahoo, but I still have enough 'loyalty' to this list to mainly post here. I've seen quite a few good concerts in the last several weeks, and am looking forward big time to another Burg Herzberg event, this time with maximal space rock percentage, with Hawkwind, MQB, Guru Guru, et al. And the weather in central Europe so far this summer has been really wonderful, that is, if you prefer a bit cooler temperatures as opposed to last year's oppressive heat (such that the grass died and the dirt went airborne into eyes/ears/nose/throat). It took me a long time to realize that Herzberg is *not* at Wilhelmsthal this year, but rather back to where I think it was in 2002 (and some number of years before, I believe), but neither back to the very original site, that being Burg Herzberg itself (hence the name). But the location has always been somewhere in the same region of Germany, that being essentially the Fulda Gap, of some importance to Cold War historians. Anyway, as I haven't actually been to this particular site, I can't add much to the discussion about how to get there, etc. But the site is pretty informative (if mostly in German), and has both a map of the grounds and an overhead photo, and so that should be helpful. Looks like a better place than Wilhelmsthal actually! The confusion I've had (I guess) is related to the fact that 1) Burg Herzberg is under 'new management' this year (otherwise it would have died after last year), but 2) the old crew (Think Progressive, under Kalle Becker) seems to still be planning to have a festival at the Wilhelmsthal site the weekend *after* the "true" Herzberg, but called something like "Herzberg goes Wilhelmstal" (which is really the renamed (Kloster) Cornberg Festival, which was held just once (in 2001?), and then cancelled both in 2002 and 2003, when Kalle was trying to run both simultaneously). He's got a great lineup for that one planned, including Tull, Amon Duul II, Outskirts Of Infinity, Bevis Frond, On Trial, and others. But I hesitate to make serious plans for it, because of recent history. So I might make a 'game time' decision about staying in central Germany over the four days in between the two fests, based on what I hear at Herzberg. Well, hope to see a few of you there...I know some folx are planning to make it. (Doug P.? Is it going to happen for you? Schade, wenn nicht.) The Finland one might have been fun though, with Dave W. and Lemmy both guesting. Any idea what the "complete" lineup at Herzberg will be? So, lately I've seen... Judas Priest...Rob Halford back on stage with the Priest. Can still sing the old tunes decent enough, and they had him mic'ed up so well, that he wouldn't have been able to hide it if he couldn't hack it. The set was pretty much standard material, nothing new, and so Painkiller songs were the most recent stuff. Beyond the Realms of Death and Victim of Changes both were highlights, and they did an acoustic Diamonds and Rust oddly enough. Strangest thing was that it was over at about 10 PM, and it was still just twilight. The show was indoors (a sporthall with a few skylight windows in the roof) so it was awhile before it even got 'dark' inside. Nearly sold out (Frauenfeld is a *small* town, maybe 10,000) with about 4,000 punters or so, mostly coming from Zuerich and nearby towns I guess. Marillion...well, I gave up on them years ago after that awful Radiation album...but they were coming to Winterthur (also close to Zuerich) and so I thought I'd see if they were still worthwhile. I picked up the new (single CD version of) "Marbles," and I quite liked the first long track and a few other pieces. Which I thought was promising. But the show was very boring...they played a 65-minute first set *all* of "Marbles" material, and although it started out OK, there isn't much energy in the album to translate well to a live setting, so a little bit of that goes a long way. And then after a short break, they came back to play a bunch more laid-back rubbish that I didn't know (so it must have come from Anoraknophobia and the .com albums that I don't own). Finally they played at least "Easter" at the end, which is still the best H-era song, and then started into something else I didn't know for an encore, at which point I had to leave to catch the last train. I suppose they did at least "Market Square Heroes" (or something old) as a second encore, but that wouldn't have done much to save this terrible show. I mean, the band is *all* Hogarth now, with the others just providing atmospheric accompaniment. I saw Fish a couple months ago, and although he hasn't kept up the level of his music to the quality of "Sunsets on Empire" at least he had a nice sampling of not only his solo material through the years, but also a few "original" Marillion songs. Anyway, time to give up on Marillion once and for all now...they're done. Circle...the next night I went down to a small town near Fribourg to see the first night of a three day 'punk/alternative rock' festival. It was called Kilbi-Bad Bonn, and they had both an outdoor tent stage, and an indoor club stage, and the bands alternated such that there was music non-stop from about 7 PM to 2 AM. Circle (from Finland, if you didn't already know) played in the evening on the tent stage. Mostly new material that they had just recorded at a studio in Germany a few days beforehand...only one piece I recognized, but then I think they only did three (or perhaps four) separate pieces during their one hour of stage time. So this was much like typical Circle, and not really very much like the weird stuff all through the middle of their newest album "Guillotine" that must be considered some sort of temporary departure from their normal hypno-rock routine. They still have just the four-piece going, so Jyrki Laiho has not rejoined since last year. So just one guitarist now. Enjoyable set, looking forward to yet more discs from these guys. The other bands were also sometimes interesting. Beautiful Leopard were a decent Mogwai-ish post-rock band, and Unhold were a SG-playing, Orange-amped stoner rock band (good heavy sound, lousy vocals though). And there were another couple weird 'progressive hardcore' (for lack of a better word) bands. The so-called headliner were the Distillers (who I'd never heard of), who seemed to me to be Australia's answer to Hole. They drew almost all the 800-1000 people into the tent for a spell, but I don't think the fans were so crazy about them. Rather ordinary IMHO. Ah, Queensryche in Basel was next (following Monday)...they were opposite to Marillion! A really well-designed set of material featuring both the best songs from the new album Tribe (not so terribly bad IMHO!), which are all the odd-numbered ones (opposite to the Star Trek movie phenomenon), and then old material including most of the Mindcrime 'rock-opera.' And they had a *real* Mary, which is cool, as opposed to the video version that they used on occasion when I saw them in the '90s. Chris DeGarmo is not touring with them, so he's only 'half-returned' to the band, but instead had some ugly guy in a terrible shiny-faux-leather outfit who they never introduced. The worst thing was that I thought the sound was terrible...and having seen 10 concerts (or so) in this club already (maybe 1,200 capacity, 800-1,000 there?), I know that this place is not so challenging to get "right." It's *not* echoey like some places I know (eg., Columbus' Newport). But Rockenfield's snare sounded awful...really loud but without any "depth" to it...just featureless thudding. And the bass was a bit too bassy while the guitars a bit too blaring, and so they were too "separated" with a huge gap in the midrange. I moved around a few times to find where it might be better, but it was never good. Plus, the lighting guy kept flooding the front of the stage with blinding bright white lights *all* the damn time, and that was really annoying. I noticed that *he* couldn't see them in his face where the 'island' was farther back, so I bet if he was 10 m farther forward, he wouldn't have been doing it so much! Anyway, I enjoyed it mainly because they played such a good set of material, and themselves put on a nice performance, their crew notwithstanding. Tate was able to sing just about everything still, but he doesn't project the high parts quite so much like he used to, but rather gets lost in the mix rather easily. Then this past weekend I went to Luzern to see a triple bill of Witchcraft, Grand Magus, and Orange Goblin in the Boa Kulturzentrum. These places are always nice 'clubs' to see gigs in. Like Gaswerk in Winterthur, they have both a small intimate room and also a larger floor for maybe 400. Since only about 80 showed, we were in the smaller room, so it suited just fine. I think either/both the first two bands were Swedish, the show didn't start until the EM2004 quarterfinal match between Sweden and Holland was finished (11:40). And as some probably know, it was 0-0 after 120 min., and went (like England-Portugal, and STOP blaming Urs Meier for your own failures! :) BTW, he's from the area of CH just near me, and a friend of mine knows him.) to penalty shootout. So, not only was the show getting started late, but the bandmembers were in a bad mood (Holland won 5-4). Which is ok, if you play loud, angry music! The first two bands were not bad, but I went to see Orange Goblin (aus Liverpool?) primarily. They played most of the new album, and I think one or two from Big Black, but then also "Blue Snow" and "Solarisphere" (from Time-Travelling Blues) at the end of the set, which are both awesome songs. Live they are much more balls-to-the-wall than psychedelic, but I can handle that. The singer isn't as good live as on album, and he overdoes it a little I think, just to be heard. The show ended about 2:30 AM (crazy late for CH!), but I had come earlier in the day and set up a tent at a nearby campground and so I didn't have to stay up all night to wait for the morning train home. Luzern is a really nice city, and so you can't beat going there, especially if there's good music to boot. So, that brings us up to date. But a few other things...has anybody caught these guys (also from Sweden) in the US yet? I've heard their first album from 35 years ago, but not their reunion stuff. They have a few more dates before they go home, so here they are... Trad, Gras och Stenar... 29/6 Neumo's, Seattle, with Kinski among others 1/7 Talking Head, Baltimore with Mighty Flashlight, Big Huge, Entrance 2/7 Tonic, New York, with Bardo Pond and Mighty Flashlight 3/7 TT the Bear, Boston, with Sunburned Hand of the Man and Major Stars ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ And I don't know if everyone here heard (it was posted on Yahoo) that... Note from Jonny Greene (Gong-GAS): "Apparently Tim [Blake] has been involved in a bad car accident and has spent some time in hospital. A speedy recovery to him." Later post from Mr. Blake himself... "Ok Guys ! 1/ Yes, alive.. 2/ Not permanently maimed (yet) 3/ But thoroughly 'shook up' 4/ Connected in Hospital - now that's neat ... merci the French Health service !!! All activity halted 'till September though ... Now what was this about nurses ... ... ? Sacre Bleu!" ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ And then that there's this event planned... THE GONG FAMILY CONVENTION OCTOBER 23rd-24th GLASTONBURY ASSEMBLY ROOMS Basil (Zorch) Here & Now House of Thandoy (with Mike Howlett) Invisible Opera Company of Tibet Joie Hinton (DJ set) Thom the World Poet ...though this lineup is not fully confirmed, so keep checking GAS... and OZIT has released a double Steve Hillage CD of a concert at Deeply Vale 1978, which is worth having IMHO. Although I think I could do without the addition of extra music of Hewitt's own band Tractor, added (I guess) in order to promote himself. Though there was space for it, so maybe it's not such a big deal...you can turn it off when you want. That's all I guess...see (some of you) soon... Grakkl (FAA) From eddiejobson at HOTMAIL.COM Wed Jun 30 11:01:46 2004 From: eddiejobson at HOTMAIL.COM (eddie jobson) Date: Wed, 30 Jun 2004 15:01:46 +0000 Subject: HW: Various Message-ID: Not me unfortunately. Unless I've missed it, I presume no Hawkfest was arranged this year? Any chance of the band playing Stonehenge next year as it is partially open? Would be nice as a 21 year anniversary since the last time. Eddie. >From: "bernhard.pospiech" >Reply-To: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List >To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET >Subject: Re: HW: Various >Date: Wed, 30 Jun 2004 16:41:16 +0200 > >Hi > >OK, who else for the UK is comming ? >Would be great to meet many of you there > >Contact me offlist if you want to arrange a meeting >We can exchange our Handy numbers.... > > >Cheers >Bernhard > > > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: BOC/Hawkwind Discussion List [mailto:BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET] >On Behalf Of Henderson Keith >Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2004 7:31 PM >To: BOC-L at LISTSERV.ISPNETINC.NET >Subject: OT: HW: Various > > >Hi Folks... > >Very quiet here...suppose that everyone in the US has been waiting in >line to see F9/11, and everyone in Europe has been watching football >every night, yeah? > >Anyway, those who have really felt like talking have mostly been posting >over at Yahoo, but I still have enough 'loyalty' to this list to mainly >post here. > >I've seen quite a few good concerts in the last several weeks, and am >looking forward big time to another Burg Herzberg event, this time with >maximal space rock percentage, with Hawkwind, MQB, Guru Guru, et al. >And the weather in central Europe so far this summer has been really >wonderful, that is, if you prefer a bit cooler temperatures as opposed >to last year's oppressive heat (such that the grass died and the dirt >went airborne into eyes/ears/nose/throat). > >It took me a long time to realize that Herzberg is *not* at Wilhelmsthal >this year, but rather back to where I think it was in 2002 (and some >number of years before, I believe), but neither back to the very >original site, that being Burg Herzberg itself (hence the name). But >the location has always been somewhere in the same region of Germany, >that being essentially the Fulda Gap, of some importance to Cold War >historians. Anyway, as I haven't actually been to this particular site, >I can't add much to the discussion about how to get there, etc. But the >site is pretty informative (if mostly in German), and has both a map of >the grounds and an overhead photo, and so that should be helpful. Looks >like a better place than Wilhelmsthal actually! > >The confusion I've had (I guess) is related to the fact that 1) Burg >Herzberg is under 'new management' this year (otherwise it would have >died after last year), but 2) the old crew (Think Progressive, under >Kalle >Becker) seems to still be planning to have a festival at the >Wilhelmsthal site the weekend *after* the "true" Herzberg, but called >something like "Herzberg goes Wilhelmstal" (which is really the renamed >(Kloster) Cornberg Festival, which was held just once (in 2001?), and >then cancelled both in 2002 and 2003, when Kalle was trying to run both >simultaneously). He's got a great lineup for that one planned, >including Tull, Amon Duul II, Outskirts Of Infinity, Bevis Frond, On >Trial, and others. But I hesitate to make serious plans for it, because >of recent history. So I might make a 'game time' decision about staying >in central Germany over the four days in between the two fests, based on >what I hear at Herzberg. > >Well, hope to see a few of you there...I know some folx are planning to >make it. (Doug P.? Is it going to happen for you? Schade, wenn >nicht.) The Finland one might have been fun though, with Dave W. and >Lemmy both guesting. Any idea what the "complete" lineup at Herzberg >will be? > >So, lately I've seen... >Judas Priest...Rob Halford back on stage with the Priest. Can still >sing the old tunes decent enough, and they had him mic'ed up so well, >that he wouldn't have been able to hide it if he couldn't hack it. The >set was pretty much standard material, nothing new, and so Painkiller >songs were the most recent stuff. Beyond the Realms of Death and Victim >of Changes both were highlights, and they did an acoustic Diamonds and >Rust oddly enough. Strangest thing was that it was over at about 10 PM, >and it was still just twilight. The show was indoors (a sporthall with >a few skylight windows in the roof) so it was awhile before it even got >'dark' inside. Nearly sold out (Frauenfeld is a *small* town, maybe >10,000) with about 4,000 punters or so, mostly coming from Zuerich and >nearby towns I guess. > >Marillion...well, I gave up on them years ago after that awful Radiation >album...but they were coming to Winterthur (also close to Zuerich) and >so I thought I'd see if they were still worthwhile. I picked up the new >(single CD version of) "Marbles," and I quite liked the first long track >and a few other pieces. Which I thought was promising. But the show >was very boring...they played a 65-minute first set *all* of "Marbles" >material, and although it started out OK, there isn't much energy in the >album to translate well to a live setting, so a little bit of that goes >a long way. And then after a short break, they came back to play a bunch >more laid-back rubbish that I didn't know (so it must have come from >Anoraknophobia and the .com albums that I don't own). Finally they >played at least "Easter" at the end, which is still the best H-era song, >and then started into something else I didn't know for an encore, at >which point I had to leave to catch the last train. I suppose they did >at least "Market Square Heroes" (or something old) as a second encore, >but that wouldn't have done much to save this terrible show. I mean, >the band is *all* Hogarth now, with the others just providing >atmospheric accompaniment. I saw Fish a couple months ago, and although >he hasn't kept up the level of his music to the quality of "Sunsets on >Empire" at least he had a nice sampling of not only his solo material >through the years, but also a few "original" Marillion songs. Anyway, >time to give up on Marillion once and for all now...they're done. > >Circle...the next night I went down to a small town near Fribourg to see >the first night of a three day 'punk/alternative rock' festival. It was >called Kilbi-Bad Bonn, and they had both an outdoor tent stage, and an >indoor club stage, and the bands alternated such that there was music >non-stop from about 7 PM to 2 AM. Circle (from Finland, if you didn't >already know) played in the evening on the tent stage. Mostly new >material that they had just recorded at a studio in Germany a few days >beforehand...only one piece I recognized, but then I think they only did >three (or perhaps four) separate pieces during their one hour of stage >time. So this was much like typical Circle, and not really very much >like the weird stuff all through the middle of their newest album >"Guillotine" that must be considered some sort of temporary departure >from their normal hypno-rock routine. They still have just the >four-piece going, so Jyrki Laiho has not rejoined since last year. So >just one guitarist now. Enjoyable set, looking forward to yet more >discs from these guys. The other bands were also sometimes interesting. >Beautiful Leopard were a decent Mogwai-ish post-rock band, and Unhold >were a SG-playing, Orange-amped stoner rock band (good heavy sound, >lousy vocals though). And there were another couple weird 'progressive >hardcore' (for lack of a better word) bands. The so-called headliner >were the Distillers (who I'd never heard of), who seemed to me to be >Australia's answer to Hole. They drew almost all the 800-1000 people >into the tent for a spell, but I don't think the fans were so crazy >about them. Rather ordinary IMHO. > >Ah, Queensryche in Basel was next (following Monday)...they were >opposite to Marillion! A really well-designed set of material featuring >both the best songs from the new album Tribe (not so terribly bad >IMHO!), which are all the odd-numbered ones (opposite to the Star Trek >movie phenomenon), and then old material including most of the Mindcrime >'rock-opera.' And they had a >*real* Mary, which is cool, as opposed to the video version that they >used on occasion when I saw them in the '90s. Chris DeGarmo is not >touring with them, so he's only 'half-returned' to the band, but instead >had some ugly >guy in a terrible shiny-faux-leather outfit who they never introduced. >The >worst thing was that I thought the sound was terrible...and having seen >10 concerts (or so) in this club already (maybe 1,200 capacity, >800-1,000 there?), I know that this place is not so challenging to get >"right." It's >*not* echoey like some places I know (eg., Columbus' Newport). But >Rockenfield's snare sounded awful...really loud but without any "depth" >to it...just featureless thudding. And the bass was a bit too bassy >while the guitars a bit too blaring, and so they were too "separated" >with a huge gap in the midrange. I moved around a few times to find >where it might be better, but it was never good. Plus, the lighting guy >kept flooding the front of the stage with blinding bright white lights >*all* the damn time, and that was really annoying. I noticed that *he* >couldn't see them in his face where the 'island' was farther back, so I >bet if he was 10 m farther forward, he wouldn't have been doing it so >much! Anyway, I enjoyed it mainly because they played such a good set >of material, and themselves put on a nice performance, their crew >notwithstanding. Tate was able to sing just about everything still, but >he doesn't project the high parts quite so much like he used to, but >rather gets lost in the mix rather easily. > >Then this past weekend I went to Luzern to see a triple bill of >Witchcraft, Grand Magus, and Orange Goblin in the Boa Kulturzentrum. >These places are always nice 'clubs' to see gigs in. Like Gaswerk in >Winterthur, they have both a small intimate room and also a larger floor >for maybe 400. Since only about 80 showed, we were in the smaller room, >so it suited just fine. I think either/both the first two bands were >Swedish, the show didn't start until the EM2004 quarterfinal match >between Sweden and Holland was finished (11:40). And as some probably >know, it was 0-0 after 120 min., and went (like England-Portugal, and >STOP blaming Urs Meier for your own failures! :) BTW, he's from the area >of CH just near me, and a friend of mine knows him.) to penalty >shootout. So, not only was the show getting started late, but the >bandmembers were in a bad mood (Holland won 5-4). Which is ok, if you >play loud, angry music! The first two bands were not bad, but I went to >see Orange Goblin (aus Liverpool?) primarily. They played most of the >new album, and I think one or two from Big Black, but then also "Blue >Snow" and "Solarisphere" (from Time-Travelling Blues) at the end of the >set, which are both awesome songs. Live they are much more >balls-to-the-wall than psychedelic, but I can handle that. The singer >isn't as good live as on album, and he overdoes it a little I think, >just to be heard. The show ended about 2:30 AM (crazy late for CH!), >but I had come earlier in the day and set up a tent at a nearby >campground and so I didn't have to stay up all night to wait for the >morning train home. Luzern is a really nice city, and so you can't beat >going there, especially if there's good music to boot. > >So, that brings us up to date. But a few other things...has anybody >caught these guys (also from Sweden) in the US yet? I've heard their >first album from 35 years ago, but not their reunion stuff. They have a >few more dates before they go home, so here they are... > >Trad, Gras och Stenar... >29/6 Neumo's, Seattle, with Kinski among others >1/7 Talking Head, Baltimore with Mighty Flashlight, Big Huge, Entrance >2/7 Tonic, New York, with Bardo Pond and Mighty Flashlight 3/7 TT the >Bear, Boston, with Sunburned Hand of the Man and Major Stars >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >And I don't know if everyone here heard (it was posted on Yahoo) that... > >Note from Jonny Greene (Gong-GAS): >"Apparently Tim [Blake] has been involved in a bad car accident and has >spent some time in hospital. A speedy recovery to him." > >Later post from Mr. Blake himself... >"Ok Guys ! >1/ Yes, alive.. >2/ Not permanently maimed (yet) >3/ But thoroughly 'shook up' >4/ Connected in Hospital - now that's neat ... merci the French Health >service !!! > >All activity halted 'till September though ... > >Now what was this about nurses ... ... ? >Sacre Bleu!" >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >And then that there's this event planned... > >THE GONG FAMILY CONVENTION OCTOBER 23rd-24th GLASTONBURY ASSEMBLY ROOMS >Basil (Zorch) Here & Now House of Thandoy (with Mike Howlett) Invisible >Opera Company of Tibet Joie Hinton (DJ set) Thom the World Poet > >...though this lineup is not fully confirmed, so keep checking GAS... > >and OZIT has released a double Steve Hillage CD of a concert at Deeply >Vale 1978, which is worth having IMHO. Although I think I could do >without the addition of extra music of Hewitt's own band Tractor, added >(I guess) in order to promote himself. Though there was space for it, >so maybe it's not such a big deal...you can turn it off when you want. > >That's all I guess...see (some of you) soon... > >Grakkl (FAA) From fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK Wed Jun 30 11:19:26 2004 From: fofp at HOLYROOD.ED.AC.UK (M Holmes) Date: Wed, 30 Jun 2004 16:19:26 +0100 Subject: HW: Various In-Reply-To: bernhard.pospiech's message of Wed, 30 Jun 2004 16:41:16 +0200 Message-ID: bernhard.pospiech writes: > OK, who else for the UK is comming ? > Would be great to meet many of you there > > Contact me offlist if you want to arrange a meeting > We can exchange our Handy numbers.... I'll be there. I dunno if Lucy's phone works in Germany but I could give you the number. It'd be a good plan to decide where, if we're going to camp together... Mike From jmajk at INDY.RR.COM Wed Jun 30 11:51:49 2004 From: jmajk at INDY.RR.COM (John Majka) Date: Wed, 30 Jun 2004 10:51:49 -0500 Subject: HW: Various Message-ID: Are there any London HW dates on the horizon? John Majka